Steve, I think the noise to which Davey refers is that generated by the phono gain stage which has to amplify the extremely low output of these cartridges. The noise is not from the cartridge itself. Some phono stages are much quieter than others and some have much more gain than others. Perhaps your Lamm is quieter than Ron's IO.
Ron's Speaker, Turntable, Power and Room Treatment Upgrades
- Thread starter Ron Resnick
- Start date
Steve, I think the noise to which Davey refers is that generated by the phono gain stage which has to amplify the extremely low output of these cartridges. The noise is not from the cartridge itself. Some phono stages are much quieter than others and some have much more gain than others. Perhaps your Lamm is quieter than Ron's IO.
Tang has both cartridges?!?!
Sorry, I should have known that. But between Tang and Gian I can't keep up with their inventories!
Sorry, I should have known that. But between Tang and Gian I can't keep up with their inventories!
Thank you!
The wire is JPS In-Wall. The outlets will be Furutech NCF.
There will be 120VAC and 240VAC.
On the front wall I currently am planning to use only one layer of common drywall (the framing ("furring out") has already cost me 4 inches of length of the room). The framing will be filled in with blue jeans insulation.
Thank you, Peter. That is entirely correct.
Steve, the phono stage is what what introduces noise into the system...usually because the phono stage is working too hard and therefore either a) distorting the signal or b) allowing tube noise to intrude or c) both.
As I have stated before, I am no fan of SUT's...compared to tube phono stages. However, they do allow the pre-ampflier to operate much more in the sweet spot..usually. Plus, one can safely operate ( from a noise perspective) a much lower output MC with most SUT's.
One has to pick their poison, IME. Go with an SUT and throw away a lot of the magic that the tube phono stage brings, or go with a tube phono stage and limit oneself to certain cartridges that do not stress the amplification stage and/or the tubes.
Unfortunately, the trend these days seems to be towards flea output cartridges, which i am afraid leads to numerous incompatibilities with the downstream gear. Years ago I experienced this issue, so I am well aware of the cost to rectify the situation.
IMHO, Ron is very smart to be mindful of this scenario....and to not rely on luck to get it right!
Changing speakers and amplifiers will not change the situation concerning cartridge choice. The signal to noise ratio is dominated by the phono preamplifer and modern amplifiers have high gain - that is not related to power. The usual situation is that systems have too much gain and people operate the volume controls in the lower positions with excessive attenuation.
BTW, you should check at which level the cartridge output sensitivity is specified - some manufacturers use 3.54cm/s, others 5cm/s (a 3dB difference) .
I think, ideally, that one should look at the whole system combination of cartridge output and phono stage gain and line stage gain and amplifier gain and speaker sensitivity and preferred listening level.
The ZYX is specified at 3.54cm/s.
The ZYX is specified at 3.54cm/s.
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Ron
you're going to have to buy the newest XYX Ultimate as the Premium has been discontinued only to be replaced by the Ultimate. From what I understand it has the same output of 0.24 mV and is a minor upgrade from the Premium. The bad news is that this new cart sells for north of $17K
you're going to have to buy the newest XYX Ultimate as the Premium has been discontinued only to be replaced by the Ultimate. From what I understand it has the same output of 0.24 mV and is a minor upgrade from the Premium. The bad news is that this new cart sells for north of $17K
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I'm sorry. $17k is getting retarded for any cartridge.
That's as much as a pair of Sabrinas.
I agree Keith, but do you think that people actually pay full retail for the most expensive items in High End Audio? A now retired dealer once told me that no one pays retail. Perhaps he was talking about his customers. Maybe people do pay these prices, but I think it is more about marketing.
List is $15k. Not sure about pricing ex USA.
I wonder what a rebuild will cost? If your nice to the cartridge, maybe 2000-3000 hours before a rebuild?
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Yes. I'm not even sure most expensive carts are anything much more impressive than many inexpensive ones... if not just given flavors.
From my experience with the Air Tight and the ZYX, yes they are much more impressive than less expensive ones.
Now, if they're worth the extra money, that's up for each one of us to decide...
Purely from theoretical (not actual auditioning) triangulation I think I would find the ZXY UNIverse Premium a little bit smoother and a little bit warmer than the Opus.
Similar threads
