Entreq Tellus grounding

[Mossback]

Edward is my friend. I assumed you mean the HiFi store owner Edward.

Yes, my error! I assumed you were Edward the gentleman who owns the store in Richmond.
Anyway it's nice to know you Edward.

 

[marty]

Dumb question - why doesn't anyone measure EMI before buying one of these boxes. Isn't there an easy way to tell if my system has bad RF/EMI issues?

Also, has anyone measured RF/EMI pre and post insertion of the Entreq or Troy?

http://www.dtbtest.com/EMI-EMC-electric.aspx#site2

Of course, these things can be tested. My guess is that doing this in a meaningful way would not be cheap. You can certainly bring your gear to them, or alternatively, it appears that Dayton T. Brown can also do a site visit to test your system. If they can test EMI emissions on a 10 car train, they can surely test your stereo system. I would surely have fun playing with their toys!

 

[Calle_jr]

Of course, these things can be tested.

Well, sure.
It's just to rent a shielded anechoic chamber for a few days, move my hifi system there, borrow some boxes and measure to check if the boxes are a really necessary investment.
I also need to figure out;
1. What are the differences between the test setup and my actual setup at home, and what do these differences mean?
2. What will be my criteria for the measurements, when do I say a box is efficient or non efficient?

 

[Barry2013]

What a helpful and practical perspective Calle.

 

[Jazzhead]

Hi Barry , how you getting along with the Infinity cables . Any comparisons to the old line will be most welcome . Thanks

 

[Calle_jr]

What a helpful and practical perspective Calle.

Sorry for that.
It's just that I so often see categorical statements involving measurements.
Most people (incl myself) don't even know what to measure. Even less what is good or bad.

In this case, it would be a good thing to record a silent groove on an oscilloscope first without then with a box, and study that in the frequency domain.
Maybe...

 

[Mike Lavigne]

this reminds me of how my son-in-law, the PhD in Physics who ran a research team, reacted when I asked him if he could maybe test an audio process 'tweak' I was involved with. he said; " sure; we would just need a 'grant' of a few hundred thousand dollars for the lab time to test it." and then he said "that his findings (if? there was any to be found) might not relate to the actual question I had." the scientific method is not predictable.

btw; he did say that this 'tweak' I was onto was something he had also encountered in his post doc research, and he had made allowances for it's effect but he was not sure why it worked as it did. but finding a definitive answer to my question was a whole different thing.

he has a firm grasp on knowing that he does not even know what he does not know. sometimes you are lucky to get to the spot where you can define the right questions to ask. which is a good place to start.

 

[Barry2013]

Thanks Jazzhead.
Listening now and it's really only now that I am able to give a considered view.
As you know it was a really a three part upgrade. Apollo Infinity speaker cables replacing the biwire Challengers, Atlantis /Apollo 3V earth cables into an Olympus 10 replacing a 1394 cable on the Paganini DAC which a few days earlier had replaced the Puccini used as a DAC with the Scarlatti Transport.
First listening Ttuesday) after all those changes was an improvement but it was obvious that the system needed time to settle. Not surprising really but I suppose we always hope for more.
Wednesday the Magnum Dynalab 109 tuner on Radio 3 FM was sounding better than ever. Completely silent background and voices of the presenters so clear and in the room. Instrumental timbre and placing very impressive. More organic sound with better bass, treble and singers' words clearer. The Apollo Infinity were without question a substantial improvement on the Challenger biwires.
The digital side wasn't delivering the same benefits. Played some SACDs late last night and sound was disappointing,Moved the Wave Kinetics footers from under the Scarlatti clock to under the Pganini DAC and the Ultra SSs to the clock. Progress but getting late and decided to see how things were today.
Started with Radio 3 FM and Vitus SIA 025 in class A. Sounded delightful so listened for a couple of hours to allow the amp to get properly warmed up.
Dug out my Nordost Test disc and played the degauss and burn in tracks prior to iplaying any cds..Started with he Julia Fischer SACD of Bach Partitas. Huge relief. The DCS analogue like sound emerged from the speakers as desired. Lovely realistic string tones, imaging and unadulterated by any background noise. Later in the afternoon returned to the Dire Straits SACD Brothers in Arms which had disappointed the night before.A big improvement in the sound quality. Clean organic taut bass with real power and everything cohering as it should.
Been listening and still am to the Paul Simon Graceland Redbook CD which is something of a favourite and which I have on vinyl but can't play as the Rock V needs a service.Hopefully to be done soon. I haven't heard that CD sound so good before and not feeling deprived at the absence of the vinyl.Diamonds on the Souls of Their Shoes now playing and sounding gorgeous. The bass guitar is so full and tuneful and the vocal backing so involving.
So now a happy bunny after a somewhat anxious couple of days,
I am satisfied that the Apollo Infinity speaker cables live up to their billing and are a great buy. I say that because the tuner clearly benefitted from the off and just got better. Significantly, it was sitting on four Wave Kinetics footers throughout as was the Scarlatti Transport.
The Paganini DAC I conclude much prefers the the Wave Kinetics to the Ultra SSs.
The Atlanis Dual AES cables with Infinity connectors and the Olympus 10 I am pretty sure needed to burn in and for the system to settle after all the changes. Now sounding very good indeed and no hesitation in recommending them.
I hope that is helpful to you and other members. They are all great cables and IMHO real value for money. They have complemented and lifted my system to clearly audible new heights of musicality, transparency and fidelity. But the experience has reinforced the importance of not rushing to judgement immediately after first installation. Whilst the Poseidon/Atlantis earth cable negative speaker terminal grounding benefits were apparent from the off this much bigger upgrade has needed time for the system to settle after the disruption and for the cables to burn in. It has also reinforced the merits of the Wave Kinetics footers for which I am very grateful to Mike who introduced me to them

 

[Barry2013]

Day 4 lunchtime
We have lift off. Everything has now snapped into focus.Sounding so poised and really opened up. Radio 3 FM composer of the week Bellinis's operas with Pavarotti, Carreras and Sutherland. Soundstage extending way back beyond the rear wall and elsewhere as intended. Head instinctively swaying in time with the arias. Vocal inflections and nuances clearly apparent. Would have brought a smile to bonzo's face. Took me back to last year's Munich show and the big Tidal speakers. (Agorias I think).
Will play some cds later but the combination of these latest Entreq Infinity cables upgrade is magical and I don't want to rush in on the cds. Need to set the scene for a serious and properly organised listening session.

 

[Jazzhead]

Appreciate the feedback Barry . Any chance you can segregate the effect of the Infinity Eartha to the older line ?

 

[Barry2013]

No I'm afraid not Jazzhead. Both the cables and the connectors were upgraded at the same time plus the Olympus 10 on the new Atlantis Infinity Dual AES/Apollo 3.5V earth cable.
The nearest comparison is the tuner with the speakers cables where the Apollo Infinity replaced the Challengers. That sounds so much better as noted earlier and I am satisfied that the Infinity upgrade to the Apollo speaker cables has played a big part.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

No I'm afraid not Jazzhead. Both the cables and the connectors were upgraded at the same time plus the Olympus 10 on the new Atlantis Infinity Dual AES/Apollo 3.5V earth cable.
The nearest comparison is the tuner with the speakers cables where the Apollo Infinity replaced the Challengers. That sounds so much better as noted earlier and I am satisfied that the Infinity upgrade to the Apollo speaker cables has played a big part.

I am scheduled to receive my 8 Infinity upgraded cables on Wednesday, and 4 of them will return to the exact spots of the previous versions still in place. and other than the Infinity upgrade, those 4 are the same configurations.

to the degree possible I will try to comment. I need to ship the replaced cables back once the others are received.....but it will be an immediate switch situation as much as that works for the ramping up nature of grounding. OTOH this is my bass tower amps and my negative speaker terminal grounding, both of which have had quite definitive contributions.

 

[LL21]

I am scheduled to receive my 8 Infinity upgraded cables on Wednesday, and 4 of them will return to the exact spots of the previous versions still in place. and other than the Infinity upgrade, those 4 are the same configurations.

to the degree possible I will try to comment. I need to ship the replaced cables back once the others are received.....but it will be an immediate switch situation as much as that works for the ramping up nature of grounding. OTOH this is my bass tower amps and my negative speaker terminal grounding, both of which have had quite definitive contributions.

look forward to reading all about this one!

 

[Barry2013]

I am scheduled to receive my 8 Infinity upgraded cables on Wednesday, and 4 of them will return to the exact spots of the previous versions still in place. and other than the Infinity upgrade, those 4 are the same configurations.

to the degree possible I will try to comment. I need to ship the replaced cables back once the others are received.....but it will be an immediate switch situation as much as that works for the ramping up nature of grounding. OTOH this is my bass tower amps and my negative speaker terminal grounding, both of which have had quite definitive contributions.

Thanks Mike
I'll look forward to reading how it goes.
I've been turning my mind as to how I go about upgrading my 15 earth cables and Apollo i/cs. Present thinking is to prioritise the Atlantis/Poseidon negative speaker terminals as in your case that was a very successful upgrade.

 

[KeithR]

There is a very easy and reliable way Keith which most Entreq/Tripoint users have employed.
You just have to listen to your system with and without.
I'm not being smart ass or, heavens forbid, trying to revive past controversies but in my experience it really is as simple as that.

Sorry, no thanks as quite frankly- rf/emi could very well be increased with something like this.

Why hasn't Entec or Tripoint posted rf or emi rejection data like Shunyata? Don't they have the tools to do so?

 

[Barry2013]

Entreq Infinity Day 9
The Apollo Infinity speaker cables, Atlantis Dual AES/Apollo Infinity earth and Olympu 10 have now really settled in and the system has recovered from the disruption of the installation.
They really started to sing on CD on day 5. I was playing the Kraftwerk Computer World and Autobahn cds and a liitle way in began to wonder if they were the same cds I had played in the past. Bass immeaurably better, a previously unheard symphonic quality and a poignancy to the vocals.Some of this improvement was undoubtedly due to the dual AES operation on the Scarlatti transport, word clock and Paganini DAC which prior to day 1 had been on a stock 1394 configuration. That said the sound on FM through the Magnum Dynalab 109 tuner also improved significantly which can only be attributed to the speaker cables.
The new speaker cables have really allowed the DCS combo to show off its very considerable capabilities. There is a vibrancy, sparkle and energy to the sound which was particularly evident on some Rolling Stones cds. Some Girls came over with all the sultry ambience and aggression of the recording and the Texas country rock. On the Bach cello concertos Paul Tortellier's cello had real body and expressiveness not previously heard.
I'm still working my way through my cds but the improvement in sound quality on Red Book is particularly evident and SACDs sound even more analogue like.
These are genuine high end cables at a realistic price - about £24k with the Olympus 10 - but IMHO extremely good value. I have no experience of the upper ranges of the Transparent Audio/Tara Labs cables costing twice as much or more but in the context of a comprehensively Entrequed system these cables really deliver and deserve to be auditioned.
I've not been able to AB the new Infinity connectors separate from the cable upgrade but I am confident that the expected modest cost of upgrading owners' existing cables will be well worth it.The limited reports I have heard have all been very enthusiastic and have come from people whose judgement I can trust. I will certainly be upgrading mine, probably in stages, and I am looking forward to the results.

 

[caliaripaolo]

Entreq Infinity Day 9
The Apollo Infinity speaker cables, Atlantis Dual AES/Apollo Infinity earth and Olympu 10 have now really settled in and the system has recovered from the disruption of the installation.
They really started to sing on CD on day 5. I was playing the Kraftwerk Computer World and Autobahn cds and a liitle way in began to wonder if they were the same cds I had played in the past. Bass immeaurably better, a previously unheard symphonic quality and a poignancy to the vocals.Some of this improvement was undoubtedly due to the dual AES operation on the Scarlatti transport, word clock and Paganini DAC which prior to day 1 had been on a stock 1394 configuration. That said the sound on FM through the Magnum Dynalab 109 tuner also improved significantly which can only be attributed to the speaker cables.
The new speaker cables have really allowed the DCS combo to show off its very considerable capabilities. There is a vibrancy, sparkle and energy to the sound which was particularly evident on some Rolling Stones cds. Some Girls came over with all the sultry ambience and aggression of the recording and the Texas country rock. On the Bach cello concertos Paul Tortellier's cello had real body and expressiveness not previously heard.
I'm still working my way through my cds but the improvement in sound quality on Red Book is particularly evident and SACDs sound even more analogue like.
These are genuine high end cables at a realistic price - about £24k with the Olympus 10 - but IMHO extremely good value. I have no experience of the upper ranges of the Transparent Audio/Tara Labs cables costing twice as much or more but in the context of a comprehensively Entrequed system these cables really deliver and deserve to be auditioned.
I've not been able to AB the new Infinity connectors separate from the cable upgrade but I am confident that the expected modest cost of upgrading owners' existing cables will be well worth it.The limited reports I have heard have all been very enthusiastic and have come from people whose judgement I can trust. I will certainly be upgrading mine, probably in stages, and I am looking forward to the results.

Great feedback Barry!!!
Congratulations for continuing upgrade on your grounding journey

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Entreq Infinity Day 9
The Apollo Infinity speaker cables, Atlantis Dual AES/Apollo Infinity earth and Olympu 10 have now really settled in and the system has recovered from the disruption of the installation.
They really started to sing on CD on day 5. I was playing the Kraftwerk Computer World and Autobahn cds and a liitle way in began to wonder if they were the same cds I had played in the past. Bass immeaurably better, a previously unheard symphonic quality and a poignancy to the vocals.Some of this improvement was undoubtedly due to the dual AES operation on the Scarlatti transport, word clock and Paganini DAC which prior to day 1 had been on a stock 1394 configuration. That said the sound on FM through the Magnum Dynalab 109 tuner also improved significantly which can only be attributed to the speaker cables.
The new speaker cables have really allowed the DCS combo to show off its very considerable capabilities. There is a vibrancy, sparkle and energy to the sound which was particularly evident on some Rolling Stones cds. Some Girls came over with all the sultry ambience and aggression of the recording and the Texas country rock. On the Bach cello concertos Paul Tortellier's cello had real body and expressiveness not previously heard.
I'm still working my way through my cds but the improvement in sound quality on Red Book is particularly evident and SACDs sound even more analogue like.
These are genuine high end cables at a realistic price - about £24k with the Olympus 10 - but IMHO extremely good value. I have no experience of the upper ranges of the Transparent Audio/Tara Labs cables costing twice as much or more but in the context of a comprehensively Entrequed system these cables really deliver and deserve to be auditioned.
I've not been able to AB the new Infinity connectors separate from the cable upgrade but I am confident that the expected modest cost of upgrading owners' existing cables will be well worth it.The limited reports I have heard have all been very enthusiastic and have come from people whose judgement I can trust. I will certainly be upgrading mine, probably in stages, and I am looking forward to the results.

thanks Barry, for the update. when I hear "vibrancy, sparkle and energy" increasing that is what gets my attention.

my Infinity level upgraded cables got delayed a day in customs, but are now released and are scheduled to arrive tomorrow.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

the Infinity upgraded cables arrived today, about 90 minutes ago I finished swapping the cables at the amp end, where I have the Poseidon and -3- Atlantic Minumus's, with 2 Atlantic Eartha 1.5m spades are on the negative speaker terminals, and -2- Discover ground 4m spades are connected to my bass tower amps. those 4 cables are now the Infinity line level. I've not yet done anything with the Silver Tellus, the 2 Atlantic Eartha, and 2 Apollo Eartha cables which are headed for my Studers. likely tomorrow.

the new 'hooks' instead of the infuriating Entreq spades are much appreciated and made it easier to connect things. good move Entreq.

at first blush with the Entreq Infinity verses previous versions it was more than I expected......but.....this is how it has gone with anything I've done with the amps, speakers, and grounding.

Barry, you said it right-on.....

vibrancy, sparkle and energy

the blacker backgrounds are obvious (things 'pop' more), and a little more inner texture, shimmer, and delicacy. less processed. more expressive vocals. more vivid colors and hues. the piano hammer strike is more lively and harmonically full. similar with strings. can't yet say the bass is different, except a little bit more forward lean and swing to the music. I need to listen more with more types of music.

these are all little things which make differences in immersion into the flow of the music. the music seems to be making more of a pull for my attention.

YMMV, just my 2 cents, it's early......and all that stuff.

 

[Barry2013]

Many thanks Mike for your prompt feedback on the Infinity earth cables.
Will really look forward to your next post after you've hooked up the rest of the cables and had more listening time.