Rocking the Boat : Nord Hypex NC1200 Signature Amplifier
- Thread starter CKKeung
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I have been playing with this amp for the past few weeks. Everything mentioned in the Ear review is spot on - this is a temendously fast and transparent amp.
The problem with is, is that there is just not enough meat on the bones. Especially when you use the Sonic Imaginery op-amps. The Sparkos Labs ones are a better match IMO, as they trade a bit of resolution for midrange warmth. Still, not as warm and full sounding as most Class A or tube amps, but the move in the right direction.
I was able to further improve the voicing with substituting my usual silver AQ WEL Signature IC for the warm sounding Cardas Clear Reflection cable and my speaker cables for Western Electric WE16GA ones, but in the end - I gave up as my little Graaf 20OTL tube amp sounded simply better. More palpable, more 3D, with better soundstage.
The problem with is, is that there is just not enough meat on the bones. Especially when you use the Sonic Imaginery op-amps. The Sparkos Labs ones are a better match IMO, as they trade a bit of resolution for midrange warmth. Still, not as warm and full sounding as most Class A or tube amps, but the move in the right direction.
I was able to further improve the voicing with substituting my usual silver AQ WEL Signature IC for the warm sounding Cardas Clear Reflection cable and my speaker cables for Western Electric WE16GA ones, but in the end - I gave up as my little Graaf 20OTL tube amp sounded simply better. More palpable, more 3D, with better soundstage.
It was 6000 EUR, but now they sell for ~2000 EUR used ... less than the PuriFi'ed Nord amp.
I'm only mentioning it to give some perspective, and to show that the PuriFi modules are far from being end-game amps some people claim they are.
I'm only mentioning it to give some perspective, and to show that the PuriFi modules are far from being end-game amps some people claim they are.
The first non-forum review of a non-engineering board version of Purifi module poweramp :
http://www.the-ear.net/review-hardware/nord-acoustics-three-se-1et400a-mkii-stereo-power-amplifier
It's a pity that the reviewer didn't compare it to the other Nord poweramps which employed Ncore modules.
Interesting to me as I'm likely to have a Purifi-based amplifier in my next purchase. However, whilst I agree the Nord price is pretty competitive, I think the final sentence in the conclusion to this review requires scrutiny. It says:
"I’m pretty sure you can’t get this level of power, speed and transparency for the same money anywhere else. The fact that you can’t try before you buy is essentially the price you pay for this degree of value for money, if you look at competing products that use the same technology prices are at least two or three times higher"
Well, lets look at one of it's obvious competitor, the forthcoming NAD Master Series M33. It should have been available by now but Coronavirus had held up its release. Yes it's exactly double the price (including distributor and dealer markups), but look at what these 2 boxes include:
Nord :
Power Amp based on Purifi Class D
Case - "off the shelf" according to the review
NAD:
Power Amp based on Purifi Class D
Preamp inc Phono
Headphone Amp
DAC
Optional Crossover circuit for Main and Sub Outputs
Streamer inc Roon Ready and MQA
Room Correction
Big Touchscreen Display
Case - bespoke - and rather more attractive!
I shan't mention that the NAS can also be persuaded to obey voice commands via your Alexa! OK I've mentioned it for what it's worth.
I've not heard either but I'd consider the NAD is potentially a much better value prospect, particularly when you take into account the several cables it won't need. Just my thinking.
I'm hoping to get my hands on an M33 very soon
Peter
I think they look nice:
Do you still have your Graaf GM20? I had one for a while 15+ years ago. It sounded great but mine was noisy. Not noisy through the speakers but it was physically noisy - it had a continuous buzzing sound that probably came from its mains transformer. Is yours dead silent? At the time, I asked on some other forum and was told that the Graaf tended to be noisy. So I sold it - but it was a very pretty amp. Peter
My GM20 OTL is dead slilent in terms of any mechanical noise. It is also very silent for a tube amp in terms of speaker noise. To hear aniything I have literally stick my ear to the tweeter.
The only drawback of this amp is low power and the fact it needs an 8 Ohm speaker (or higher).
But if you have an 8 Ohm speaker, this amp can compete with basicly anything. I had solid state amps in 50.000 EUR range - will not mention the names - that did not sound as good as Graff GM20 OTL.
The only drawback of this amp is low power and the fact it needs an 8 Ohm speaker (or higher).
But if you have an 8 Ohm speaker, this amp can compete with basicly anything. I had solid state amps in 50.000 EUR range - will not mention the names - that did not sound as good as Graff GM20 OTL.
Class D has gone really far in the objective domain. And Putzeys is (for a numbers guy) fairly open to subjective quality interpretation from what I've read. But I still feel there will be a designer to take this further. It might include lps to the front end (already being done at times), and work to mitigate the smps deliterious impact on its surroundings. In any case I suspect the next few years will show us this....
Well, I could not resist.....I am going to be modding Purifi and Nc1200 based amps.....maybe NC500 too. A stereo Purifi amp just arrived today. I am working on something that has not been done in over 20 years with Class D.......might be a breakthrough......will know in a week or so. You can read about some of my proposed mods on this thread....post #34. This is going to be fun!
The data sheet for the NC 2K says it was released in 2012. VTV Audio does sell mono blocks using these modules....same with Rouge audio (Italy). Looks like one input stage and modulator and two separate outputs that can be used either to bi-amp or be paralleled for super power.
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Just thought of a new option. Hypex has a 3000 watt power supply that you could use for one or two Purifi modules........all things being equal.....bigger power supplies sound better. VTV will do this for people.....then i mod...yeah.
The Hypex supply that everyone uses is 1200 watt. This 3000 watter could be used on the NC1200 as well.
https://www.hypex.nl/product/smps3ka400/32
The Hypex supply that everyone uses is 1200 watt. This 3000 watter could be used on the NC1200 as well.
https://www.hypex.nl/product/smps3ka400/32
The 3K supply comes in two versions....plus and minus 65 volts.....that can power single or up to three NC500s or Purifi modules and a plus and minus 85 volt version can can power NC500s, NC1200s and NC2K. There are three sets of outputs on the 3K supply. So, you could have a three channel NC500 or Purifi with one big supply....or a two channel NC1200 with one supply......you could even run 3 NC1200s but you would limit the power of each module a hair (at hair raising volumes.....he he).
Apollon uses a second LPS to power the driver board/input stage on their all out attempt at an NC1200 amp. That is in the stereo amp shown on post #42. This would not make much difference compared to all the things I do. The power supply for the input stage on the NC1200 is not as important as the one for an NC500 or Purifi. That is because the plus and minus 15 volt regs for the input stage also power the input stage on the NC500 and Purifi (the input stage on the Purifi module is that circuit board sticking up in the air on the side). The NC1200 has built in regulators for its built in input stage (you supply the input buffer)....you can see the regulator boards sticking up from the NC1200 board. So, yes i am wanting to have an option for a separate linear supply for the input buffer stage of the Purifi that also powers the input board on the Purifi module. However, you need some room inside the box to do this. So, some of the chassis that are currently used would not work. This is why I like VTV Audio. He will build whatever you like. He uses the Ghent chassis from China and he can drill whatever holes you like underneath whatever size chassis you want to accommodate anything you please. At some point I will work up such an option. However, still not that important in the scheme of things as the Sparko labs regulators with my mods are pretty darn good....running off the raw switching supply.
So, how about a mono super modded Purifi with 3K power supply and linear supply for the front end. The linear supply would have a larger transformer than what Apollon uses......be mounted off the chassis on wood with no steel around it....would have super diodes, Mundorf large capacitors on the raw supply and modded Wima caps as bypasses, super power supply wire hardwired to the input board, etc. Also, you could add 10,000 uf of Mundorf caps to each output rail of each amp.....that would smack you good! Get yours now, while supplies last....he he. Actually, I will probably be doing this for someone.....but he wants all of it done one a 1200 or 2K module....wants to kick his Wilson's across the floor!
Apollon uses a second LPS to power the driver board/input stage on their all out attempt at an NC1200 amp. That is in the stereo amp shown on post #42. This would not make much difference compared to all the things I do. The power supply for the input stage on the NC1200 is not as important as the one for an NC500 or Purifi. That is because the plus and minus 15 volt regs for the input stage also power the input stage on the NC500 and Purifi (the input stage on the Purifi module is that circuit board sticking up in the air on the side). The NC1200 has built in regulators for its built in input stage (you supply the input buffer)....you can see the regulator boards sticking up from the NC1200 board. So, yes i am wanting to have an option for a separate linear supply for the input buffer stage of the Purifi that also powers the input board on the Purifi module. However, you need some room inside the box to do this. So, some of the chassis that are currently used would not work. This is why I like VTV Audio. He will build whatever you like. He uses the Ghent chassis from China and he can drill whatever holes you like underneath whatever size chassis you want to accommodate anything you please. At some point I will work up such an option. However, still not that important in the scheme of things as the Sparko labs regulators with my mods are pretty darn good....running off the raw switching supply.
So, how about a mono super modded Purifi with 3K power supply and linear supply for the front end. The linear supply would have a larger transformer than what Apollon uses......be mounted off the chassis on wood with no steel around it....would have super diodes, Mundorf large capacitors on the raw supply and modded Wima caps as bypasses, super power supply wire hardwired to the input board, etc. Also, you could add 10,000 uf of Mundorf caps to each output rail of each amp.....that would smack you good! Get yours now, while supplies last....he he. Actually, I will probably be doing this for someone.....but he wants all of it done one a 1200 or 2K module....wants to kick his Wilson's across the floor!
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You cannot just add an external power supply to an Ncore or Purifi based amp. The power supply is input on certain kinds of connectors on the boards.....there is no jack on the back for plus and minus input voltage. You have to do it inside the unit and hardwire it in. You could run the unit with the cover off and have a wire coming in from outside and soldered in.....most people do not want such a product. You could also install a power inlet and wire it into the boards and then use an external supply.........however, if there is room inside then this is the best option....as all connectors wreck the sound.
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