This is an interesting comparison, Peter. It's especially interesting because the circuits are so different: The L1 is a solid-state pre-amp (with tube power supply) and the LL1 is all tube.
This is an interesting comparison, Peter. It's especially interesting because the circuits are so different: The L1 is a solid-state pre-amp (with tube power supply) and the LL1 is all tube.
Am i right to assume your four box version is having problems and out for repair ? Like my own tubed phono is too![]()
I didn’t think the M1.1 sounded very good. It’s a hybrid and not pure SS… The ML2s sounded good the one time I heard them. I agree with Ron, though it is interesting that one is tube and one is SS but with a tube power supply…most curious.I don’t know Ron. My judgment is based on listening and my reference target. Vladimir Lamm was a genius and as you know, I really liked his solid state M1.1 amplifiers. His stuff all sounds natural and is the basis for this thread. Different models with different designs and implementation, simply present slightly different degrees of natural sound.
Romy, the Cat writes about this preamp and describes what he calls the X Factor. David Karmeli describes this elusive quality as some bit of magic. It is difficult to describe, but when you hear it, you know.
I didn’t think the M1.1 sounded very good. It’s a hybrid and not pure SS… The ML2s sounded good the one time I heard them. I agree with Ron, though it is interesting that one is tube and one is SS but with a tube power supply…most curious.
Nice score Peter. I suspect the L1 is closer to L2 rather than your all tube pre. That means the 6c19p is super critical, make sure it is fresh. Is there any area that you prefer the L1 to your reference pre?
Romy, the Cat writes about this preamp and describes what he calls the X Factor. David Karmeli describes this elusive quality as some bit of magic. It is difficult to describe, but when you hear it, you know.
@PeterA Can I ask, what are the dimensions of your room?
Anyone have any tips of where/how to hear a pair of Vitavox in the UK? I know they were British made, but also seem pretty rare these days.
@PeterA Can I ask, what are the dimensions of your room?
Anyone have any tips of where/how to hear a pair of Vitavox in the UK? I know they were British made, but also seem pretty rare these days.
Sure, I saw that, too, as it comes up first on Google. It's a bit hard to say how active they are. They seem to be making reproduction drivers, though possibly with the same tools, same parts, etc. I'm sometimes a little skeptical of these resurrected or semi-resurrected brands, as they can kind of come and go, and I've never seen coverage of a new-build Vitavox in the audio press, etc.Vitavox Hifi - Vitavox continues to build on this illustrious history hand crafting components to power some of the world's finest loudspeaker systems
For over three quarters of a century the name Vitavox has stood for the finest quality in sound reproduction; a reputation built on a dedication to excellence in design and engineering that has remained undiminished. Today, Vitavox continues to build on this illustrious history; hand crafting...www.vitavoxhifi.co.uk
Sure, I saw that, too, as it comes up first on Google. It's a bit hard to say how active they are. They seem to be making reproduction drivers, though possibly with the same tools, same parts, etc. I'm sometimes a little skeptical of these resurrected or semi-resurrected brands, as they can kind of come and go, and I've never seen coverage of a new-build Vitavox in the audio press, etc.
But could be they're legit and in it for the long haul. I guess I was more curious about original Vitavox, but I'll drop these folks a line.
Just to be clear (and not meaning to kill the vibe) the "X Factor' is the distortion signature. If its all lower ordered harmonics the equipment will be musical.Lamm's mathematical models of human hearing derived from blind listening tests are component neutral. This "X Factor" or magic or however you name the Lamm signature is present across his entire line of phonostages, linestages and amps.. The fundamental character of "the Lamm sound", imo, does not change as you move from lower tier to the top models; it simply becomes more sophisticated and revealing.
Just to be clear (and not meaning to kill the vibe) the "X Factor' is the distortion signature. If its all lower ordered harmonics the equipment will be musical.
i think i get what you mean in a positive sense........when the mic'ing and ensemble size and recording venue size is similar? right? small combo classical? right? or something appropriate for your living room size?My vibe is to assemble a system that reminds me of the experience of listening to real music in my living room.
i think i get what you mean in a positive sense........when the mic'ing and ensemble size and recording venue size is similar? right? small combo classical? right? or something appropriate for your living room size?
otherwise wouldn't you want the experience to resemble the sound of live music according to the venue and ideal listening position for that recording? and they are pretty much all different. so if they all "sounded like listening to real music in your living room" that would be a problem? right?
They are similar; the tube Lamm equipment we've had in the shop was quite good. Owing to our use a balanced lines and more direct-coupling, both at the output of our balanced tube preamps and also our tube power amplifiers, our gear was more transparent by comparison.Ralph, I have only heard your amplifiers in a couple systems at shows but never done a direct comparison. I’m sure your products sound different. How would you say the distortion signatures differ between the two products?
My vibe is to assemble a system that reminds me of the experience of listening to real music in my living room.
the hybrids, like Brad said, aren’t good. They were by far the least good sounding with Sigma MAAT and Toni (TZBC) had them as well, he moved on from them and both of us had a similar impression in different systems. Maybe they work with very inefficient speakers. i haven’t heard any good hybrid except for the thrax hybrid. The Ypsilon hybrid was also mediocre.Lamm's mathematical models of human hearing derived from blind listening tests are component neutral. This "X Factor" or magic or however you name the Lamm signature is present across his entire line of phonostages, linestages and amps..
They are similar; the tube Lamm equipment we've had in the shop was quite good. Owing to our use a balanced lines and more direct-coupling, both at the output of our balanced tube preamps and also our tube power amplifiers, our gear was more transparent by comparison.
Our equipment tends to have a prominent 3rd harmonic rather than the 2nd. The 3rd appears in our gear at a level a bit less than the 3rd does in a typical SET. So as a result the amps tend to make only about 0.5 to 1% THD at full power (compare with 10% for almost any SET at clipping; many SETs are rated below clipping to avoid this value being published) with IMD much less -about 0.05% or less. The 3rd is treated by the ear the same as the 2nd (properly functioning tape machines make a 3rd harmonic also, just for perspective).