Conrad Johnson: New Preamp Flagship - ART88

[Big Dog RJ]

Attn: Kingrex

Yes, good spotting mate. That 40% in improvement is from my previous ET5 to the ART88. At the moment, I'm using the CT5, which has been slightly modded towards a custom- sound that I wanted to match with my CJ monoblocks. The monoblocks have also been modded to a higher Class A bias operation. This was purposely done to drive my ML CLX's optimally. I didn't want to stress the tooobs, so this particular type of mod really helped.

Since this combination is mighty fine, I don't have any intentions to upgrade at all. Although the ART88 would be fabulous, without a doubt. I would need to upgrade other gear in order to be on par with the supreme reference quality of the ART88. This is seriously something that I'm not willing to do, no matter how damn good it sounds. I'm not getting any younger and I'm getting tired of all this tooob maintenance. Heck! As it is, I've already got plenty plenty of tooobs in the rig. So I'll just keep things simple.

Note: from GATS2 to ART88, I would sincerely believe the improvement is around the 15-20% if at all. The thing is, at this high level of performance, I wouldn't really term it as an "improvement," rather I'd say the two preamps just sound different. Like I said, the GATS2 has buffered SS output stage, whereas the ART88 is all tooob, no buffered stage whatsoever. Having either one is mighty mighty fine, it's just a matter of preference where some owners may still prefer their GAT preamps.

Cheers, and enjoy those finest tunes!
Woof! RJ

Oh! Here's a pic of the TEA2SE Max, thought you might like it. As CJ says, "it just sounds right."

 

[LL21]

Thanks for the clarification gents!!!

 

[thedudeabides]

Out of curiosity, has anyone noticed major changes in customer service and the like at CJ after Bill and Lew sold out?

 

[Big Dog RJ]

Yes, apparently several members on CJO have experienced an inconsistent response from CJ HQ. Some very promptly received tech support, and others no response at all. Or in certain cases a quick sort of dismissal type of response, especially for owner's who still have their CJ SS designed amplifiers. CJ doesn't have the parts anymore for this line of gear nor the resources to attend to these.

However, when it comes to tube gear, they're still servicing the vintage gear, dating back to the early PV and MV designs. The newer gear, LP, Classic, and ART, no issues in tech support.

The other thing is, Lew J and Bill Conrad have gone fishing, they're both retired including their long time head technician, Ed Detimier. These were the people I dealt with during my dealership years. So now things have changed. The team is very small now, only about 8 people in total, plus one admin person and just one wizard! He designs, repairs, and does all the research projects for CJ's top line ART series to progress, and that chap is Jeff Fischel. As of now, CJ is in very good hands but not sure what happens when JF goes fishing... that's a big question.

I really miss the old team, their service was top notch and their dealer network support was excellent! Hardly any dealer network now, just a handful of people churning out beautiful CJ designs, times have changed. I sincerely wish them well and all the very best. Hopefully CJ will have yet another design wizard to carry on.

Cheers, RJ

 

[Another Johnson]

Yes, apparently several members on CJO have experienced an inconsistent response from CJ HQ. Some very promptly received tech support, and others no response at all. Or in certain cases a quick sort of dismissal type of response, especially for owner's who still have their CJ SS designed amplifiers. CJ doesn't have the parts anymore for this line of gear nor the resources to attend to these.

However, when it comes to tube gear, they're still servicing the vintage gear, dating back to the early PV and MV designs. The newer gear, LP, Classic, and ART, no issues in tech support.

The other thing is, Lew J and Bill Conrad have gone fishing, they're both retired including their long time head technician, Ed Detimier. These were the people I dealt with during my dealership years. So now things have changed. The team is very small now, only about 8 people in total, plus one admin person and just one wizard! He designs, repairs, and does all the research projects for CJ's top line ART series to progress, and that chap is Jeff Fischel. As of now, CJ is in very good hands but not sure what happens when JF goes fishing... that's a big question.

I really miss the old team, their service was top notch and their dealer network support was excellent! Hardly any dealer network now, just a handful of people churning out beautiful CJ designs, times have changed. I sincerely wish them well and all the very best. Hopefully CJ will have yet another design wizard to carry on.

Cheers, RJ

Seriously RJ? A wizard? How about your friend Matty? How about the defects found in my own amps after CJ would not put them on their bench during the warranty? How about solderslinger’s assertion that certain models are all going to hum!

And who the heck are the eight staff members? Jeff, Jasmine, and maybe three guys named Joe on an as needed basis.

CJ’s not a business … it is a job for a handful of people. When the chief cook and bottle washer dies, it will be gone.

 

[Big Dog RJ]

Yes AJ mate, points noted. I've also had my fair share of such bumps... oh well, perhaps not a wizard but some sort of wizardry voodoo going on. That's why especially now, with the CJ gear that I have and all the special mods done on them, they sometimes surpass the newer versions (or sound more towards my liking, personal preferences).
So I'm just keeping these things, not interested in any upgrades. The only other best thing / alternative gear I'm considering mid next year, is SS amplifiers. That's about it.

The 8 people include the parking attendant and perhaps the police officer at the intersection, keeping an eye on people speeding... in a mighty hurry to audition the latest & greatest!
So in that case, minus these two, maybe only 6 people no?

Cheers mate, I'm sure that Burmester gear is playing some finest tunes with the W-Daws. Enjoy
Woof! RJ

 

[thedudeabides]

Given my recent experience with the new owner, who also was the service repair tech a couple of months ago, I don't see CJ being around much longer.

I had three CJ preamps over the last 20 years or so before I decided to "downsize" my system. Was in the process of selling my system, which included the ET5, and needed to replace the rubber buttons on the RC20 remote.

Called CJ and finally spoke with Jeff, the owner. Had left numerous messages prior to with no return calls. Requested the buttons and he told me I would need to send in the remote. He would not sell me the replacement rubber pads. The cost quoted was $175. Or I could buy a new replacement remote for $350.This was for $10 (maybe) for parts and 10 minutes of labor.

When I told him I was a long term CJ devotee, he became rude and defensive. Said he didn't provide parts like Bill and Lew did in the past. He ranted on about the need to make money and other useless, non sensical gibberish. He's apparently ignorant of how small the hi end community is and how word travels fast.

I have very fond memories of CJ but I would advise anyone interested in their gear to look elsewhere. With an owner like that, their days are numbered.

Appreciate the validation guys. Best.

 

[Big Dog RJ]

Yes, unfortunately the days of LJ & Ed are long gone... gone... gone!
The new chief in command, JF is the boss and he's running the way he likes it. Also just to add, ticking off a lot of dealers because CJ is also trading customer direct, so what's the point in having dealers??? This is very upsetting and specially to our known former dealer network across the Sth East Asian region, which many of them don't carry CJ anymore. It's quite upsetting, and these guys were very loyal to the brand, CJ was the marquee of Rolls Royce in amplification. This is not the first time I've heard of CJ HQ been rather dismissive to the customer, plus regular long serving customers... it's a shame.
OTOH, in my case, I've been in close contact with my trusted CJ techie here in Aus since 2004, so he has looked after all my CJ gear in prime condition. I really don't have the need nor urge to upgrade on tube gear any further, hence will be looking at SS as a downsizing project in time to come.

Speaking of other makes in tube gear, I just returned from passing through Spore, I auditioned the Diptyque Reference panels with the Jadis monoblocks, a fine combination! Outstanding!!! If I was still considering tooobs in the future or as an upgrade, I would seriously consider this Speaker & amplifier combination by the French design team, really done on extraordinary levels. Plus, it doesn't cost a bloody fortune, unlike Alsyvox or Clarisys. If I didn't have my current CJ & ML CLX Art system, this would have been my preferred choice, with no hesitation. The other fantastic thing about the Diptyque speakers is that thanks to the use of Neodymium magnets, their efficiency ratings are much higher and easier to drive, even the 60-80w Jadis integrated was mighty fine! An effortless sound with high performance, just beautiful.
I believe the Alsyvox are also based on Neodymium's, and are quite easy to drive even with SET tube amps, so that's a massive plus point. However, at far less compared to actual pricing, I sincerely believe the Diptyque panels are real VFM, untouchable in this class.

Sorry, got a bit carried away there. Getting back to the topic, not too sure how long CJ is going to run... I truly wish them all the very best though. After all, it was LJ's and Bill's legacy to bring about these glorious products into the homes of audiophiles and provide a very high level of musical enjoyment on recorded playback systems. I certainly would like to see this legacy continue.

Cheers to all, and do enjoy those fine tunes!
Woof! RJ

 

[thedudeabides]

Yes, unfortunately the days of LJ & Ed are long gone... gone... gone!
The new chief in command, JF is the boss and he's running the way he likes it. Also just to add, ticking off a lot of dealers because CJ is also trading customer direct, so what's the point in having dealers??? This is very upsetting and specially to our known former dealer network across the Sth East Asian region, which many of them don't carry CJ anymore. It's quite upsetting, and these guys were very loyal to the brand, CJ was the marquee of Rolls Royce in amplification. This is not the first time I've heard of CJ HQ been rather dismissive to the customer, plus regular long serving customers... it's a shame.

It is also arrogant and ignorant. Suffice to say, a very self destructive buisness model. Not the first time this attitude destroyed a great company and will certainly not be the last. And yes, it is a shame and the annihilation of a formidable legacy. Best.

 

[Coppy777]

It is also arrogant and ignorant. Suffice to say, a very self destructive buisness model. Not the first time this attitude destroyed a great company and will certainly not be the last. And yes, it is a shame and the annihilation of a formidable legacy. Best.

I have found C-J and Jeff in particular, always to be responsive and helpful with significant issues. I don't believe some realize how small these business are. Their resources are very limited and like the great folks at VAC here in Sarasota, they employ only a handful of people.

In response to Ron's question, my experience is with the Premier 14, ACT2,s2 and the GAT1. He's asking is the new preamplifier warm or solid state detailed. I'd say neither. It's just life like to my ears, much more that the previous models. Lot's of detail, neutral and quiet. Not at all "old C-J" sounding.

As to the tube rolling in the ART88, I simply used the tubes the British review guy did and found the results beneficial and satisfactory vs stock.

I am considering a quad of KR audio KT88s in my ART27a but have recently retubed with Gold Lions and am having difficulty justifying another $1300 experiment for an unknown sound quality benefit. Can't find anybody saying it's a night and day difference vs the GLs.

 

[thedudeabides]

I have found C-J and Jeff in particular, always to be responsive and helpful with significant issues. I don't believe some realize how small these business are. Their resources are very limited and like the great folks at VAC here in Sarasota, they employ only a handful of people.

FWIW, I have had numerous experiences with "small" hi end audio companies over some 40 years as an avid audio hobbyist. Glad you have had positive experiences but my gut, based on my contact and others mentioned by RJ, would suggest that your encounters are in the minority. Sounds like folks are abandoning ship. Excellent customer service should the gold standard regardless of the "significance" of the issue at hand. This is especially true for smaller businesses in the very small universe of hi end manufacturers. Words travel fast.

I have nothing personal against the owner. But I have very fond memories of the numerous hours I spent listening to music over the last two decades through various CJ preamps. I sincerely hope, for the sake of Bill and Lew's efforts, that I am wrong about CJ's potential future success and that it will continue to be a prominent player in the hi end preamp and amplifier markets. Best.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Just a heads up, I tried to exchange the factory fitted Philips PCC88s for various ECC88s (6922) and that did not work at all in my ART88, very distorted sound.

With not many PCC88 variants available, I tried Telefunken and Siemens and kept the Siemens.

Hi!

How did the sound of the stock Phillips compare to the sound of the Siemens?

 

[Big Dog RJ]

Yes, the Phillips pcc88 tubes are the ones that JF has specifically selected for the Art88 design. His previous design on the GAT series also used these tubes but some owners managed to get away with tube rolling.

The thing is, from the advice given by my trusted CJ techie, certain tubes of particular category will vary in voltages. If the base circuit is designed in a critical way, such that higher tolerances aren't allowed... then those variations cannot be used or in the case of the above post, will sound distorted. They won't work.

To me, after all this roller coaster in highend audio, I just can't be bothered anymore with tube rolling. I rather just stick with what the main designer / manufacturer recommends. JF advises the same! I rather sit back and enjoy those finest tunes!

Trust me, just stick with the originals, the tooones are fine!
Woof! RJ

 

[Taiko Audio]

Hi!

How did the sound of the stock Phillips compare to the sound of the Siemens?

Hi Ron!

No magical differences, largely restricted to tonal balance.

Siemens: darkest/fullest, clearest midrange
Philips (the stock tubes): “neutral”, a bit dry
Telefunken: brightest/thinnest

So contrary to the ART108A poweramps, which employ 3 ECC88 tubes each, where you can get considerable differences in “magic” with tube rolling (my preference being Amperex Bugle Boy 7308 for all 6), I would have to agree with @Big Dog RJ that for the ART88 it’s not very interesting.

 

[Taiko Audio]

I am considering a quad of KR audio KT88s in my ART27a but have recently retubed with Gold Lions and am having difficulty justifying another $1300 experiment for an unknown sound quality benefit. Can't find anybody saying it's a night and day difference vs the GLs.

I purchased 4 quads of KR KT88s, although they are a significant upgrade over the Gold Lions, they are very unreliable, bias drifts allover the place and several failures. I ended up taking them out.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hi Ron!

No magical differences, largely restricted to tonal balance.

Siemens: darkest/fullest, clearest midrange
Philips (the stock tubes): “neutral”, a bit dry
Telefunken: brightest/thinnest

So contrary to the ART108A poweramps, which employ 3 ECC88 tubes each, where you can get considerable differences in “magic” with tube rolling (my preference being Amperex Bugle Boy 7308 for all 6), I would have to agree with @Big Dog RJ that for the ART88 it’s not very interesting.

Thank you very much, Emile, for reporting this experience!

Just so I understand your new post and your post from February about this, in addition to the differences in tonal balance, which of the vintage tubes you tried caused distortion?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Thank you very much, Emile, for reporting this experience!

Just so I understand your new post and your post from February about this, in addition to the differences in tonal balance, which of the vintage tubes you tried caused distortion?

The ART88 preamplifier uses PC88/7dj8 tubes (7 volt heater).

The results I shared in my post above are for PCC88 tubes.

There are only a handful of options for PCC88 tubes.

You can try to swap in ECC88/6dj8 (6.3 volt heater) tubes, giving you access to a world of very exotic (and very costly tube) options. These however caused distortion in the ART88 for me, and I even lost 2 (costly) pairs trying.

The ART108A poweramps do not use PCC88 tubes, but ECC88 tubes, so there you can roll your heart out (with significant differences).

 

[Ron Resnick]

The ART88 preamplifier uses PC88/7dj8 tubes (7 volt heater).

The results I shared in my post above are for PCC88 tubes.

There are only a handful of options for PCC88 tubes.

You can try to swap in ECC88/6dj8 (6.3 volt heater) tubes, giving you access to a world of very exotic (and very costly tube) options. These however caused distortion in the ART88 for me, and I even lost 2 (costly) pairs trying.

The ART108A poweramps do not use PCC88 tubes, but ECC88 tubes, so there you can roll your heart out (with significant differences).

I understand. Thank you very much!

 

[Coppy777]

ART88 TUBES… think I said this elsewhere but the HI FI plus reviewer used some EH 6922 Golds in the 88 to good effect. Those tubes in my unit have been an excellent addition. As he said, making good sound quality even better. Jeff said his experience with those tubes is that they get noisy. The new EHs in my unit have been dead quiet thus far after several months.

 

[Big Dog RJ]

ART88 TUBES… think I said this elsewhere but the HI FI plus reviewer used some EH 6922 Golds in the 88 to good effect. Those tubes in my unit have been an excellent addition. As he said, making good sound quality even better. Jeff said his experience with those tubes is that they get noisy. The new EHs in my unit have been dead quiet thus far after several months.

That's definitely a good thing! If those EH 6922's work fine in your ART88, and most of all completely quiet, that's the beauty.
As for enhancing performance... I don't think so. It's rather a different flavour not really an absolute improvement. If that were the case then JF needs to redesign the entire circuit, if just changing a tube caused significant improvement.

I'm currently using those EH 6922 (gold pins) in my CJ monoblocks. They're used in the phase inverter/ driver stages. They're quite good but I prefer the GGL's. The EH version have slightly more prominent midrange whereas the GGL's seem to be more defined in LF detail. Again, different flavours, I wouldn't say either one offered superior performance, no.

The other thing to remember when tube rolling is, tubes themselves take a while to settle in. So even before allowing them to settle in and do their thing, we get all very excited and go ahead and tube roll... without allowing proper time for closer assessments. If at all I would try different tubes, is only when they require replacing or well after a few years. Something to try just for a different flavour is nice to experience but definitely not something I'd do often. I rather enjoy those fine tunes!

Nice to hear that your Art88 has settled in well. Just enjoy it to the fullest!
Cheers, RJ