Can You Believe This-The Government Wants Us To Go EV but In So Doing They Will impose a gas surcharge

[DaveC]

So much snow in the driveway that you need to wake up in the middle of the night to shovel...

In 2003 I got 10-12 ft of snow over 2 days. Woke up 2nd day and opened the front door, only to see a wall of snow.

I was living just over 9000ft near the divide around Nederland, CO.

They had to bring in avalanche clearing equipment, massive snowthrower trucks, and it took over a week. After they came through heavy equipment was needed to clear secondary roads and driveways.

Cold is hard on EVs and it uses a lot of power to heat the car. They are much less efficient in the cold and with the heater on.

As far as parking a Tesla in a garage, IDK... they can burst into flame. It happens occasionally. Also, when they crash they can burst into flame, and the car can easily reignite many times after the fire is extinguished, even days later. See the Top Gear Rimac crash...

 

[DonH50]

I have a good friend who owns a cabin outside Nederland; I think he actually retired there a few years ago.

Garage at home is OK if you have one (my kids live in apartments and do not) but it still has to survive sitting in the parking lot at work for 12-14 hours. No chargers at work. I suppose now there'll be some gov't mandate for x number of charge outlets for every y parking spaces at workplaces, with x ramping to equal y by 2030.

Has a Tesla in a garage ever burst into flame? Do not know, curious. I have only heard about the ones in crashes. There are oodles of threads on Li-ion batteries (among others) and how to keep them from bursting into flame, and there are several solutions to the dendrite (self-shorting) problems. The latest rage seems to be SS batteries, however. The fuel cell crowd keeps percolating along.

 

[NorthStar]

Simple solution to all of this. It's called a garage.

Snowthrower takes care of that.

I know Steve; I was simply describing Dad's own experience back in the early to mid 60s living in Quebec winters, with five kids, a mortgage, a humble engineering job, ...all that car winter jazz of my youth. Looking back it gives me higher respect for the man...my Dad...RIP.

* Dad had a brand new house, a brick house with oil heating. But no carport, no garage.
We moved in in 1962, after construction was completed. I remember visiting the site when it first began construction and the foundations ...

I lived on the West coast for 25 years, @ see level, I don't have a garage with winters that last only couple weeks on average, very different than living East.

Anyway, the times, the places, the cars from the 50s I remember very well (my own first car was a 55 Dodge sedan), and today with EV and pollution levels different in the world (CO2, plastic, radio activity, ...) from manmade, oil marmalade, ...it's a good discussion we're having.

 

[NorthStar]

In 2003 I got 10-12 ft of snow over 2 days. Woke up 2nd day and opened the front door, only to see a wall of snow.

I was living just over 9000ft near the divide around Nederland, CO.

They had to bring in avalanche clearing equipment, massive snowthrower trucks, and it took over a week. After they came through heavy equipment was needed to clear secondary roads and driveways.

Cold is hard on EVs and it uses a lot of power to heat the car. They are much less efficient in the cold and with the heater on.

As far as parking a Tesla in a garage, IDK... they can burst into flame. It happens occasionally. Also, when they crash they can burst into flame, and the car can easily reignite many times after the fire is extinguished, even days later. See the Top Gear Rimac crash...

Good point Dave, and I asked friends who own electric cars and live in Quebec.
During very cold days no matter electric or gas it's best to have a garage or have your car plugged in.

When EV surpasses ICE we'll have more data on every aspect ... mortality rates, accidents, fires, winter conditions, batteries faults, etc. But then EV improvements by then will be tenfold plus ...
I think it'll have benefits overall over ICE. If it wasn't we wouldn't be following this direction today.

 

[NorthStar]

Oh, one thing...Tesla cars have a battery liquid cooling system.
Other EV brands (eg.; Nissan Leaf) don't.
• https://www-dailymail-co-uk.cdn.amp...ged-33-000-new-battery-2012-electric-car.html

 

[Al M.]

Simple solution to all of this. It's called a garage.

If
a) you can afford it
b) you have the space.

Even if I could afford building a garage, I wouldn't have the space to do so in my densely populated neighborhood. Case closed.

 

[Bobvin]

My 2019 RAM pickup has the "mild-hybrid" engine, and has the best auto-idle-stop of any rig I've ever driven. Instead of engaging the starter, it uses the generator (that grabs the belt to capture energy to charge the small battery.) Upon lifting my foot off the brake the generator/battery provides the energy for the first half revolution of the wheel, restarting the engine. I have been extremely impressed how well this works vs. engaging the starter motor. The auto-idle-stop feature of every other rig pales in comparison.

OMG, does that make me a greener? Please don't tell anyone.

 

[PeterA]

If
a) you can afford it
b) you have the space.

Even if I could afford building a garage, I wouldn't have the space to do so in my densely populated neighborhood. Case closed.

Al, even if you could build a separate garage for the car, most audiophiles might opt to build a separate listening room instead, which would likely use more heat and air conditioning than a garage. You are lucky to already have a nice, dedicated, listening room.

 

[Folsom]

My 2019 RAM pickup has the "mild-hybrid" engine, and has the best auto-idle-stop of any rig I've ever driven. Instead of engaging the starter, it uses the generator (that grabs the belt to capture energy to charge the small battery.) Upon lifting my foot off the brake the generator/battery provides the energy for the first half revolution of the wheel, restarting the engine. I have been extremely impressed how well this works vs. engaging the starter motor. The auto-idle-stop feature of every other rig pales in comparison.

OMG, does that make me a greener? Please don't tell anyone.

I hate those things that stop and start. This sounds way better.

 

[Empirical Audio]

I have a good friend who owns a cabin outside Nederland; I think he actually retired there a few years ago.

Garage at home is OK if you have one (my kids live in apartments and do not) but it still has to survive sitting in the parking lot at work for 12-14 hours. No chargers at work. I suppose now there'll be some gov't mandate for x number of charge outlets for every y parking spaces at workplaces, with x ramping to equal y by 2030.

Has a Tesla in a garage ever burst into flame? Do not know, curious. I have only heard about the ones in crashes. There are oodles of threads on Li-ion batteries (among others) and how to keep them from bursting into flame, and there are several solutions to the dendrite (self-shorting) problems. The latest rage seems to be SS batteries, however. The fuel cell crowd keeps percolating along.

No reports of ANY electric car bursting into flames in a garage, especially Tesla.

 

[NorthStar]

• https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-facing-scrutiny-for-car-fires-but-more-ice-fires-2019-5

• https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1122838_busting-7-of-the-most-common-myths-about-electric-cars

 

[Ron Resnick]

We all have gotten comfortable having 20 gallon tanks of gasoline in our garages. I assume we will be able to get comfortable having large banks of batteries in our garages.

 

[howiebrou]

The rental car I just had in South Carolina did indeed turn off when stopped at traffic lights. What do you mean by "backwards country"?

I used to own a Tesla Model X. It turned off whilst driving on the highway. Everything shut down except the drivetrain. If it was night time i would be mincemeat. It also turned off coming our of a carpark and took 15 mins to restart. The people behind me were none too pleased. That happened several times on the road. Been hit on the head by the trunk door and stupid wings. My 9 year old daughter almost got crushed and had to jump back inside as it came down on her. Had my wall charger at home changed 4 times. Tesla customer service whispered into my ear 'they're all like that'/ I sold it the next day.
No, i won't be buying another one.

 

[Steve Williams]

@DaveC

yuu mentioned that using the heater in cold weather is hard on EV batteries. Would the same not hold true wrt using the air conditioner on very hot days

 

[Steve Williams]

I used to own a Tesla Model X. It turned off whilst driving on the highway. Everything shut down except the drivetrain. If it was night time i would be mincemeat. It also turned off coming our of a carpark and took 15 mins to restart. The people behind me were none too pleased. That happened several times on the road. Been hit on the head by the trunk door and stupid wings. My 9 year old daughter almost got crushed and had to jump back inside as it came down on her. Had my wall charger at home changed 4 times. Tesla customer service whispered into my ear 'they're all like that'/ I sold it the next day.
No, i won't be buying another one.

Ouch Howie. Of all the Tesla. cars my least favorite and one I’d never buy is the model X.

 

[Folsom]

People still buy BMW’s and they randomly light on fire in garages...

 

[howiebrou]

Ouch Howie. Of all the Tesla. cars my least favorite and one I’d never buy is the model X.

Actually i have to say the car, when it worked, was pretty good. Fast, quiet and you can keep the aircon on when you're waiting for someone in 34C and 100% humidity. It is pretty fugly though, imho, but it worked. When i bought it, it was tax exempt here in HK. Now the tax on it is the same as other cars which is around 120%. Er no thanks. for that kind of money, I would rather buy a G Wagon...

 

[Steve Williams]

It reminds me of an egg

 

[howiebrou]

Ouch Howie. Of all the Tesla. cars my least favorite and one I’d never buy is the model X.

I wish they had a proper SUV. The X is called an SUV. Why i will never know.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Peter, I think many ICE cars have that “Eco Mode.”

Some of the loaner Mercedes I was given when my car was in for service had that mode. I found it very annoying.

If I remember correctly it had to be manually deactivated every time I turned the car on.

Steve, I don’t know anything about the Tesla Model X but I think the gull-wing doors are very cool!