Burmester 911 mk3
- Thread starter AudioExplorations
- Start date
Although Burmester specifications are not easy to find, I could see it in the page of a dealer - a damping factor of 2750. Do you use cryogenic cooled superconductor cables to connect it to your speakers?
Otherwise you risk degrading the damping factor of your system!
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Although Burmester specifications are not easy to find, I could see it in the page of a dealer - a damping factor of 2750. Do you use cryogenic cooled superconductor cables to connect it to your speakers?
Damping factor of 2750 @ 8 ohm = 0.003 ohm output impedance. When you get to 0.1 ohm output impedance, damping factors don't mean much. It's great for marketing though. There are a lot more important factors when it comes to "the amplifier's grip on the speakers".
The wikipedia article that AudioExplorations linked is a good start. Unfortunately, there's a lot of bs in amplifier marketing, and even more unfortunately, not all amplifiers that measure the same sound the same.
Soooo, Damping Factor is not much of a factor at the end? Or is it with certain speaker designs?
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
It is a factor, just that between 1,000 and 2,000 the sonic difference is much, much, less than between 10 and 20. I dare say that once the damping factor is beyond 100 or so, it makes minimal difference.
When I was developing the tube amps, getting the damping factor above 5 made the greatest difference.... and output impedance can very easily be adjusted using feedback. The greater the feedback, the higher the damping factor.
So, Gary, based on your experience and taking the damping factor into consideration, which might be better for the 911s, mono or vertical biamping?
The burmesters certainly are very cable sensitive. When I use silver cables, they seem to be on the bright side and quite unlistenable. They sound very brittle, if I may use the word. When I replace the silver cables with the copper cables made by my dealer, the whole soundscape was totally transformed! All of a sudden, my CDs just sound so good that they give me the goosebumps. For those of you who are still considering to acquire these beauties, do so! You won't regret it. When you've got them, make sure you get a transformer (preferably 8 kva) with voltage control. This is very important in areas with voltage surges. When operating under a constant voltage (the voltage setting in the amps), there is another jump in performance. I've tested this many times (with and without the transformer) and the difference is huge.
Thf99,
I am soooooo glad you are very happy with the amps. What transformer are you using? I'd love to get a hold of the dealer cables you are using. What brand/type cable is he using to make them. It sounds as if he knows what he is doing.
I am soooooo glad you are very happy with the amps. What transformer are you using? I'd love to get a hold of the dealer cables you are using. What brand/type cable is he using to make them. It sounds as if he knows what he is doing.
Joe, yes, the dealer certainly knows what he's doing. In fact, a rep from Burmester came to visit him before he was given the dealership.
He uses the material from clearaudio. He strips the cables and tweaks them and reassemble them in his special way. Unfortunately, he only sells them to the customers who buy his equipment. He has over 40 years of experience tweaking cables. Apparently, he doesn't make money from selling his cables. He just wants his customers to get the sound possible from the equipment he sells. The transformer is also made by him.
Just another interesting story.
Uncle Richard, a long time family friend in his 70s, came by this morning and he sat in his usual place in my living room. My system was on and after a short while, he fell asleep. When he woke up some 20 minutes later, he commented that the music was so relaxing and soothing that he fell asleep. He's never done this before! He said I should've gotten these amps a long time ago!
Uncle Richard, a long time family friend in his 70s, came by this morning and he sat in his usual place in my living room. My system was on and after a short while, he fell asleep. When he woke up some 20 minutes later, he commented that the music was so relaxing and soothing that he fell asleep. He's never done this before! He said I should've gotten these amps a long time ago!
That is so funny you mention that story. The same thing happens to me. I can tell a great system by how sleepy I get. For some reason, on systems that I love to listen to, I can not stay awake. I get so relaxed and into the music, I just drift off into sleep. On systems I do not like so much, I have to leave the room. I can not wait until my amps arrive. I am going crazy.
You are very lucky to have that dealer.
Again, if you please red well what I wrote up, I said already that I demoed the cables mentioned above. If for you that cables are better, I respect your opinion even I don't share with. Everyone has own sound's taste according musical experience and for that I'm fully agree with you.
I think you should demo in your system a Full Set of Odin's.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
With the huge damping factor on the 911's I would bet that mono would be better. However, it would depend on the crossover design. Sometimes, separating the crossover improves the loudspeaker.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
I find that too - the 911 seem to be quite sensitive to the loudspeaker cables. If you consider that they may have an output impedance of 0.003 ohm, microstrip's suggestion of cryo-cooled superconductors isn't a joke or a facetious quip. Most cables would have an impedance far above 0.003 ohm, and hence affect the damping factor of the amplifier.
Or get Burmester's own 948 power conditioner..... which achieves the same thing without resorting to transformers. I would argue that you would need an 8 kva transformer for EACH 911.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
I am not sure what you both mean "killed". Can you explain? I assume you do not recommend Transparent Super audio cables?
Also, will one 948 handle both mono amps?
Just give a listen and in a few seconds you should clearly understand that the sound of 911's is worse.
My 911's mono are plugged into the 948 and the sound is much better. A friend of mine who has the 909's plugged them into the 948 with better sound result.
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