Amp recommendation for Focal Maestro

[Believe High Fidelity]

i'm trying to see if everything plug correctly
i unplugged everything

why Devialet?
because it's one box for everything
and soundstageultra review plug it with Magico Q7 (i think much more demanding then my speakers)
and like it very much.

i'm afraid that because i don't really know what i'm doing
and i have mixed of components
maybe for me it's better to have amp, Pre and DAC in one simple box.
i'm not sure.

SM-101 amps:
1. i can choose Class A or Class AB , should i choose Class AB because need more power?

2. see the photos
the amp with Red RCA should be the Right amp?
there is two separate speakers outputs , which one i should choose?

Cables:
speakers: Cardas clear
Amps to Pre: Cardas Clear XLR
Pre to DAC: Tara 0.8 XLR
power cords:
amps: Purist Canorus (both plug to the same wall outlet)
Pre: Tara (not sure what model)
DAC: Zitron Alpha Digital

View attachment 30747View attachment 30748

I think I am understanding now..

There are not a lot of speakers that go below 4ohms these days so the Q7 compared to the Maestro is an easier load for the amplifier to drive. There are a handful of speakers that really go low like the Apogee's of which special designs were created just for them (Krell MSA or Rowland Mk7) that go down to 2ohms or less.

Since the speaker rated at 93db it isnt about having more watts like 1000 in the Devialet. You dont need watts as much as current from a beefy power design.

I dont see anything wrong with your source equipment. If you have the voltage needed to get full power out of the Vitus (which you do) and you want to keep the speakers you need the right amplification.


As suggested Aries Cerat 100% of the portfolio is stable in Class A down to not 4, not 2 not even 1, but .5ohms! If you sitting distance is 1-2M I would suggest a SET and if further away I would go with a PP design.

What you are looking for is Current

 

[pelo911]

my mistake , it's Black wool
it's not outside
i thought maybe the previous owner add it to reduce the bass.
maybe other Maestro owner can tell if he also have it.

i'm from Houston
no dealer of Focal or Magico here
i wish.

i don't think anything wrong with the speaker
maybe the system not the best to support the speakers
or computer setting is wrong
or this is the best those speaker can be and need better ones.

BTW ,
i can't control the volume from the computer
only with the Pre remote
that's normal?

 

[pelo911]

I think I am understanding now..

There are not a lot of speakers that go below 4ohms these days so the Q7 compared to the Maestro is an easier load for the amplifier to drive. There are a handful of speakers that really go low like the Apogee's of which special designs were created just for them (Krell MSA or Rowland Mk7) that go down to 2ohms or less.

Since the speaker rated at 93db it isnt about having more watts like 1000 in the Devialet. You dont need watts as much as current from a beefy power design.

I dont see anything wrong with your source equipment. If you have the voltage needed to get full power out of the Vitus (which you do) and you want to keep the speakers you need the right amplification.


As suggested Aries Cerat 100% of the portfolio is stable in Class A down to not 4, not 2 not even 1, but .5ohms! If you sitting distance is 1-2M I would suggest a SET and if further away I would go with a PP design.

What you are looking for is Current

thanks for you reply
so they are efficient and easy to drive , 93db
but in some rare situation the drop down really bad under 2 ohm?

and the Vitus don't have the Damping / current / grip for the Maestro?

 

[LL21]

my mistake , it's Black wool
it's not outside
i thought maybe the previous owner add it to reduce the bass.
maybe other Maestro owner can tell if he also have it.

i'm from Houston
no dealer of Focal or Magico here
i wish.

i don't think anything wrong with the speaker
maybe the system not the best to support the speakers
or computer setting is wrong
or this is the best those speaker can be and need better ones.

BTW ,
i can't control the volume from the computer
only with the Pre remote
that's normal?

Isnt Albert Porter from Dallas? Not too close, but certainly a very experienced audiophile and a fellow owner of Focal speakers. I have to imagine there is a dealer somewhere in TX who can at least talk you through some of your observations to at least check the 'obvious' potential problems you may be having.

 

[Believe High Fidelity]

Isnt Albert Porter from Dallas? Not too close, but certainly a very experienced audiophile and a fellow owner of Focal speakers. I have to imagine there is a dealer somewhere in TX who can at least talk you through some of your observations to at least check the 'obvious' potential problems you may be having.

Since I am in Austin I could make the trip down, but I have no gear to bring until mid Feb

 

[Believe High Fidelity]

thanks for you reply
so they are efficient and easy to drive , 93db
but in some rare situation the drop down really bad under 2 ohm?/QUOTE]

Correct

and the Vitus don't have the Damping / current / grip for the Maestro?

As a former Vitus dealer it isn't that the amp doesnt have current or grip it isn't designed to handle 1-2 ohm loads as the large majority of the speakers do not go below 4 ohms. Once my client has finished with the demo system I can make a trip out to Houston to take a look at your system

 

[pelo911]

thanks for you reply
so they are efficient and easy to drive , 93db
but in some rare situation the drop down really bad under 2 ohm?/QUOTE]

Correct



As a former Vitus dealer it isn't that the amp doesnt have current or grip it isn't designed to handle 1-2 ohm loads as the large majority of the speakers do not go below 4 ohms. Once my client has finished with the demo system I can make a trip out to Houston to take a look at your system

thanks for your offer
what system you think can work?

check that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qflo-35Jw4k

Vitus integrated amp with Maestro
if someone was in this show
can tell us how i was sound

 

[Believe High Fidelity]

thanks for your offer
what system you think can work?

check that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qflo-35Jw4k

Vitus integrated amp with Maestro
if someone was in this show
can tell us how i was sound

I have Concero 65 and Incito Preamp we can test. Concero monos do 65W Class A DHT SET and the Incito is 10V to drive the amps to full power. Should see what your speakers are really capable of

 

[pelo911]

I have Concero 65 and Incito Preamp we can test. Concero monos do 65W Class A DHT SET and the Incito is 10V to drive the amps to full power. Should see what your speakers are really capable of

my Vitus have more power


what do you think about Diablo 300?
come also with DAC
and might have power to drive it
can work at 2 ohm

 

[KeithR]

Dear Pelo,

This is the same question that you have asked now on every single forum known to man for 5 years, lol.

I own the Maestros and they are not bass light or dull sounding at all. If anything, they can lean towards brightness with inept amplification. I recommend something with high current and stiff power supply that will allow it to be happy with low impedance.

+1. Dying laughing at folks still trying to help.

 

[flyer]

As mentioned above, it is not necessarily power that you need but instant and sufficient current delivery to ensure a linear control of the speaker which is really really challenging due to the impedance characteristics. The Concero has that current. Regarding the seemingly limited power of 65 W, mind you that this is a pure and real Single Ended Triode mount.

There are many theories to what the equivalent in solid state is but I think that I am cautious to say that double that amount, 130 W, is minimally the equivalent in ss amplification.

On the other hand, I had in the past a tube amplifier with KT120 push pull mounting with (supposedly) 220W output but it couldn't drive my Rockports as good as the 110 W Lamm 1.2 Reference. I had the Concero 65 and it drove my Rockports markedly better than the Lamm... and my Rockports go as low as 2 ohms, so figure out!

 

[bonzo75]

As mentioned above, it is not necessarily power that you need but instant and sufficient current delivery to ensure a linear control of the speaker which is really really challenging due to the impedance characteristics. The Concero has that current. Regarding the seemingly limited power of 65 W, mind you that this is a pure and real Single Ended Triode mount.

There are many theories to what the equivalent in solid state is but I think that I am cautious to say that double that amount, 130 W, is minimally the equivalent in ss amplification.

On the other hand, I had in the past a tube amplifier with KT120 push pull mounting with (supposedly) 220W output but it couldn't drive my Rockports as good as the 110 W Lamm 1.2 Reference. I had the Concero 65 and it drove my Rockports markedly better than the Lamm... and my Rockports go as low as 2 ohms, so figure out!

What is the current output of the Concero 65?

 

[Aries Cerat]

What is the current output of the Concero 65?

Hello Ked


The Concero 65 run on current surplus,instead of voltage surpluslike most SET do.When designing a SET amplifier,the operating point and step down ratio of the OTP determine how the amplifier will behave when the impedance of the load is lower than the nominal(example,4ohm load on 8ohm tap).
Operating in Class A ,a SET's max current output is determined only by it's idle current and step down ratio of the OTP.

Thus said,the Concero 65 comes with impedance selection switches,to set the nominal load.It's current headroom is 1.4 so it can easily tolerate dips down to 4ohm when set to 8ohm position, 2ohm dips to the 4ohm position, 1ohm to 2ohm and 0.5ohm to 1ohm position.

Long story short,the max current output is user select-able.

Regards
Stavros



A SET will have lower power output when an 4ohm load is presented at it's 8ohm taps.

 

[pelo911]

As mentioned above, it is not necessarily power that you need but instant and sufficient current delivery to ensure a linear control of the speaker which is really really challenging due to the impedance characteristics. The Concero has that current. Regarding the seemingly limited power of 65 W, mind you that this is a pure and real Single Ended Triode mount.

There are many theories to what the equivalent in solid state is but I think that I am cautious to say that double that amount, 130 W, is minimally the equivalent in ss amplification.

On the other hand, I had in the past a tube amplifier with KT120 push pull mounting with (supposedly) 220W output but it couldn't drive my Rockports as good as the 110 W Lamm 1.2 Reference. I had the Concero 65 and it drove my Rockports markedly better than the Lamm... and my Rockports go as low as 2 ohms, so figure out!

and my Vitus SM-101 don't have sufficient current?

i ask OVERTURE sales manager
he sold 3 Maestro speakers
with McIntosh , Classe and Naim
he like the NAP 500-DR the most.

he tried Devialet with Scala and Stella
and don't like it so much

 

[flyer]

and my Vitus SM-101 don't have sufficient current?

i ask OVERTURE sales manager
he sold 3 Maestro speakers
with McIntosh , Classe and Naim
he like the NAP 500-DR the most.

he tried Devialet with Scala and Stella
and don't like it so much

I don't know if they have enough current. As said earlier, the preamp may not be driving them enough.

Last thing you need to do, at least that is my opinion, is rush into conclusions without having looked at the whole horizon and taken time to do so. I would equally recommend not to build too much on the experience of other people, whose listening tastes or reference base you don't know, to let you be guided by a sales manager.

See if you can have tests carried out in your system with better sources first, before breaking your back and your bank by moving your amps (out).

 

[pelo911]

I don't know if they have enough current. As said earlier, the preamp may not be driving them enough.

Last thing you need to do, at least that is my opinion, is rush into conclusions without having looked at the whole horizon and taken time to do so. I would equally recommend not to build too much on the experience of other people, whose listening tastes or reference base you don't know, to let you be guided by a sales manager.

See if you can have tests carried out in your system with better sources first, before breaking your back and your bank by moving your amps (out).

you are right
i appreciate your advice

i tried to find Vitus Pre , but found only 102 model and it was very expensive
i know that Pass XP-10 it's not in the same level as the Amps or the speakers
(also my DAC not in the same league)

do you think it will be smart to replace it?
how can i know which one to chose that can work with the Vitus amps?

what do you think about windows 10 PC?
i'm using HTPC computer that i build
maybe it's better to use Apple Macbook Pro / Mac mini?

 

[flyer]

you are right
i appreciate your advice

i tried to find Vitus Pre , but found only 102 model and it was very expensive
i know that Pass XP-10 it's not in the same level as the Amps or the speakers
(also my DAC not in the same league)

do you think it will be smart to replace it?
how can i know which one to chose that can work with the Vitus amps?

what do you think about windows 10 PC?
i'm using HTPC computer that i build
maybe it's better to use Apple Macbook Pro / Mac mini?

Beware when you go to confess with the devil, he might turn you away from the right path

I'll be honest (as always ), if you want some more tubey sound, look for a tube preamp then. I will not give you any proposed names as this is kind of asking too much for me, given my background . It anyway depends on your listening preferences.

The Pass XP-10 is effectively not the strongest link in your system. If your preamp and amp have a good match, then the digital source is the next thing to address. Of course that sources matter (a lot) but less on the 'drive' issue I would say. Although, having long lived with a DAC without an output stage and now having a DAC that does have (a very good) one, it is a substantial change (again).

On choices between Windows based, Linux based and iOS-based servers, a lot of pages on this and other forums have been written. I found a very good solution but it doesn't mean there aren't any other good ones existing (but not as cheap ;-)).

If you are in Europe, I might help you further. If outside, also but less likely this going to happen so I would strongly advise to not go at random in this. For the preamp, you could start by asking Vitus themselves what are typically good matches. Look at show reports which associations are being presented as the manufacturers themselves are kind of making sure there is a good synergy between components of different brands, most of the time...

 

[pelo911]

Beware when you go to confess with the devil, he might turn you away from the right path

I'll be honest (as always ), if you want some more tubey sound, look for a tube preamp then. I will not give you any proposed names as this is kind of asking too much for me, given my background . It anyway depends on your listening preferences.

The Pass XP-10 is effectively not the strongest link in your system. If your preamp and amp have a good match, then the digital source is the next thing to address. Of course that sources matter (a lot) but less on the 'drive' issue I would say. Although, having long lived with a DAC without an output stage and now having a DAC that does have (a very good) one, it is a substantial change (again).

On choices between Windows based, Linux based and iOS-based servers, a lot of pages on this and other forums have been written. I found a very good solution but it doesn't mean there aren't any other good ones existing (but not as cheap ;-)).

If you are in Europe, I might help you further. If outside, also but less likely this going to happen so I would strongly advise to not go at random in this. For the preamp, you could start by asking Vitus themselves what are typically good matches. Look at show reports which associations are being presented as the manufacturers themselves are kind of making sure there is a good synergy between components of different brands, most of the time...

great idea to ask Vitus
i spoke with the owner once
i'm sure he will tell me to find Vitus Pre , hope he will be nice to recommend other brand.

"Although, having long lived with a DAC without an output stage and now having a DAC that does have (a very good) one, it is a substantial change (again)."
you meant DAC with Volume control?
which one?
i red that some people plug DAC directly to amp , without Pre

i'm from Houston , Texas
not Europe
i should visit Europe , you have the best driving roads and tracks (cars and racing much more interesting then Music to me)

 

[flyer]

great idea to ask Vitus
i spoke with the owner once
i'm sure he will tell me to find Vitus Pre , hope he will be nice to recommend other brand.

"Although, having long lived with a DAC without an output stage and now having a DAC that does have (a very good) one, it is a substantial change (again)."
you meant DAC with Volume control?
which one?
i red that some people plug DAC directly to amp , without Pre

i'm from Houston , Texas
not Europe
i should visit Europe , you have the best driving roads and tracks (cars and racing much more interesting then Music to me)

The DAC I had without output stage was the Totaldac Twelve. You can easily plug any DAC, providing there is a way to control the volume somewhere in the chain, to a power amp directly. Question is if it is going to be able to drive that amp properly due to the electrical characteristics of each. As mentioned, I was very happy without a pre for a long time until I, almost by coincidence, found it that I nevertheless was missing out on quite a few things by not having the preamp. This is where my quest for a decent preamp began.

Always welcome to come and have a listen in Europe , but maybe, a bit easier to pay a visit - or have him visit you - to Believe High Fidelty in Austin, TX.

 

[pelo911]

The DAC I had without output stage was the Totaldac Twelve. You can easily plug any DAC, providing there is a way to control the volume somewhere in the chain, to a power amp directly. Question is if it is going to be able to drive that amp properly due to the electrical characteristics of each. As mentioned, I was very happy without a pre for a long time until I, almost by coincidence, found it that I nevertheless was missing out on quite a few things by not having the preamp. This is where my quest for a decent preamp began.

Always welcome to come and have a listen in Europe , but maybe, a bit easier to pay a visit - or have him visit you - to Believe High Fidelty in Austin, TX.

i got reply from Vitus owner
advice me to buy RD-100
DAC with Pre
he think it will sound better then SL-101 Pre with my DAC