I find that surprising since the Technics was a consumer machine and the Studer is a professional machine.
I'm tempted but my brain keeps telling me No.
- Thread starter RogerD
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I find that surprising since the Technics was a consumer machine and the Studer is a professional machine.
Bruce
A tube gear with transformer coupling will have more noise than the transistor circuit and also NFB can kill some noise but without NFB can provide more live feel and emotion, it is the question of give and take depend on a personal taste or by the level of the rest of the system
tony ma
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
See what I mean... you're not going to get better than the Studer unless you spend the $5k for the King and more $$ for the heads!
It's instructive to note the frequency -lol- with which Studer is regarded as a standard against which others will be compared.
I had a phone discussion with Fred Thal whom asked me about my impressions of stock Studer electronics.
I remarked there were external head amps which were sonically satisfying and superseded the stock Studer repro electronics.
He described one of the objectives for Studer was to deliver a deck that would perform exquisitely in an inhospitable environment, e.g., proximity to a broadcast transmitter/tower. The implication was Studer accomplished that objective.
I recently purchased a NOS, 1/4", 2 CH, NAB repro head. I contemplated Flux Magnetics, but elected to remain all Studer...in this case, 1.318.726.81.
I had a phone discussion with Fred Thal whom asked me about my impressions of stock Studer electronics.
I remarked there were external head amps which were sonically satisfying and superseded the stock Studer repro electronics.
He described one of the objectives for Studer was to deliver a deck that would perform exquisitely in an inhospitable environment, e.g., proximity to a broadcast transmitter/tower. The implication was Studer accomplished that objective.
I recently purchased a NOS, 1/4", 2 CH, NAB repro head. I contemplated Flux Magnetics, but elected to remain all Studer...in this case, 1.318.726.81.
I use Studer butterfly heads on the A80 machines. Not sure what the Flux Magnetics heads sound like, but the Studer heads sound very natural across the range to me. I will stick with Studer heads. With electronics, a change in parts, tubes etc. we tinkerers are always "looking" for more. I think the stock Studer is an amazing machine, built like a Swiss watch, all the parts fit so well.. the machining is incredible.
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I was told several years ago from the person I bought my Studer from and who was very knowledgeable in all things Studer. When I discussed with him my bypassing the internal electronics for an external tape head preamp, he said to me, "if Willie Studer wanted an external preamp for his machines he would have built one himself"
His point was how good the original internal electronics were
His point was how good the original internal electronics were
people should believe their own ear, I am not sure Willie Studer did try to listen his A80 in all tubes system in that time because they don't use tube gear anymore in that time of A80, in the time of C37 with tube but the tape quality was not as good as today ( high output), also same in microphone quality much better today, inside the repro amp of A80, parts quality are not bad but we can have more better today too especially caps quality. when you shorter the sound path from head to output can have a big improve (with out board amp) if you are not to use the recording system of the deck and just for play back only
+1
Every ear is different. Most of these machines are 25+ years old now and need to be upgraded. I would never expect any solid state RTR to have a sound signature of a tube machine. That being said solid state recorders can sound very good. The Studer to my ear is very neutral.a touch sterile,and the sound stage is not quite up to my standards. Is a Studer machine worth listening to and owning...hell yes. I would gladly have a room full of Studers if I could upgrade the stock electronics and reproduce a 3 dimensional sound stage with actually having the qualities of what is actually on the original tape. I have gotten very close with my 440,but that level of reproduction is,I don't think possible with stock or even upgraded Studer electronics. Anyway that is just my opinion and mastering with a Studer is a whole different ball game,then the electronics are not a problem. The trick when upgrading any studio quality machine is to preserve the original signature and improve the level of reproduction. When I play Frank Sinatra recorded on Ampex 300's I want to know with out a doubt,the original machine was a 300 tube deck. Can I reproduce that absolutely stunning sound on a stock Studer? That's where I'm coming from.
Hello again Mr. Bruce B.
Knowing you used high quality shielded cables attached to the DeHavilland to the tape deck, what do you think caused the problem with RFI? What were the other qualities about the DeHavilland you did not like if you would care to say? Thanks so much for your continued help.
jazzbo Bob
That is my thinking
This machine is a total system and is the approach championed by Studer.
I'm reluctant to modify considering what unintended consequence might accrue.
Paul Stubblebine indicated as much to me when I first had the privilege and pleasure of meeting him at RMAF '09.
The stock Studer electronics are pretty darn good and yes -- it can be improved.
Tony Ma mentions he has problems with RF during certain parts of the day with his tube tape head pre amp. I thought this would have much to do with the quality of cables used from the outboard tape head pre amp. I may be mistaken it would appear. RF may be confined to certain tape head pre amps? If the cables are not the culprits then what is and how can RFI be eliminated completely or at least reduced so that it's not a problem?
Bob
Bob
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
I don't know... I know Kara had me try different power cords. I have some of the best shielded cables available, so don't know what was going on. That's the first and LAST time I've ever had a problem with RF.
Also, I couldn't get the adjustments correct for my MRL tapes. If memory serves me, I couldn't adjust the HF and gain to gel correctly. It may have just been a compatibility problem with my Flux ER heads.
That is my thinking
This machine is a total system and is the approach championed by Studer.
I'm reluctant to modify considering what unintended consequence might accrue.
Paul Stubblebine indicated as much to me when I first had the privilege and pleasure of meeting him at RMAF '09.
The stock Studer electronics are pretty darn good and yes -- it can be improved.
Here ya go Sam,give it a try. I would be really interested in how they sound.
http://www.audioupgrades.com/
Good afternoon Mr. Bruce B. I want to thank you for your quick response. I am amazed you would have that problem with the DeHavilland tube tape head pre amp. Just goes to show that RF can pop up at any time no matter the equipment.
Bob
Bob
Hi Bob
RFI may not from the cable, if the signal is too strong they can go from city power supply , when I studied in Tokyo long time ago, I can hear a guy must very near from my home talking in the night from his long wave radio transmitter his side only not the other side when I just turn on the power amp only, tube gear also can pick those things very easy, add a by pass cap or add more negative feed back in the circuit will help but will give up some sensitivity of the amp,
tony ma
Good Saturday Morning Mr. Tony MA,
Thank you so much for responding. Many years ago I use to repair TV's (now you just throw them away and buy another) and I noted that many persons had problems with ghosts on their TV screen which I attributed to strong RF signals. Back then there were many AM and FM radio stations. Today there is so much more communication technology available that can contribute to RFI. Thanks again for your comments.
Bob
Thank you so much for responding. Many years ago I use to repair TV's (now you just throw them away and buy another) and I noted that many persons had problems with ghosts on their TV screen which I attributed to strong RF signals. Back then there were many AM and FM radio stations. Today there is so much more communication technology available that can contribute to RFI. Thanks again for your comments.
Bob
Hey Bob,
I have only read this last page sounds like you are having some type RF problem yes? I have a BH Tube Repro and the DeHavilland 222 model tape pre, I use Mogami cables on the tape pre's and do not have any RF issues at all...
I have only read this last page sounds like you are having some type RF problem yes? I have a BH Tube Repro and the DeHavilland 222 model tape pre, I use Mogami cables on the tape pre's and do not have any RF issues at all...
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