High-Performance Stereo With Stock Power Cords?

[Ted Denney III]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords? A stereo that is highly dynamic with controlled low frequencies, extended high frequencies, and a massive layered holographic sound stage that changes scale with recordings from immediate with focused presence, to wraparound envelopment and all points in between with stock power cords? I mean, obviously, the answer is no, absolutely not. But I’m curious, what other people think?

Bonus question: do power cord deniers have actual high-performance stereos?

 

[chuck]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords?

Yes. My amp still has its stock power cord and the stereo it powers does all those things. I have heard the SR factory system and it is really good but my rig sounds better to me.

 

[Ted Denney III]

Yes. My amp still has its stock power cord and the stereo it powers does all those things. I have heard the SR factory system and it is really good but my rig sounds better to me.

Honestly, being happy with what we have, is the hallmark of a good life. A healthy mindset.

 

[ssfas]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords? A stereo that is highly dynamic with controlled low frequencies, extended high frequencies, and a massive layered holographic sound stage that changes scale with recordings from immediate with focused presence, to wraparound envelopment and all points in between with stock power cords? I mean, obviously, the answer is no, absolutely not. But I’m curious, what other people think?

Bonus question: do power cord deniers have actual high-performance stereos?

Here in the UK we call the $2 "stock" cables "kettle cables". Not because kettles are cheap domestic appliances, but because kettles draw a lot of current and if a cable is good enough for a kettle it should be good enough for most other things.

Most appliances are likely to be supplied with a 13A fused plug with rated cable, usually 2.5mm copper. There are detailed laws that apply. You often see people using these stock cables. Some of my cables are a small step up, a Supra Lo-Rad kit for $65.

MCRU Supra Lo-Rad DIY Mains Lead Set

Superb value for money DIY mains lead set using quality components.

www.mcru.co.uk

I also use a lot of Belden 19364 for spurs, it's a stock-type cable.

Naim is probably our leading high-end brand and their recommended power cable is about $100.

Naim Powerline Lite Mains Cable 1.0m

Discover a new level of audio quality with the Naim Powerline Lite Mains Cable 1.0m. Elevate your music listening experience to new heights. Shop now!

www.hifix.co.uk

 

[treitz3]

Answer - No. To both. Someone here may possibly disagree. To each their own.

Tom

 

[Ted Denney III]

Here in the UK we call the $2 "stock" cables "kettle cables". Not because kettles are cheap domestic appliances, but because kettles draw a lot of current and if a cable is good enough for a kettle it should be good enough for most other things.

Most appliances are likely to be supplied with a 13A fused plug with rated cable, usually 2.5mm copper. There are detailed laws that apply. You often see people using these stock cables. Some of my cables are a small step up, a Supra Lo-Rad kit for $65.

MCRU Supra Lo-Rad DIY Mains Lead Set

Superb value for money DIY mains lead set using quality components.

www.mcru.co.uk

I also use a lot of Belden 19364 for spurs, it's a stock-type cable.

Naim is probably our leading high-end brand and their recommended power cable is about $100.

Naim Powerline Lite Mains Cable 1.0m

Discover a new level of audio quality with the Naim Powerline Lite Mains Cable 1.0m. Elevate your music listening experience to new heights. Shop now!

www.hifix.co.uk

Really? I mean, yes passing current is fine. But I find of all the cables in the system, power cords are perhaps the most beneficial and influential in terms of what your system will sound like.

 

[Al M.]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords? A stereo that is highly dynamic with controlled low frequencies, extended high frequencies, and a massive layered holographic sound stage that changes scale with recordings from immediate with focused presence, to wraparound envelopment and all points in between with stock power cords? I mean, obviously, the answer is no, absolutely not. But I’m curious, what other people think?

Bonus question: do power cord deniers have actual high-performance stereos?

The answer is no, also in my system. I was for the longest time a power cord denier, but then a technical post on WBF by Billinge (#112 in the link):

Audiophile power cords vs. the cables in your walls

Try making a cable out of Romex... seriously, have fun. I have seen it done. They’re extremely hard to move, and because of that they will come loose from the plugs (internally). But also you aren’t as likely to maintain the relationship with the ground in the middle as cleanly. What really...

www.whatsbestforum.com

(and follow-up posts by the same poster on subsequent thread pages),

combined with listening experiences in a friend's system finally made me curious to try audiophile power cords again.

I was shocked by how much fine resolution (e.g., on orchestral massed violins), bass control and lack of artificial hardness I had left on the table all those years with my stubborn refusal to consider audiophile power cords and instead using stock power cords. The amount of distortion that went away with better power cords was very substantial.

My power cords are all ZenWave (DaveC), see my signature. The switch to these power cords, as well as to an audiophile Furutech 6-way power distributor (that one removed lots of hardness and distortion as well), was worth every penny.

 

[Ted Denney III]

The answer is no, also in my system. I was for the longest time a power cord denier, but then a technical post on WBF by Billinge (#112 in the link):

Audiophile power cords vs. the cables in your walls

Try making a cable out of Romex... seriously, have fun. I have seen it done. They’re extremely hard to move, and because of that they will come loose from the plugs (internally). But also you aren’t as likely to maintain the relationship with the ground in the middle as cleanly. What really...

www.whatsbestforum.com

(and follow-up posts by the same poster on subsequent thread pages),

combined with listening experiences in a friend's system finally made me curious to try audiophile power cords again.

I was shocked by how much fine resolution (e.g., on orchestral massed violins), bass control and lack of artificial hardness I had left on the table all those years with my stubborn refusal to consider audiophile power cords and instead using stock power cords. The amount of distortion that went away with better power cords was very substantial.

My power cords are all ZenWave (DaveC), see my signature. The switch to these power cords, as well as to an audiophile Furutech 6-way power distributor (that one removed lots of hardness and distortion as well), was worth every penny.

Power cords really do make a huge difference, don’t they?

 

[Argonaut]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords? A stereo that is highly dynamic with controlled low frequencies, extended high frequencies, and a massive layered holographic sound stage that changes scale with recordings from immediate with focused presence, to wraparound envelopment and all points in between with stock power cords? I mean, obviously, the answer is no, absolutely not. But I’m curious, what other people think?

Bonus question: do power cord deniers have actual high-performance stereos?

The answer is … No , I will not buy any of the products that you are laughably attempting to peddle on this forum via yet another of your incessant , barely disguised infomercial offensives .

 

[Elliot G.]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords? A stereo that is highly dynamic with controlled low frequencies, extended high frequencies, and a massive layered holographic sound stage that changes scale with recordings from immediate with focused presence, to wraparound envelopment and all points in between with stock power cords? I mean, obviously, the answer is no, absolutely not. But I’m curious, what other people think?

Bonus question: do power cord deniers have actual high-performance stereos?

Most of the products at the top of my product line don’t come with power cords so first answer is no.
We sell both the great Shunyata and Gobel cables and they both have excellent power cords

 

[ssfas]

Really? I mean, yes passing current is fine. But I find of all the cables in the system, power cords are perhaps the most beneficial and influential in terms of what your system will sound like.

The UK cable market has been largely free of B/S thanks to QED. They've been making cables for over 50 years, notably QED79, a 79 strand low inductance speaker cable that has sold in massive quantities since 1976 to date, and still costs only $3/m.

QED have been producing technical guides since the Genesis loudspeaker cable report in 1995, then one on signal cables generally in 2000, and many white papers on specific products. They can all be found here.
https://support.qed.co.uk/portal/en/kb/qed
They do make one power cable, it costs $200. The link is included below. As you will see, there is a full explanation and it is primarily about geometry and inductance. They do not consider the conductor has to be thick, no thicker than "stock" cable.

So whilst signal cables have been a "thing" for along time, my impression is that power cables have not. No doubt high-end audiophiles have all bought in to the USA brands, but not your average audiophile. My impression is that power cable upgrades fall into the $100 to $200 range mostly, like Supra or IsoTek EVO3.

I looked up a few dealers, even some high-end ones, and they don't even sell upgrade power cables.

The main point is that your typical UK audiophile seems largely impervious to the marketing spin and fancy words used to sell glitzy wall wire.

https://support.qed.co.uk/portal/api/kbArticles/355443000009201309/locale/en/attachments/9pxk29d5ead0691b348b9bf815542f3e173fe/content?portalId=edbsnaa4c45ea33441860cc52795dc7dde55c8f4d93c2bb4a127a350adcb86a9b0328&inline=true

https://support.qed.co.uk/portal/api/kbArticles/355443000009201311/locale/en/attachments/9pxk2924dd611600744c38eb6fe38ae788bd0/content?portalId=edbsnaa4c45ea33441860cc52795dc7dde55c8f4d93c2bb4a127a350adcb86a9b0328&inline=true

https://www.qed.co.uk/downloads/qed/soundofscience.pdf

https://support.qed.co.uk/portal/api/kbArticles/355443000013281388/locale/en/attachments/3bv3i0641fe59d7ca4b879754657bfd1ccec4/content?portalId=edbsnaa4c45ea33441860cc52795dc7dde55c8f4d93c2bb4a127a350adcb86a9b0328&inline=true

 

[Al M.]

Power cords really do make a huge difference, don’t they?

Yes, as I said I was shocked. The difference is literally unbelievable, if you are a skeptic like I was (and for false "technical" reasons no less).

Some say that audiophile power cords are just a tone filter. I have experienced that myself with some cords as well. My power cords, however, do not change the tonal balance at all from stock power cords, not that I could discern anyway. But they elevate the performance so much more.

 

[PeterA]

Of course, different power cords can sound different. But I want more than just different, I want that sound better. We should choose power cords very carefully to meet our own criteria based on our own values and our target listening experience.

My power cords are 25 year-old NOS Ching Cheng. They sound better to me than the stock power cords I had and much better than a lot of the audio file power cords I tried.

Despite the blatant marketing attempt of this thread by a manufacturer to promote the products he makes, my search for power cords is over.

 

[italia]

Quad ESL-63 electrostatic loudspeakers draw very low current. The later models use a 100mA fuse in 110V models, and a 63mA fuse in 220V models. As a result many people think/feel/assume the power cords make little to no difference.

My experience is counter to that, in that the audiophile power cables I use increase dynamics, clarity and imaging, reducing noise in those lovely black spaces between instruments.

 

[Ted Denney III]

Quad ESL-63 electrostatic loudspeakers draw very low current. The later models use a 100mA fuse in 110V models, and a 63mA fuse in 220V models. As a result many people think/feel/assume the power cords make little to no difference.

My experience is counter to that, in that the audiophile power cables I use increase dynamics, clarity and imaging, reducing noise in those lovely black spaces between instruments.

Bingo

 

[PeterA]

Question: Is it possible to have a high-performance stereo with stock power cords? A stereo that is highly dynamic with controlled low frequencies, extended high frequencies, and a massive layered holographic sound stage that changes scale with recordings from immediate with focused presence, to wraparound envelopment and all points in between with stock power cords? I mean, obviously, the answer is no, absolutely not. But I’m curious, what other people think?

Bonus question: do power cord deniers have actual high-performance stereos?

I understand that you use your ears to identify differences. What I would really like to know is the criteria you use to determine whether or not a cord is better or worse. What are you actually listening for and what do you actually hear when you compare your products to stock cords?

 

[Ted Denney III]

I understand that you use your ears to identify differences. What I would really like to know is the criteria you use to determine whether or not a cord is better or worse. What are you actually listening for and what do you actually hear when you compare your products to stock cords?

Exceptional power cord versus an unexceptional power cord:

The exceptional power cord will exhibit superior sound staging, with increased tonal and sonic density within the sound field. The superior power cord will exhibit more high-frequency extension absent distortion artifacts. The superior power cord will exhibit deeper bass extension and tighter bass control. The superior power cord will exhibit more natural midrange. Together, the superior power cord has the potential to transform the system. This is in direct contrast to the inferior power cord, which would be stock, and poorly engineered high-end power cords.

 

[PeterA]

Exceptional power cord versus an unexceptional power cord:

The exceptional power cord will exhibit superior sound staging, with increased tonal and sonic density within the sound field. The superior power cord will exhibit more high-frequency extension absent distortion artifacts. The superior power cord will exhibit deeper bass extension and tighter bass control. The superior power cord will exhibit more natural midrange. Together, the superior power cord has the potential to transform the system. This is in direct contrast to the inferior power cord, which would be stock, and poorly engineered high-end power cords.

OK, more or less the sonic attributes I expected you to write. I heard similar things from the audio file power cords I tried with the exception of a more natural sounding mid range that reminded me more of the instruments and voices I hear when listening to live on amplified. One of the things I noticed with fancy cords is that aspects of the sound were enhanced as you describe, and they were heard consistently regardless of recording. The fancy cords made my music collection sound more and more similar and I found myself focusing on the sound rather than the music.

I agree with you that chords and wires are extremely important and should be very carefully selected by the listener. However, I disagree that everyone is gonna have the same values and criteria, and be looking for the same things. I want my system to disappear and not draw attention to itself. I want to relax and enjoy listening to the music. I suppose everyone wants that, but I don’t think everyone agrees on how to get there.

Could you explain what you mean by “within the sound field” and “superior sound staging“?

 

[Ted Denney III]

OK, more or less the sonic attributes I expected you to write. I heard similar things from the audio file power cords I tried with the exception of a more natural sounding mid range that reminded me more of the instruments and voices I hear when listening to live on amplified. One of the things I noticed with fancy cords is that aspects of the sound were enhanced as you describe, and they were heard consistently regardless of recording. The fancy cords made my music collection sound more and more similar and I found myself focusing on the sound rather than the music.

I agree with you that chords and wires are extremely important and should be very carefully selected by the listener. However, I disagree that everyone is gonna have the same values and criteria, and be looking for the same things. I want my system to disappear and not draw attention to itself. I want to relax and enjoy listening to the music. I suppose everyone wants that, but I don’t think everyone agrees on how to get there.

Could you explain what you mean by “within the sound field” and “superior sound staging“?

Once upon a very long time ago, starting in August 1992 when I was 28 years old, I offered SR’s first loom of cables: interconnects Mark I through Mark IV and speaker cables Mark IS and Mark IIS. They were different geometries and materials that you could try. They all cost the same amount of money, and you would pick the one that worked best in your system. This informed my design approach for two decades. Then I discovered a way to interact with the electromagnetic field, which is the signal around the cable where the cable is essentially a waveguide.

Now we have a way that you can subtly voice the cable with either a warmer or cooler UEF EM attractant, or none at all. You listen to these three options on a cable-by-cable basis, where you will prefer one of the two UEF attractants predominantly, but with notable outliers. It is this duality that creates a dramatic system match: a bespoke cable loom where no two systems arrive at the exact same conclusions.

 

[Ted Denney III]

Could you explain what you mean by “within the sound field” and “superior sound staging“?

Superior sound staging would be sound staging that does not phantom center image, but holds constant as you walk around the listening room. It would also indicate that a 90 pound woman would not have the size of Jabba the Hutt, and that images not only image along the plane of the speakers (or worse, tweeters), but on a 4D axis.

Within the sound field would indicate is the Sound Stage maintaining tonal density at its edges, or is it more dense as sound gets closer to the speakers. I hope this makes some sense.