Another Power Article Based On What

[Alrainbow]

Ok I agree it's better ,

 

[Alrainbow]

You've done the time to know that's for sure .

 

[Kingrex]

FWIW, I needed a 25 foot run to temp some power in my room. Im basically making an extension cord to power my amps. This is a drill twist. Not bad. But I would not do it with a drill for a permanent install.

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...illustrates the added virtue of solid-core, which I know you prefer: it maintains the geometry. With stranded, you'd have to tape at intervals, or gin-up some kind of sheathing. I guess I'm now agreeing with you, Rex that solid-core is the way to go. Perhaps a little more hassle to pull (depending on particulars) but easier/simpler on balance, even independent of SQ...which I think you also prefer for SQ. Cheers...

 

[Chrisl]

I use a bobbin with the 3 spools on it and a take off spool driven by a truck winch. And it takes me a about 2 hours for a 500 foot run. Its a PITA.

That's a lot of work Rex Too bad the drill technique isn't as effective.

 

[Kingrex]

That's a lot of work Rex Too bad the drill technique isn't as effective.

Look close at the white wire on the bottom. Look at the label. See how it was turned over when twisted. That is actually a twist in the single coneuctor itself. . You dont want that. It should be like braiding. A hand over hand movement. The label should lay flat with the writing up the whole twist.
If 2 people worked together, you could do sbort runs. Pull out 25 feet and lock one end. One person would be in the front creating the twist and tightening it down. Very tough hand exercise. The back person would be flashing the wires out, turning them over and not letting them bunch into a mess.

 

[microstrip]

Look close at the white wire on the bottom. Look at the label. See how it was turned over when twisted. That is actually a twist in the single coneuctor itself. . You dont want that. It should be like braiding. A hand over hand movement. The label should lay flat with the writing up the whole twist.
If 2 people worked together, you could do sbort runs. Pull out 25 feet and lock one end. One person would be in the front creating the twist and tightening it down. Very tough hand exercise. The back person would be flashing the wires out, turning them over and not letting them bunch into a mess.

Why not just twisting phase and neutral and keeping the earth wire separated?

 

[Kingrex]

Why not just twisting phase and neutral and keeping the earth wire separated?

Because its an extension cord on my floor. I usually twist all 3. I guess I should listen and see if I hear a difference.

 

[Holmz]

Why not just twisting phase and neutral and keeping the earth wire separated?

Or not twist em to increase the inductance?

 

[microstrip]

Or not twist em to increase the inductance?

Please see the link inside post #21 https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/another-power-article-based-on-what.40289/post-1031499

 

[Holmz]

Please see the link inside post #21 https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/another-power-article-based-on-what.40289/post-1031499

I saw the assertion in the link, but I did not see the physics explanation.
(Just the word physics???)

 

[Lee]

Very nice hypothetical images. It would take a skilled tradsman a lot of training and practice to make a crimp so solid. Non of the tools I have would do it. Non that I saw in the field either. Most were a bat wing or C crimp. We didn't use many terminal ends. Mechanical lugs on gear is the norm.
The tools we had did not press out the wire and crimp so perfect. They were all hydrolic and used a lot of force. They were far better than any mechanical connection like a split bolt. But non would deform the underlying stands like the image. Maybe a little.

I do like the terminations I have seen Blue Jean cables making. I think its a sonic welder. Pressure and viration I believe are used to join a wire to a terminal device. Not fully sure. That type connecting I believe is gas tight as its somewhat cold welded.

I'm pretry disappointed in my Inakustik cables as the terminal on the end is a set screw into a soldered wire end. The cables sound good. The functional technology seems primitive.

Looking at these images and thinking of what I see used in the field like wire nuts, I go back to why I like a single unbroken wire from a circuit breaker to a duplex. The least amount of breaks, the better. The best I have heard is a unbroken wire from the CB, up and out the wall and hard wires into a power strip. The power strip built like an octopus with hard wires cables from it to a IEC on the end. No duplex in the chain. Not legal. Can't do it. But works great.

I saw Shunyata’s team using a sonic welder on the factory tour. Really cool device.

 

[QuadDiffuser]

Here’s the physics:

My dedicated audio room build - QuadDiffusor's Big Dig

Here's a rendering of the ceiling for determining the positions of the air conditioning outlets, showing extensive usage of quadratic diffusers; P23s x 8 on the front wall, P17s x 20 on the sidewalls, and P11s x 49 on the ceiling canopy, all constructed out of SOLID tropical hardwood sourced...

www.whatsbestforum.com

 

[Holmz]

Here’s the physics:

My dedicated audio room build - QuadDiffusor's Big Dig

Here's a rendering of the ceiling for determining the positions of the air conditioning outlets, showing extensive usage of quadratic diffusers; P23s x 8 on the front wall, P17s x 20 on the sidewalls, and P11s x 49 on the ceiling canopy, all constructed out of SOLID tropical hardwood sourced...

www.whatsbestforum.com

Yeah but that is showing induced voltage in a cable running parallel to the test setup.
It is engineering, and not a physics explanation of why, but rather maybe a “how”..

The physics formula for the inductance includes the loop area.
So twisting them smashes that area down to be consistently small along the entire run..
(Romex does a similar thing to hold them close together)
The vector of the magnetic field produces a field with the right hand rule of the magnetic field.
So the twist essentially is a bunch of smaller loops as with up/down/up/… repeating, with them mostly cancels out to zero.
(Which Romex is NOT doing)

Twisting them is the right thing to do, and it probably is better if the ground is not twisted and then there is more cancelation of the magnetic field relative the inductance into the ground wire.

Since the same amount of current is flowing on the N side as the L side, then one cannot really twist L+G and N+G and get as much cancelation as twisting L+N. If the ground is twisted after the fact, then it should ideally be at a different twist/foot rate, and maybe opposite handed ness.(??)

The only change from considering the physics, is to not twist the ground along with the L+N, but it should not matter a whole lot either.

If one was braiding it, then only looping in the ground every so often should provide a bit more cancellation. (Like an even number of twists to braid)

 

[microstrip]

I saw the assertion in the link, but I did not see the physics explanation.
(Just the word physics???)

As far as I see it if we do not twist separation increases and voltage also increases.

Distance of ground wire is also important - there is another article showing this dependence - but it is not possible to implement it due to legal requirements. But it should not be twisted with the other two cables. Unfortunately I could not find the other paper - as far as I remember the advise was twisting the power carrying cables and leaving the earth wire loose in the conduit.

See this final comment " and lay the safety ground wire next to the bundle a few inches away "

 

[Holmz]

As far as I see it if we do not twist separation increases and voltage also increases.

Correct.
The voltage increases because there is more separation area, and it also increases because the area is not flipping back and forth.

Distance of ground wire is also important - there is another article showing this dependence - but it is not possible to implement it due to legal requirements. But it should not be twisted with the other two cables. Unfortunately I could not find the other paper - as far as I remember the advise was twisting the power carrying cables and leaving the earth wire loose in the conduit.

That is solid advice,

See this final comment " and lay the safety ground wire next to the bundle a few inches away "

For the voltage to increase with the ground wire not twisted, implies that it is carrying some induced current to minimise the magnetic field.

It is all sort also implying that the signal wires should be twisted, and that the signal wires should not run parallel to the power cables for many (25) feet.
And also implying that things that like/use magnetic fields (TT and tape machines) should not have power cables too close.

I could picture a 1” wide ground foil that was “taco’ed” around the twisted L+N as providing the most opportunity for “inducting in” the stray magnetic field.