RMAF 2013: Gear worth making the trip to Denver to hear... And not!
- Thread starter caesar
- Start date
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I have said the same thing since 2011. There is no reason why they can't hand out the badges on Thursday as people show up. There are always people there standing/sitting around doing lots of nothing behind the tables which have all of the badges.
RMAF 2013 impressions part 1:
This seems to have become the default RMAF impressions thread. I suppose this is as good a time as any to add my possibly gratuitous commentary.
I will reference to Steve's excellent photographic journal when possible.
I was at the show for two days. I like to be a bit of a phantom, going in and out of the rooms and hearing a bit of my own stuff without getting into prolonged lockjaw matches with the sales representatives, unless I have specific questions. Some of them recognized me from CAS 2013, so this was harder to do. The more you go to these things, they start to spot you coming. The first day, I was able to maintain some freshness. However, by the afternoon of the second day(Saturday) I found myself burning out rapidly.
The show served its purpose for me very well. I was looking for horn/flea power amplifier demos I could fall in love with, and I found them, along with several that were not so. I would have liked to have heard more Stats, but unfortunately I completely missed the Soundlab demo. I also regret missing the Koda stuff. I was also hoping there would be some SIT/VFET solid state amplifiers, but didn't find any if they were there. Just plain too much stuff to look at, and you have to pick your battles.
It was, of course, really great to "put a face" on the internet by meeting the handful of WBF contributors and touring a bit with Mark (mep) and Steve. Mark did not beat me up with a broom handle, for which I am grateful, as he was reserving his energies for the vendors.
There were several "lead balloons" to hear, as expected. I won't really go into many of them because I don't want to get into "vendor retaliation mode", but I will mention the Lansche demo.
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12355-Steve-s-RMAF-2013-Photo-Thread post 3
This one appeared to be comparable in grandiosity and expense to the Wilson XLF demo, but it was puzzling because it just sounded plain mediocre to me. The first time, Fremer was in there kanoodling with some of his own material and basking in the Ypsilon stuff, but quite frankly, even with his material, I just didn't get it. I rapidly moved on. The second time I heard them on Saturday was no better.
To get it out of the way again, the Wilson XLF demo was the easy title winner for best of show. I don't regard myself as an avid Wilson fan, but there are no arguing with results, either this time or at the Wilson demo a couple of years ago at CAS 2011. The XLF demo decisively whomped the field in a big way. I still like the Alexandrias with Steve's Lamm ML3's better, however, mainly as a matter of taste due to my adherence to "Tone Uber Alles". The Lamm/Alexandria does the combo of tone and dimensionality better than just about anything I have heard.
As far as the "Alexia" controversy, I have heard them three times now, once at CAS 2013 and the two demos at RAMF 2013. Of the three, I preferred the CAS 2013 demo with the Aesthetix/Spectral front end. Second, I liked the Doshi array, particularly because of the impeccable source material. Third, the VTL display, which I didn't think was bad. However, I really prefer the bigger Wilsons over the smaller ones. My opinion does not seem to have changed with these setups. I would go Maxx and above for Wilson speakers if I had the choice.
I enjoyed hearing Gary's (Koh) speakers and meeting him. We had breakfast together at our hotel while I was trying to ignite my brain awake with strong coffee and sugar. Gary gave me a most fascinating recounting of his adventure presenting the Genesis Dragon speakers in the auditorium in Hong Kong. Gary is a "world citizen" who makes me feel like a true provincial.
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12355-Steve-s-RMAF-2013-Photo-Thread/page4 #38
Gary's small speakers are gorgeous in appearance and construction, and capable of surprising dynamics. Also, Gary is an absolute master of wonderful and varied source material, both vinyl and digital. He does not bend to the "usual audiophile pap demo material", for which I was grateful.
I am sure Gary's collections would keep me busy for a year. He explained to me his efforts to make speakers that had a very wide sweet spot, so you didn't have to sit in one spot with your head in a clamp, and in fact, his small speakers were capable of outstanding dispersion and uniformity in the moderate size RMAF room.
The very last setup I heard was the Sadurni Acoustics/Kubala-Sosna. These are the products of our very own WBF member Saturntube. He is friends from Mexico City with Flez007 (Fernando), who I hosted a couple of weeks ago in Pleasanton and with whom I had a very pleasant audiophile interlude.
Unfortunately, I was in such a dazed and confused condition from show exhaustion, when I entered the room, I had completely lost my recollection of the WBF connections and did not even recognize Fernando at first, who was baby sitting. I apologize to Fernando for not recognizing him directly, but plead show shell shock as an excuse.
However, I am so glad I heard this demo. These big horns are 110 db efficient. Although they are imposing, after hearing them, I can easily imagine myself in a barcolounger between them. They are the ideal tool for hearing the glories of flea powered directly heated triode amplifiers. A 45 tube (at 1 and a half watts) will play with the general impact as a 150 watt tube amplifier with a 90 db efficient speaker. Anybody who knows the 45 tube knows that it is one of those "magic" tubes.
These horns sounded outstanding, with a smooth and huge soundstage that was seamless in the presentation room. In this instance, they were playing the "optional" 300b's and served them very well. I would have liked to have heard them with 45's, but they were not available.
The Sadurnis were one of the three horn presentations that I was really glad to have heard. They convinced me that if I ever strayed from my Planar preference, I would definitely go completely antiquarian with horns and flea powered amps.
I had just come from the Cessaro horn demo, which I found to be a major disappointment, into the Surdurni demo, which was most excellent.
I will post a more synoptic presentation of some of my other impressions in my next thread.
This seems to have become the default RMAF impressions thread. I suppose this is as good a time as any to add my possibly gratuitous commentary.
I will reference to Steve's excellent photographic journal when possible.
I was at the show for two days. I like to be a bit of a phantom, going in and out of the rooms and hearing a bit of my own stuff without getting into prolonged lockjaw matches with the sales representatives, unless I have specific questions. Some of them recognized me from CAS 2013, so this was harder to do. The more you go to these things, they start to spot you coming. The first day, I was able to maintain some freshness. However, by the afternoon of the second day(Saturday) I found myself burning out rapidly.
The show served its purpose for me very well. I was looking for horn/flea power amplifier demos I could fall in love with, and I found them, along with several that were not so. I would have liked to have heard more Stats, but unfortunately I completely missed the Soundlab demo. I also regret missing the Koda stuff. I was also hoping there would be some SIT/VFET solid state amplifiers, but didn't find any if they were there. Just plain too much stuff to look at, and you have to pick your battles.
It was, of course, really great to "put a face" on the internet by meeting the handful of WBF contributors and touring a bit with Mark (mep) and Steve. Mark did not beat me up with a broom handle, for which I am grateful, as he was reserving his energies for the vendors.
There were several "lead balloons" to hear, as expected. I won't really go into many of them because I don't want to get into "vendor retaliation mode", but I will mention the Lansche demo.
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12355-Steve-s-RMAF-2013-Photo-Thread post 3
This one appeared to be comparable in grandiosity and expense to the Wilson XLF demo, but it was puzzling because it just sounded plain mediocre to me. The first time, Fremer was in there kanoodling with some of his own material and basking in the Ypsilon stuff, but quite frankly, even with his material, I just didn't get it. I rapidly moved on. The second time I heard them on Saturday was no better.
To get it out of the way again, the Wilson XLF demo was the easy title winner for best of show. I don't regard myself as an avid Wilson fan, but there are no arguing with results, either this time or at the Wilson demo a couple of years ago at CAS 2011. The XLF demo decisively whomped the field in a big way. I still like the Alexandrias with Steve's Lamm ML3's better, however, mainly as a matter of taste due to my adherence to "Tone Uber Alles". The Lamm/Alexandria does the combo of tone and dimensionality better than just about anything I have heard.
As far as the "Alexia" controversy, I have heard them three times now, once at CAS 2013 and the two demos at RAMF 2013. Of the three, I preferred the CAS 2013 demo with the Aesthetix/Spectral front end. Second, I liked the Doshi array, particularly because of the impeccable source material. Third, the VTL display, which I didn't think was bad. However, I really prefer the bigger Wilsons over the smaller ones. My opinion does not seem to have changed with these setups. I would go Maxx and above for Wilson speakers if I had the choice.
I enjoyed hearing Gary's (Koh) speakers and meeting him. We had breakfast together at our hotel while I was trying to ignite my brain awake with strong coffee and sugar. Gary gave me a most fascinating recounting of his adventure presenting the Genesis Dragon speakers in the auditorium in Hong Kong. Gary is a "world citizen" who makes me feel like a true provincial.
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12355-Steve-s-RMAF-2013-Photo-Thread/page4 #38
Gary's small speakers are gorgeous in appearance and construction, and capable of surprising dynamics. Also, Gary is an absolute master of wonderful and varied source material, both vinyl and digital. He does not bend to the "usual audiophile pap demo material", for which I was grateful.
I am sure Gary's collections would keep me busy for a year. He explained to me his efforts to make speakers that had a very wide sweet spot, so you didn't have to sit in one spot with your head in a clamp, and in fact, his small speakers were capable of outstanding dispersion and uniformity in the moderate size RMAF room.
The very last setup I heard was the Sadurni Acoustics/Kubala-Sosna. These are the products of our very own WBF member Saturntube. He is friends from Mexico City with Flez007 (Fernando), who I hosted a couple of weeks ago in Pleasanton and with whom I had a very pleasant audiophile interlude.
Unfortunately, I was in such a dazed and confused condition from show exhaustion, when I entered the room, I had completely lost my recollection of the WBF connections and did not even recognize Fernando at first, who was baby sitting. I apologize to Fernando for not recognizing him directly, but plead show shell shock as an excuse.
However, I am so glad I heard this demo. These big horns are 110 db efficient. Although they are imposing, after hearing them, I can easily imagine myself in a barcolounger between them. They are the ideal tool for hearing the glories of flea powered directly heated triode amplifiers. A 45 tube (at 1 and a half watts) will play with the general impact as a 150 watt tube amplifier with a 90 db efficient speaker. Anybody who knows the 45 tube knows that it is one of those "magic" tubes.
These horns sounded outstanding, with a smooth and huge soundstage that was seamless in the presentation room. In this instance, they were playing the "optional" 300b's and served them very well. I would have liked to have heard them with 45's, but they were not available.
The Sadurnis were one of the three horn presentations that I was really glad to have heard. They convinced me that if I ever strayed from my Planar preference, I would definitely go completely antiquarian with horns and flea powered amps.
I had just come from the Cessaro horn demo, which I found to be a major disappointment, into the Surdurni demo, which was most excellent.
I will post a more synoptic presentation of some of my other impressions in my next thread.
Last edited:
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I completely agree about Gary and his room. I spent ~1/2 hour alone with Gary in his room on Friday and boy was I glad. I too was made aware of Gary's philosophy behind a wider dispersion sweet spot so that husband and wife can enjoy music together. In fact IIRC the speakers that I heard were deigned specifically for Gary's wife. The tweeter in all of the Genesis speakers from what I understand is a one of a kind concentric ribbon which allows for wider dispersion and hence a wider sweet spot. As far as music Gary continues to play the very best of music and I really enjoyed what I heard. I thought the MSRP on both speakers presents a wonderful deal for great sound with the larger speaker at $6K and the smaller at $4800.
Kudos to Gary for such a pleasing sound I heard
Kudos to Gary for such a pleasing sound I heard
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I couldn't have said it any better than Mike Bovaird as this system is one not meant for mere mortals.My absolute sentimental Best In Show continues to be Nick Doshi's room and as a result I have to put the Wilson XLF/Thor/VTL room as The Best Of The Best. Nothing IMO came even close to that demo
A correction to Kevin's first video at that URL: the tweeters have aluminum domes, not titanium. The latter material is much more susceptible to ringing. This was noted by a trusted audio friend and business colleague who is sensitive to such anomalies, as am I.
Did anybody stop by the Raven Audio room? I'm a friend of the owner and I'd appreciate some feedback from the people in this forum. Thanks!
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Carl and Mark were sitting opposite one another and beside me at the dinner Sat night and I couldn't stop laughing
I;m thinking of giving them their own dedicated forum called Yin and Yan. It was difficult to know who was the front man as the lines were flying fast and furious. I've known Carl for years and have been to each others home countless times and Carl is about as witty and sardonic as they get. Don't get hime started on asking about his wife because he's funnier than Henny Youngman. All he needs is the violin and to say "take my wife, please"
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I must admit that extended listening sessions in each room are non existent if I were to get to every room and be able to take pix
Interesting. Would you be able to estimate the SPL as you were listening?
Thanks
That's awfully difficult. I would guess mid to low 90's. But it was so clear and clean that it could very well have been higher.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
The first working Class D amplifier was developed by John Ulrick and it was demo'ed at the Winter CES 1974. Bruno might not have been born yet......
Bruno developed the Hypex UcD technology which I use in my speakers and amplifiers.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
I'd like to thank all the WBF members who stopped by - especially those who introduced me to new music - Myles for bringing a couple of unobtanium albums I'll have to work to find, Doug_R for the Trans Siberian Orchestra - Night Castle, audioarcher for Sphere - Flight Path (I've already bought a few copies), and Dre_J for Coryell-Khan - Two for the Road. I'll be demo-ing some of this at the next show
I demo'ed quite a wide range of music, and if there's interest, I'll post my full play-list.
I'm really glad that some of you liked what you heard in my room. I'll estimate that about 30% of people who came in thought that the sound was outstanding, 50% thought that it was "meh", and 20% did not like it at all. I heard comments from people walking out about weak bass and metallic-sounding midrange.
Nevertheless, as was mentioned in another thread, it's really tough when your ears aren't in the room to get someone else's opinion. What I like isn't for everybody, and I'm happy if there's someone else in the world who likes what I do. It's a preference after all.
To clarify the speakers, I demo'ed three models in the G7-series. The $12,500 G7f, the $6,000 G7c and the $4,800 G7p. The speakers that Steve listened to were the $6k/pr G7c - the ones sitting on the floor in the picture below.
This picture is from Sunday, when I took the baby G7p's for a spin. These were the speakers I designed for Carolyn, my sister.
The two most frequently asked questions were:
Q Which speakers are playing?
A Speakers? What speakers? The teddy bears are singing.
Q What subwoofer are you using?
A Subwoofer? What subwoofer? The teddy bears are growling.
I had a fun show - I always enjoy RMAF. Hope that everyone did as well. The dinner was outstanding - next year, we'll have to find a larger restaurant!!
I demo'ed quite a wide range of music, and if there's interest, I'll post my full play-list.
I'm really glad that some of you liked what you heard in my room. I'll estimate that about 30% of people who came in thought that the sound was outstanding, 50% thought that it was "meh", and 20% did not like it at all. I heard comments from people walking out about weak bass and metallic-sounding midrange.
Nevertheless, as was mentioned in another thread, it's really tough when your ears aren't in the room to get someone else's opinion. What I like isn't for everybody, and I'm happy if there's someone else in the world who likes what I do. It's a preference after all.
To clarify the speakers, I demo'ed three models in the G7-series. The $12,500 G7f, the $6,000 G7c and the $4,800 G7p. The speakers that Steve listened to were the $6k/pr G7c - the ones sitting on the floor in the picture below.
This picture is from Sunday, when I took the baby G7p's for a spin. These were the speakers I designed for Carolyn, my sister.
The two most frequently asked questions were:
Q Which speakers are playing?
A Speakers? What speakers? The teddy bears are singing.
Q What subwoofer are you using?
A Subwoofer? What subwoofer? The teddy bears are growling.
I had a fun show - I always enjoy RMAF. Hope that everyone did as well. The dinner was outstanding - next year, we'll have to find a larger restaurant!!
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