KLAUDiO RCM EOL

Jan 29, 2012
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#41
Well, devices that take part in recreating sound, and are sensitive to vibration affecting that sound, can have a benefits of weighing more. I think that relies on the design and actual materials more so though, IMHO. I got a new turntable recently that's very light yet I find it built to the highest possible degree and sounds superb. Then you look at Mike's new Saskia table which is ungodly heavy and it is also built extremely well and sounds superb. I really see no relation to actual weight making any difference whatsoever, especially for a RCM.
Well then you simply don't understand what makes construction of a mechanical device robust or not. I guess you don't own power tools.

On a happy note, maybe this will be the one piece of stereo equipment my 8 year old daughter can move around.
 

djsina2

Active Member
May 31, 2019
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#42
Well then you simply don't understand what makes construction of a mechanical device robust or not. I guess you don't own power tools.

On a happy note, maybe this will be the one piece of stereo equipment my 8 year old daughter can move around.
Like I said, this is not an industrial tool where the rigors of use need some sort of over the top construction. I am baffled why you would think something that encounters no stress needs to be encased in a bomb proof structure. I guess this is where we will differ. I own a complete shop of tools and do amateur home remodeling on the side. I also have a hobby CNC machine and have restored cars and built engines. :D
 
Likes: mulveling
Jan 29, 2012
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#43
If you own tools you have no excuse for your "weight doesn't matter" argument. I assumed it was ignorance now I understand it's just hubris.
 

djsina2

Active Member
May 31, 2019
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#44
I'm sorry, but I really have no idea what you are talking about at this point. I guess we should leave it at that.
 

tima

Industry Expert
Mar 4, 2014
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#45
Yes, you would think so. This was therefore surprising to see how the KL could not improve it no matter how many washes yet the Degritter did with one.
What your anecdote suggests to me is not that one machine cleans so much better than another but that using multiple ultrasonic frequencies may be more effective than using one.

You can never clean the same record twice. Imo it is near impossible to base a comparison on cleaning a record in one machine then cleaning the same record in a different machine.
 
Likes: jeffrey_t

djsina2

Active Member
May 31, 2019
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#46
What your anecdote suggests to me is not that one machine cleans so much better than another but that using multiple ultrasonic frequencies may be more effective than using one.

You can never clean the same record twice. Imo it is near impossible to base a comparison on cleaning a record in one machine then cleaning the same record in a different machine.
That is possible, but since the KL made no appreciable difference after multiple cleanings and the Degritter did I would say the Degritter cleaned better. Also, taking a new record or a record with no issues and running one through each cleaner I heard a more noticeable improvement with the Degritter. Unlikely that after 10 cleanings with the KL I got lucky and the 11th pass would have fixed it with either machine. I guess saying one cleans better than the other is too controversial for this forum so we should ignore that and focus on the other aspects. It's undeniable that the Degritter has more features, finer adjustments, has a filtering system, is quieter, is easier to fill and clean, is firmware controlled, and is much cheaper.
 
Jan 29, 2012
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#47
That is possible, but since the KL made no appreciable difference after multiple cleanings and the Degritter did I would say the Degritter cleaned better. Also, taking a new record or a record with no issues and running one through each cleaner I heard a more noticeable improvement with the Degritter. Unlikely that after 10 cleanings with the KL I got lucky and the 11th pass would have fixed it with either machine. I guess saying one cleans better than the other is too controversial for this forum so we should ignore that and focus on the other aspects. It's undeniable that the Degritter has more features, finer adjustments, has a filtering system, is quieter, is easier to fill and clean, is firmware controlled, and is much cheaper.
*and it made of less expensive materials.
 

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
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Northern NY
#49
So degritter should be considered ? Looks like a toaster and not as well built from first glance. It does have 300 watt vs 200watt. I am not sure I want more violent ultrasonic action on my finest vintage LP's ??? It is $900 less than the external tanked KL. I have had no issues with the KL since day 1 (2013). It is a first or second production run unit. I'm still leaning KL although the degritter has given me more pause to do more research and hear more opinions. I don't buy the side by side listening tests as they are impossible to really do in the first place unless you artificially soil copies of the same record identically and then wash each one and compare subjectively.

Cleaning fluid in the bath is not ideal for my cleaning regiment. I hand scrub records with cleaners and micro towel dry (first time only) before going into the KL. Think of it as an ultrasoinc scrub/rinse/dry. I do change water every 30 cycles with my method.
 
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spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
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#51
Christian, KL was a no go for the majority of UK buyers, esp w the much suspected crazy mark up from the distributor.

I remain amazed KL didn't go to a direct sales model.

W the KL at c£6k, ADS at just over £3k and Degritter rrp closer to £2-2.5k, KL had no chance here.
 

djsina2

Active Member
May 31, 2019
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#52
Cleaning fluid in the bath is not ideal for my cleaning regiment. I hand scrub records with cleaners and micro towel dry (first time only) before going into the KL. Think of it as an ultrasoinc scrub/rinse/dry. I do change water every 30 cycles with my method.
If you don't want cleaning fluid in your water then don't put cleaning fluid in it. it's not a requirement.
 

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
7,116
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Northern NY
#53
Christian, KL was a no go for the majority of UK buyers, esp w the much suspected crazy mark up from the distributor.

I remain amazed KL didn't go to a direct sales model.

W the KL at c£6k, ADS at just over £3k and Degritter rrp closer to £2-2.5k, KL had no chance here.
Cost isn't the issue(for me)...effectiveness and reliabliity are. Degritter is too new for a reliability track record.
 
Likes: tima

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
11,057
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E. England
#55
I don't think so, Christian. Try again.
 

dminches

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
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#56
I will be tempted to get some of the Degritter soap for use in my KLAudio, seems a reasonable test as I have a few records that have some pops and clicks that have not gone away with multiple cleanings.
When I have this issue I find that the only way to treat it is to manually clean the record with a solution and Disk Doctor brush. I have been using L’Art du son. It works great to pre-scrub and then pop it into an ultrasonic.
 

dminches

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
1,309
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#57
Cost isn't the issue(for me)...effectiveness and reliabliity are. Degritter is too new for a reliability track record.
Christian, it is time to build your own. Tim and I have found they work the best.
 
May 30, 2010
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#59
IMHO the requirements and mechanisms needed for a small size fully automatic cleaning machine in a single step are too ambitious for the budgets being considered. A reliable simple automatic machine would need to plunge the immersed part of the rotating LPs and then lift them to be dried outside the tank. Such system would however be too large for typical users.
 

tima

Industry Expert
Mar 4, 2014
1,568
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#60
Did you, by chance, use the Degritter cleaning solution in the water when cleaning with Degritter, or plain distilled water? Did you try using the solution in the KLAudio machine? Perhaps the effectiveness is enhanced by the cleaning solution... a tiny amount of “soap” might make a difference helping release stubborn particles.
I thought Klaudio was pretty clear about not using cleaning agents in their machines - did that change?
 

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