Ayre also likes more the time domain response
Most vinyl-sounding DAC?
- Thread starter asegal
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I think there is some confusion around what vinyl sounds like. Now that I use a Caliburn, I am consistently surprised by how quiet it is like digital, especially on higher quality pressings. Vinyl is not necessarily warm sounding. On some tracks there is remarkable similarity between my Rossini Apex and the Caliburn/Etna Lamda combination.
I think some audiophiles prefer a romantic sounding dac and that’s totally fine by me. But that doesn’t make it more vinyl-like.
What is the relationship between “perfect time domain response” and linearity? dCS prides itself on the improved linearity from the Apex upgrade. The company told me it is significantly more linear than Wadax.
In electronics when we imagine a component is linear then we use fourier transform to show frequency behaviour of that component :
en.m.wikipedia.org
Fourier transform - Wikipedia
fourier transform function (H) is the mathematic model of electronics linear components.
H function like Vector has two dimention:
- amplitude
- phase
H function like Vector has two dimention:
- amplitude
- phase
Amplitude means the amplitude of each frequency, for example if your loudspeaker has higher amplitude between 200hz - 400hz then we receive more energy in midbass
Phase means the angle of each frequency so if your component shift the angle then the phase is not ok and the signal in time domain will change.
for example ported bass of loudspeaker has good amplitude but it’s phase is not correct
for example ported bass of loudspeaker has good amplitude but it’s phase is not correct
This is the measurementof dCS Vivaldi Apex :
https://www.stereophile.com/content/dcs-vivaldi-apex-da-processor-measurements
https://www.stereophile.com/content/dcs-vivaldi-apex-da-processor-measurements
AMR time domain response
as you see both AMR (in NOS mode) and Emm Labs (Adaptive filter) have perfect time domain response without any phase shift
I recently got round to listening to a Denon 103 for the first time and it brought to mind the Rega DACr I used a few years back as a stopgap. We’re obviously not talking top drawer vinyl or digital here but that wasn’t the question. They share a certain point of view that eschews fine detail but communicates the music in a way that can engage the attention and hold it nevertheless. They both need sympathetic accompaniment, I ran my Rega DAC with a Naim Uniti Core and the choice of cable between the two had quite an impact on the enjoyability of the result, A Belden 4694R 12G SDI cable being my favourite not despite the use a BNC to RCA adaptor at the DAC end, a Chord Shawline or Clearway made the sound rather un involving. The Denon is on my Korf arm (highish mass) on a PTP Lenco and Ortofon arm lead in preference to the Lyra, phono is a Naim supercapped superline with a 560Ω load.
It's interesting when Thomas goes to Mikes and says its hard to hear a difference between Mikes digital and vinyl. Then Mikes reaponse is he got a new power supply for the DAC that closes the gap. That exchange goes along with what I have experienced. Vinyl and digital leap frog each other based on how much effort you put into them.
A point of consideration is that if they can be that close in a world class room, then how much effort does it take in any leaser system to have one better the other. Probably not a lot. And unfortunately the response from the online community will be polarized one direction of the other claiming you have deficiencies in the format they like and you need to invest more time and money to up the game to tune your system to meet random forum members beliefs.
A point of consideration is that if they can be that close in a world class room, then how much effort does it take in any leaser system to have one better the other. Probably not a lot. And unfortunately the response from the online community will be polarized one direction of the other claiming you have deficiencies in the format they like and you need to invest more time and money to up the game to tune your system to meet random forum members beliefs.
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Elliot G.
Industry Expert
couldnt disagree more. Making products that people want to use, know how to use and like to use only fosters growth and exploration.
There are tons of examples from cars to cameras, the computer, the internet etc.
The old school attitude in audio is a huge hinderance to growth and change
Based on what evidence?
And with respect to the impulse response graphs, what exactly is missing versus other options? If you read all the way through the technical analysis, John Atkinson concludes the technical review as follows:
"Like its Vivaldi predecessor and the Rossini Apex, the dCS Vivaldi Apex features superb measured performance.—John Atkinson"
Yep, based on what I have experienced visiting many other audiophile's systems there is always one source that I optimized and that biases that owner's view of the formats.
I believe with good setup both digital and analog can sound amazing. Good setup for digital can be tricky with the router and everything after it needing consideration. I am constantly amazed how big a difference a good cable or switch or power supply or line conditioner can make in a high resolution system.
Someone here has taken the trouble to see what happens when you use different digital filters with a DAC. from my own experience with soekris dac and operating with different fir filters from sharp to ultra slow (nos). I can say that the preringing filter (before the impulse) was perceived as a very unnatural sound (digital hardness more distortion in the treble) nos filter had more roll off in the treble did not feel imprecise. For me it sounds more analogue.
DAC digital filters part 2 – deeper dive into AK4490 and AK4493 filters - nihtila.com
This post delves into digital filters in AK4490 and AK4493 DACs used in W-DAC boards and provides extensive measurement results of the filters in time and frequency domain. This is not only relevant to these specific DAC chips and filters but general information on DAC digital filters from audio...
nihtila.com
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