KeithR's "Dream Speaker" Search

the sound of Tao

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Well, you know, I don't either. Zu is quite small. "Larger-scale" manufacturers in this tiny corner of business are not very big anymore. Nothing is like when Dynaco sold 1 million A25s. But the figure came from him, informed by his own and his customer service people's conversations with customers. But I will say that the intersection between audiophiles and musicophiles is overall a small overlap.

Phil
It did sound like it could do with a spot check audit by the hyperbole department but let’s assume he was using exaggeration to create emphasis I still think that most here today have way more music than they can fully consume rather than not enough.

Also audiophiles who don’t have a deep connection with music or a good level of exposure to music are even a much rarer phenomenon IME. Some of us may be caught up in moments of sonic infatuation, we may not all share the same taste but most here seem to have a very strong relationship with music and some also have very high levels of understanding and music knowledge base as well. I think a lot of stuff said about audiophile traits are caught up in what we read in the short grabs of audio focussed fora posts and may not express the fullness of our musical diversity and cultural breadth.

We all love gear here but let’s face it’d be a rubbish pursuit without the music.
 
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213Cobra

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It did sound like it could do with a spot check audit by the hyperbole department but let’s assume he was using exaggeration to create emphasis I still think that most here today have way more music than they can fully consume rather than not enough.

Also audiophiles who don’t have a deep connection with music or a good level of exposure to music are even a much rarer phenomenon IME. Some of us may be caught up in moments of sonic infatuation, we may not all share the same taste but most here seem to have a very strong relationship with music and some also have very high levels of understanding and music knowledge base as well. I think a lot of stuff said about audiophile traits are caught up in what we read in the short grabs of audio focussed fora posts and may not express the fullness of our musical diversity and cultural breadth.

We all love gear here but let’s face it’d be a rubbish pursuit without the music.
Let's not assume that WBF is representative of the full hifi-buying (even high-end-alone) public.
 

jeff1225

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I don't know why you all are still participating in this thread.....this thread is dead. Keith has found his "Dream Speaker," but he has not found his "Dream Amp."
 

rbbert

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I don't know why you all are still participating in this thread.....this thread is dead. Keith has found his "Dream Speaker," but he has not found his "Dream Amp."
Because this thread was never really about Keith or his search :p
 
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rbbert

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No...it was about both.
For you, perhaps, and maybe Keith, but it almost immediately morphed into what is best (and worst) about WBF.
 

Al M.

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For you, perhaps, and maybe Keith, but it almost immediately morphed into what is best (and worst) about WBF.

But that's the fun of it ;).
 
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ctydwn

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Very interesting. I would like to think it is the second. I cross my sub over at 28/29hz currently which seems to hit the sweet spot for me. But I would guess the first as I don’t think the H2.2s can carry that consistently between 30 and 50Hz... hope I’m wrong!
 

KeithR

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the latest and greatest:

I've been waiting patiently for a Rowland or set of Lamms to try, but in the meantime have experienced some more grounding issues with the Ampzillas. As of a week ago, I switched back on my A/C as the weather has finally heated up - and along with it came a series of blown fuses. It would happen both direct to the outlets on a AC voltage sag or even on the Torus at random times when the automatic voltage regulator switched taps. Had it happen with or without current, too.

As a reminder, my voltage has been steady since I moved in last fall - but I fear the combination of heat and COVID-19 has been tough. Too many people sapping energy off the grid with the stay at home orders.

That said, I spoke with SST (Ampzilla) and they believe 100% related to grounding and suggested running an extension cord to my kitchen GFI outlet and see if the problem goes away. The amps' loop feedback apparently doesn't like floating grounds and can drive the amps into oscillation hence the blow fuses. So off to HD today and installed a 3-tap extension cord. I tried both amp direct to outlet and through the Torus and still find the Torus a big sonic improvement.

We shall see when the A/C cycles on later today if this workaround resolves the issue. I will look to installing a ground rod next or else will just have to sell the amps and take my lumps. I can say the amps sound wonderful - in particular with some new Zu Ibis speaker cables. They are more resolving, vivid than my previous Events (and ironically discontinued) and better suited on the YGs.
 

Barry2013

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Thank you for the update Keith.
I am pleased that you now have been able to determine the very likely origin of your previous problems.
Your mains always seemed to me to be the most likely culprit so do keep us posted. Others will, I am sure, be able to learn from your experiences.
 

Hi-FiGuy

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the latest and greatest:

I've been waiting patiently for a Rowland or set of Lamms to try, but in the meantime have experienced some more grounding issues with the Ampzillas. As of a week ago, I switched back on my A/C as the weather has finally heated up - and along with it came a series of blown fuses. It would happen both direct to the outlets on a AC voltage sag or even on the Torus at random times when the automatic voltage regulator switched taps. Had it happen with or without current, too.

As a reminder, my voltage has been steady since I moved in last fall - but I fear the combination of heat and COVID-19 has been tough. Too many people sapping energy off the grid with the stay at home orders.

That said, I spoke with SST (Ampzilla) and they believe 100% related to grounding and suggested running an extension cord to my kitchen GFI outlet and see if the problem goes away. The amps' loop feedback apparently doesn't like floating grounds and can drive the amps into oscillation hence the blow fuses. So off to HD today and installed a 3-tap extension cord. I tried both amp direct to outlet and through the Torus and still find the Torus a big sonic improvement.

We shall see when the A/C cycles on later today if this workaround resolves the issue. I will look to installing a ground rod next or else will just have to sell the amps and take my lumps. I can say the amps sound wonderful - in particular with some new Zu Ibis speaker cables. They are more resolving, vivid than my previous Events (and ironically discontinued) and better suited on the YGs.

I am particularity interested in the progress and outcome of this on multiple levels.
 

KeithR

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Thank you for the update Keith.
I am pleased that you now have been able to determine the very likely origin of your previous problems.
Your mains always seemed to me to be the most likely culprit so do keep us posted. Others will, I am sure, be able to learn from your experiences.

There is no sonic issue, Barry. In fact, none of the other amps had related issues. It’s issue-specific to these amps as confirmed with the manufacturer.
 

Barry2013

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There is no sonic issue, Barry. In fact, none of the other amps had related issues. It’s issue-specific to these amps as confirmed with the manufacturer.
Thanks Keith
It may be that my memory is letting me down but I clearly recall you having problems wih fuses blowing on earlier and different amps
 

KeithR

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Hey guys, just thought I'd give an update on my YG Hailey system. First, the power issues have been isolated - my MSB dac just doesn't play nice with the Music First preamplifier. I can run the MSB direct to the amps with no issues, but stick the preamplifier in and can get a blown fuse when my air conditioner comes on. I've had multiple discussions with MSB and SST and they've never heard of anything like it in 15 years.

I also had LADWP out due to a brown out and they checked my power lines out back (one had tripped at the transformer so I was only getting 100-102v one day) - I am getting a steady 115v now which is in spec here. It drops to 110v on hot days, but that also meets minimum spec. There are no grounding issues as mentioned before.

Onward to amps - boy have I had an experience in the past four months. I've now had the pleasure of auditioning or owning the following amps:

Audio Research Ref160 monos
M2Tech Crosby Class D monos
Luxman m900 stereo
PS Audio BHK Signature 300 monos
Ampzilla 2000, 2nd edition monos
Jeff Rowland 625s2 stereo

What I've determined (and pretty much understood going in) is the YGs love power- this took out the ARC and Luxman. The m2techs drove the speaker fine, but I still felt a class D-ness to timber on them along with some non-smoothness in the highs (admittedly they are $2500/pair list). The BHK tube hybrids were indeed powerful and did some nice things like tone and decay, but weren't a great match with the lens-like YG. I felt they would be far superior on a wood speaker and indeed they sounded better on a friend's JBL hybrid PBN speakers. In my experience, the "tube" part of the hybrid wasn't that sensitive - its the output stage where the sound comes from. We rolled tubes with a rather small effect.

Today, as reflected in the picture below, I have the Ampzilla and Rowland. The Ampzillas have been here since March and do a good job holistically top to bottom on the speaker. They aren't the last word in resolution and I think have too much leading edge, not enough decay but have been a good amp on this speaker. I chose the Rowland as it has 600 wpc into 4 ohms, is known for good tone, and is Class AB and doesn't run super hot (although it actually runs much hotter than I thought). Other considerations at the time included Pass X350.8 and the Parasound JC1+.

The Rowland has been running in for almost 300 hours or so, but not much changed after 200. The Rowland has a warm, almost creamy, very tube-like midrange at times. It does instruments in space that are fuller than the Ampzilla, but doesn't have the holistic nature of the latter. It also doesn't have the ultimate bass and slam of the Ampzillas and I feel is a little thin in the upper bass/lower midrange. Interestingly enough, I initially installed the amp on top of my Ampzillas + towel + cutting board (due to space limitations with so many amps!) and it was quite thin in the lower midrange and bass but that changed significantly when I moved it to the floor. As a result, all my comparisons had to be revisited.

I like both amps on different music, but neither has totally clicked yet. I've had 3 audiophiles visit, each with different opinions as well. Gun to my head I'd take the Rowland as long term erring on the side of warmth and flow is better on a YG speaker. That said, my next step is to get a tube preamplifier as the Music First doesn't work with the Ampzilla at all - I am leaning to the Linear Tudio MicroZOTL which is licensed from David Berning. To that end, I have ordered Mogami RCAs to make the long run from a RCA-output only preamp.

So the journey continues and hopefully by the end of the summer I will have achieved a perfect match for the YGs that doesn't cost Dagostino or Audionet type dollars.
 

bonzo75

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Symphonic line Kraft, used.
 

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