LampizatOr Golden Atlantic + TRP

[Carlsbad]

What heater setting are you using with the 01A in your GG3?

300B. Both are 5V.

 

[christoph]

300B. Both are 5V.

IIrc a fellow Lampi user told me he preferred the 01A even a little more (slightly undervolted?) on the (not absolutely correct) 101d/PX25 setting.

Maybe you can try that as well and see if you like what you hear?

He is VERY experienced and told me that one can try that without any danger for the tube or DAC.

 

[Carlsbad]

@christoph Thanks for that. Coincindentaly, yesterday I was reading a historical tube data sheet and I saw a comment to the effect that "...the 01A heater can be run at a lower voltage, perhaps 4 V, to extend tube life..." I also was putting together a spreadsheet of parameters for the tubes that my GG3 has specified on the selector switch. As a physicist, I'd rather they just published parameters--heater and plate voltages along with max amps that the power supply is rated for, if applicable.

POSITION	TUBE	VOLTAGE	AMPS	Plate
1	300b	5	1.25	400
2	101D	4.5	1	190
2	PX25	4	2	400
3	PX4	4	1	300
4	242	4	.9	400
5	45	2.5	1.5	300
Other tubes
	01A	5	0.25	135
	201A	5	0.25	135

Notice I have 2 entries for position 2. Both PX25 and 101D are listed there. There isn't much differene between the tube specs for position 2 and 3. Note that 01A max plate voltage is much lower but I sometimes suspect that the Lampizator DACs run at lower plate voltages (maybe lower heater voltages too). I plan to do some measurements eventually.

So I chose position 3 for the 01A instead of position 2 for the lower plate voltage. Still it is higher than specified but I've been able to run plate voltages higher than specified with no issues before. The risk is to the tubes and the 01As are not expensive.

My initial listening impression is very good but I haven't had a chance to A/B going back and forth. The thoriated tungsten filaments still glow nicely, perhaps a level that looks more sustainable.

thanks,
Jerry

 

[Golum]

I'm 99% sure you have wrong data for 242 tube. Please re-check that one. There is NOS 242 one and KR242 and they are different spec wise

Cheers;
G

EDIT: I found the spec for KR242:
Filament specifications: DC/AC Voltage 4.0 V
DC/AC Current 0.65 A
Amplification Factor 20
___________________________________________________________________________
Maximum
DC Plate Voltage 600 V
DC Plate Current 50 mA
Dissipation 20 W
__________________________________________________________________________
DC Plate Voltage 400 V
DC Plate Current 50 mA
Grid Voltage - 8 V
Plate Resistance 4 kohm
Transconductance 5 mA/V

Lampizator Valve / Tube Rolling Review Thread | What's Best Audio and Video Forum. The Best High End Audio Forum on the planet! (whatsbestforum.com)

PS Not really sure why this DHT discussion is in TRP section on another note

 

[Carlsbad]

Thanks for the check and sorry I may have hijacked this thread. but I want to edit to make sure there is no incorrect info posted. So the Lampizator DACs are designed for the modern KR 242, correct? I will edit.

Turns out I pulled data off a datasheet for a 242A tube, which obviously isn't the same. I have edited to get the right values in the table. I have a few more thoughts on this issue and I will eventually post it on the big tube rolling thread. For now I'll shut down this discussion on the TRP thread. thanks.

 

[highstream]

Thanks for the check and sorry I may have hijacked this thread. but I want to edit to make sure there is no incorrect info posted. So the Lampizator DACs are designed for the modern KR 242, correct? I will edit.

Turns out I pulled data off a datasheet for a 242A tube, which obviously isn't the same. I have edited to get the right values in the table. I have a few more thoughts on this issue and I will eventually post it on the big tube rolling thread. For now I'll shut down this discussion on the TRP thread. thanks.

There is a GG impressions thread and especially a Lampizator Valve / Tube Rolling thread where these posts would be on topic and you’d find more experienced interaction.

 

[budburma]

I got an RCA Radiotron 280, which from what I read is supposed to be the same as the 80, 180 and I think 380 (is that true?). Mine was used but still tested reasonably good. What I hear from this one after a good 150 hours of re-burnin in a GG3 and with Marko’s 5Z3 adapter is a very good sounding tube with a bit of warmth (good), good pitch, articulation, speed and rendering of voices. It’s main limitations so far are heavy handedness, i.e., not much instrumental delicacy, and not quite the level of transparency and three dimensionslity of the very best (and most expensive) rectis, such as the RGN2004 meshes, and I presume the Valvo 2504.

It's true! Could be older than the 80. I believe that family started as UX280's - globes through the '20's and ST in the '30's. I have an globe RCA/Cunningham CX380 on the way....also from the '20's. 100 years old. Wow.

 

[Designsfx]

It's true! Could be older than the 80. I believe that family started as UX280's - globes through the '20's and ST in the '30's. I have a globe RCA/Cunningham CX380 on the way....also from the '20's. 100 years old. Wow.

I don’t recall where I found this but will post here for those who appreciate the ever so awesome RCA Globe 80!

 

[wisnon]

@christoph Thanks for that. Coincindentaly, yesterday I was reading a historical tube data sheet and I saw a comment to the effect that "...the 01A heater can be run at a lower voltage, perhaps 4 V, to extend tube life..." I also was putting together a spreadsheet of parameters for the tubes that my GG3 has specified on the selector switch. As a physicist, I'd rather they just published parameters--heater and plate voltages along with max amps that the power supply is rated for, if applicable.

POSITION	TUBE	VOLTAGE	AMPS	Plate
1	300b	5	1.25	400
2	101D	4.5	1	190
2	PX25	4	2	400
3	PX4	4	1	300
4	242	4	.9	400
5	45	2.5	1.5	300
Other tubes
	01A	5	0.25	135
	201A	5	0.25	135

Notice I have 2 entries for position 2. Both PX25 and 101D are listed there. There isn't much differene between the tube specs for position 2 and 3. Note that 01A max plate voltage is much lower but I sometimes suspect that the Lampizator DACs run at lower plate voltages (maybe lower heater voltages too). I plan to do some measurements eventually.

So I chose position 3 for the 01A instead of position 2 for the lower plate voltage. Still it is higher than specified but I've been able to run plate voltages higher than specified with no issues before. The risk is to the tubes and the 01As are not expensive.

My initial listening impression is very good but I haven't had a chance to A/B going back and forth. The thoriated tungsten filaments still glow nicely, perhaps a level that looks more sustainable.

thanks,
Jerry

Yep, I would go with position 3 too. The Dac will auto-correct as long as the total power draw is 8w or less. 01A uses minimal amps so it will get its needed 5v. I will again test to see if PX25 sounds better on Position 2 or 3.

 

[wisnon]

I'm 99% sure you have wrong data for 242 tube. Please re-check that one. There is NOS 242 one and KR242 and they are different spec wise

Cheers;
G

EDIT: I found the spec for KR242:
Filament specifications: DC/AC Voltage 4.0 V
DC/AC Current 0.65 A
Amplification Factor 20
___________________________________________________________________________
Maximum
DC Plate Voltage 600 V
DC Plate Current 50 mA
Dissipation 20 W
__________________________________________________________________________
DC Plate Voltage 400 V
DC Plate Current 50 mA
Grid Voltage - 8 V
Plate Resistance 4 kohm
Transconductance 5 mA/V

Lampizator Valve / Tube Rolling Review Thread | What's Best Audio and Video Forum. The Best High End Audio Forum on the planet! (whatsbestforum.com)

PS Not really sure why this DHT discussion is in TRP section on another note

KR Audio 242 - Low Frequency, high power triode. 5-10 Watts of pure class-A power. Maximum Plate Voltage 400 V Maximum Plate Current 50 mA Filament Voltage 4 V (DC/AC) Filament Current .9 A SPECIAL ORDERED ITEM. THIS ITEM IS MADE TO ORDER. ALLOW 4 TO 6 WEEKS DELIVERY AFTER INITIAL ORDER.

242-KR

KR Audio 242 - Low Frequency, high power triode. <strong>SPECIAL ORDERED ITEM.</strong> <strong>THIS ITEM IS MADE TO ORDER.</strong> <strong>ALLOW 4 TO 6 WEEKS DELIVERY AFTER INITIAL ORDER.</strong>

solen.ca

 

[wisnon]

It's true! Could be older than the 80. I believe that family started as UX280's - globes through the '20's and ST in the '30's. I have an globe RCA/Cunningham CX380 on the way....also from the '20's. 100 years old. Wow.

I got the 280 and 380 as well. VERY old and very lush sounding. Female jazz vocal tubes.

 

[budburma]

I got the 280 and 380 as well. VERY old and very lush sounding. Female jazz vocal tubes.

That seems nice but a little limited. And kind of within my diagnosable sonic sweet tooth (SST) disorder. (More gold or gold plated copper, please....). The ears will tell! To be fair and with full disclosure, my old dog ears have lost a fair amount of high frequency. Enough that when the the TV subtitle reads "High pitched whining sound", I hear crickets and my wife give me a sympathetic "awww" when I ask if she can here it.....

With that in mind, and to me, the Majestic 80 sounds nice and full, but my Valvo az1 mesh is REALLY outstanding. More detailed, less but plenty warm and more layered stage. Too bad they're like pricey hen's teeth (and good thing I have a spare from moons ago)!

Let's be honest, over a grand for any tube is intimidating and way deep into the realm of diminishing returns. Not that they may not sound the best, but, at best, it puts a limit on wide ranging exploration and, at worst, makes it unobtanium for many.

That said, @Designsfx is onto something with the 6j5 family. All warnings from other members both appreciated and understood, but also cast aside if the wizards of Warsaw give the green light. The design is to have broad TRP acceptance and, apparently, is broader than anticipated - HUZZAH!

I have the GE/Kenrad '48 metals in and, man, they are terrific. More to be listened to for a full comparison with the (my) vaunted 6384's but at a fraction of the cost, they are hard to be argued against right out of the box. And for the one slim Andy Jackson. Now THAT's ROI.

I'll say it's more musical and layered, not as wide a stage with better bass note definition for now and irght out of the box. Exciting enough to pick up pairs of Sylvania -GT/G's and TS VT94D's and look hard at some British L63's. They can start getting a little pricey, but findable, affordable and seem to be the cream from what I can gather by reading....O'll be listening later to confirm and expand. It's a vast new landscape of expanded and affordable opportunity for sure! Muchas gracias, @Designsfx!

 

[budburma]

That seems nice but a little limited. And kind of within my diagnosable sonic sweet tooth (SST) disorder. (More gold or gold plated copper, please....). The ears will tell! To be fair and with full disclosure, my old dog ears have lost a fair amount of high frequency. Enough that when the the TV subtitle reads "High pitched whining sound", I hear crickets and my wife give me a sympathetic "awww" when I ask if she can here it.....

With that in mind, and to me, the Majestic 80 sounds nice and full, but my Valvo az1 mesh is REALLY outstanding. More detailed, less but plenty warm and more layered stage. Too bad they're like pricey hen's teeth (and good thing I have a spare from moons ago)!

Let's be honest, over a grand for any tube is intimidating and way deep into the realm of diminishing returns. Not that they may not sound the best, but, at best, it puts a limit on wide ranging exploration and, at worst, makes it unobtanium for many.

That said, @Designsfx is onto something with the 6j5 family. All warnings from other members both appreciated and understood, but also cast aside if the wizards of Warsaw give the green light. The design is to have broad TRP acceptance and, apparently, is broader than anticipated - HUZZAH!

I have the GE/Kenrad '48 metals in and, man, they are terrific. More to be listened to for a full comparison with the (my) vaunted 6384's but at a fraction of the cost, they are hard to be argued against right out of the box. And for the one slim Andy Jackson. Now THAT's ROI.

I'll say it's more musical and layered, not as wide a stage with better bass note definition for now and irght out of the box. Exciting enough to pick up pairs of Sylvania -GT/G's and TS VT94D's and look hard at some British L63's. They can start getting a little pricey, but findable, affordable and seem to be the cream from what I can gather by reading....O'll be listening later to confirm and expand. It's a vast new landscape of expanded and affordable opportunity for sure! Muchas gracias, @Designsfx!

OOOOPS, *hear it.

 

[Blake]

With that in mind, and to me, the Majestic 80 sounds nice and full, but my Valvo az1 mesh is REALLY outstanding. More detailed, less but plenty warm and more layered stage. Too bad they're like pricey hen's teeth (and good thing I have a spare from moons ago)!

Hi,

This comment is surprising, as AZ1 mesh are super cheap. Are you sure you referenced the right tube? I've bought lots of them over the last year.

 

[budburma]

Hi,

This comment is surprising, as AZ1 mesh are super cheap. Are you sure you referenced the right tube? I've bought lots of them over the last year.

Hi Blake - I guess I'll eat some crow on that. They aren't overly expensive - if you go with some of the eBay italian dealers, they cab be overpriced, but nobody says we have to spend our money there. That said, I see a lot of Telefunken mesh around along with a vew Philips and not too many Valvo - and very few with the structure of the one I have that I really like. The TFNK with a central hook connector weren't as rich.

To be fair, the print is mostly gone from my AZ1 and it's unclear if it's a relabel or where it was made. It has a '102' on the base, straight central connector and a rectangular getter. Here are some pics - maybe someone can help ID it's date-ish and origin...

 

[budburma]

*

Hi Blake - I guess I'll eat some crow on that. They aren't overly expensive - if you go with some of the eBay italian dealers, they cab be overpriced, but nobody says we have to spend our money there. That said, I see a lot of Telefunken mesh around along with a vew Philips and not too many Valvo - and very few with the structure of the one I have that I really like. The TFNK with a central hook connector weren't as rich.

To be fair, the print is mostly gone from my AZ1 and it's unclear if it's a relabel or where it was made. It has a '102' on the base, straight central connector and a rectangular getter. Here are some pics - maybe someone can help ID it's date-ish and origin...

rectangular foil getter that is

 

[Blake]

Nice. Did you also try the AZ1 with the taller/narrower mesh plates? Take a pic of the very bottom of the tube, and you should see some letters.

From that, we can determine the month/year of manufacture.

 

[budburma]

@Blake Yes, the narrow TFKN are the ones I tried (bought from you, actually!) and much prefer the wider mesh plate Valvo. The bottom reads "7 DX". I actually have two of them - the other, which I haven't listened to yet, is overall smaller with the same straight central rod connection, but with a disk getter near the top and number 708 on the upper rim of the base, VR on the base and AD (?) on the bottom

 

[Blake]

Oh yes! Sorry, forgot about that sale. If I recall correctly, Mark of Sablon said he also prefers the Valvo. You are also right about the variation in construction of these tubes with several different variants.

For Valvo date codes, I never was able to find anything online. If someone has a link to decipher Valvo date codes , I'd be appreciative!

Personally, I liked TFKN AZ1 a little better in my system. I thought it had slightly better separation and better, more apparent staging (deeper stage), but Valvo was perhaps punchier/thicker? I enjoyed both in any event. I think of course Atlantic vs DHT Lampi and associated gear and preferences comes into play.

I still don't know of a bigger bang for the buck recti! The great thing is, they are inexpensive and it makes it fun to try all the variants.

There is also the TFKN RGN1064 mesh, with the different 4-pin base, but otherwise seems to be identical to TFKN AZ1 tall/narrow plate.

This RGN1064 is from Feb. of 1939, and has the writing 'for VE301, not for individual sale'. These were stock tubes for "the people's radio" VE301 Volksempfänger (“people's receiver" or “people's radio"), for pumping out nazi propaganda.

 

[highstream]

All we need is TP to make adapters for the AZ1 and 5Y3/Globe 80/180/280.