Seattle report: Mike's System, Bruce B, Jazdoc, EA MM7, NVS, Darts, etc

... I'll just share a short story: I met/visited two new audiophiles in August, and I was forewarned that it would be better to tell them that I slept with their wives, than to "criticize" their equipment. It's true, I was told exactly those words.

That can't be! Them two new audiophile friends; I'd say they have a great sense of humor.
That's an important quality today when we are so passionate about the emotions that count the most. :D

Guys, just quickly, is the font fine for you, or do you want one size small?

Are the embedded pics too small, and do you want them bigger?

The font's size is fine; easy to read. The pics' size are fine too. Good job.
________

Now, to expand further on your two questions... :b

Sure, the font's size could be one notch smaller and no one would suffer.
And the pic's size could be one notch larger and no one ...

All in all everything is fine, and everything can be improved.

Here are two sites you can use as some inspiration:

http://www.highendpalace.com/
http://www.monoandstereo.com/

In the first one the font's size is the regular lettering type.
In the second one it is larger. And both are just fine.
The pictures have slightly better definition and also larger, which is a good point in the right direction.
The content, the article itself, the writing is the main essence; and the overall presentation is the attraction. Both go together to create a first class blog, website, audiophile zone.
 
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That can't be! Them two new audiophile friends; I'd say they have a great sense of humor.

Actually, it was the third person who introduced me to them who warned me, starkly. I obviously wouldn't have just met and walked into two strangers' homes just like that, there had to have been an introduction.
 
Actually, it was the third person who introduced me to them who warned me, starkly. I obviously wouldn't have just met and walked into two strangers' homes just like that, there had to have been an introduction.

I see. Then it's that third person who has a great sense of humor.

* It was fun to read your post in the first place.
______

Test:

Marty-1-777x437.jpg


Marty's old speakers?
 
Ked, I'm the reason for an *?
i AM honoured!
My life's work is complete
 
Guys, updated to one font smaller, and now all images pop up bigger if you click on them. That was easy to do.
 
Mike, are you considering any further rounds of enhancements to take things another few percentage points fwds?
Active isolation to yr other electronics, esp the Dart monos, and even the EAs?
More Tripoint, incl the new spkr crossover grounding system that Audiocrack is raving about?
Shun Mook Resonators under gear?
You can't stop now !
 
Mike, are you considering any further rounds of enhancements to take things another few percentage points fwds?
Active isolation to yr other electronics, esp the Dart monos, and even the EAs?
More Tripoint, incl the new spkr crossover grounding system that Audiocrack is raving about?
Shun Mook Resonators under gear?
You can't stop now !

I'd say my whole digital front end is where my concentration is now; and the upgraded GG and SGM server might do it.....but that's got to play itself out.

I've grounded my plate amps on my bass towers of my speakers which was part of what sent my system to the next level. how that relates to what Audiocrack is doing with his Tidal LA's is hard to say.

as far as the rest; I know more Tripoint on the amps or tape decks could take things up a notch......but not likely I would decide to throw that level of money at that. it's there for the buying.

one interesting thing one of my 'drug dealers' is working on is grounding the duplex outlets beyond the normal power grid ground lead. I'm waiting to get feedback on that to see whether there is possible gains to be found.

and maybe when I know I'm at 'end game' level with my digital (and know the footprint and location) I will add active isolation (Herzan) to that. I prefer that to passive treatments with the Shun Mook.

my dart amps come with suspended circuit boards inside....on an actual decoupling suspension. you have to remove shipping screws once they are in place. so they are fine as is. it why they are so solid at musical peaks. they don't sing along with the music like most amps do.

so we are up against the upper limits of tuning. but there is always a little more blood in the turnip, or another layer of onion to peel.....
 
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Sure Mike, I don't want to spend yr money for you LOL
 
Mike,

I really appreciate you opening your home and system to visits. You are taking on a lot of work in hosting these visits as well as the time on the forum to respond. You have inspired me to make adjustments in my system and I thank you for you contributions to all of us who get to listen, look and learn from your willingness to share.
 
Mike, congrats!

A couple of questions, and I apologize if I missed these:

- what is the purpose of the towers MM7 use? how is this kind of design different than using multiple subwoofers? also, don't multiple subwoofers give spread around the room give you more flexibility to even out the bass humps?

well, these are issues I have thought about a lot. why 4 towers? this might ramble a bit.....

there are multiple reasons.

(1) -4- 11" ceramic woofers in each main tower. I priced them......$1500 'each' to buy. 96db, 6 ohm efficient. very low excursion. covers 35hz-250hz. these drivers are the heart of the MM7's to my thinking. and these drivers are where the MM7's become like a 2-way or planar. most cone speakers have a crossover point in this mid-bass region and this region is also where the power of the music lives. yet with these 4 woofers you have such an easy load for the amp, all this cone surface, super light and stiff ceramic, and this extreme linearity in this normally really marginally linear area which is where all your vocals, drum kits, pianos, really the power of everything is here. and you cannot have -4- 15" powered subwoofers in the same tower with -4- 11" woofers. they won't fit. super fast and nuanced.

(2) true integrated 2 tower speaker system. neither tower can be used by itself. the main towers roll off at the bottom. even though the main towers extend into the mid 20hz region. if you shut off the power switches on the bass towers and just listen to the passive main towers on 2/3rds of the music something obviously is missing. the music is incomplete. this roll off is where you get such coherence, and the lack of perfect roll off from any full range speaker system--sub matchup is why when the going gets heavy those cobbled together speaker sub systems show their limitations......compared to a true integrated complete system like the MM7's. it's why Bonzo marveled at everything holding together so seamlessly and with such ease as the music got cooking. it's a ground up coherent design in 2 towers. then you have the added benefit of the subwoofer drivers being on the same plane as the main tower drivers and that just adds to the coherence. you need 2 towers for all that driver surface. and you add the mass of 2 towers which grounds everything.

(3) an active, adjustable bass tower allows for a much easier load for the main amplifier. yet does not compromise the purity of the main amplifier to everything above 40hz. again; when a main amplifier sees an easy load then everything stays more linear. that 1st watt is more robust and magical. nuance holds together when things get cranking. it comes down to headroom, headroom, headroom. nothing stressed, nothing edgy or not in a comfortable part of the design envelope. the music breathes. listener fatigue is reduced. more musical choices present themselves as fun. and....an easier load expands the choice of amplifiers to include so many modestly powered tube amplifiers. for me, the 458's don't need this level of easy, but the musical message still benefits with the easy load. harder loads do reduce musical nuance and ease and add to hardness and edge on peaks.

(4) 4 towers does allow for multiple set-up choices. those towers can go behind the main towers or really anywhere. so it is very flexible depending on the room.

as far as multiple subwoofers around the room as an alternative I suppose when I hear something like that entering the realm of the MM7 performance my perspective could change. but there are so many barriers to that happening that i'll just keep my mind open but not expecting to ever hear it. no matter how many of those subs you use, the absence of the mid bass performance from the woofers of the MM7 will render those subs as not ready for prime time. and the less than ideal roll off down low of the main speakers chosen will be a source of lack of coherence. sure; you could add dsp or drm and lose signal path purity, or add some outboard analog crossover and add congestion there.....but it will not get to where the MM7's are.

and multiple subs around the room cannot be vertically arrayed in the room like the 7 foot tall towers can. those bass towers have 4 separate pods of two 15" subs each with it's own adjustments and 1000 watt amplifier. so they are plenty flexible if that is what is needed. it's just a better tool for the job than adding a sub to a full range speaker. and for 200 large it should be just that. you could even separate those -2- 7 foot towers into -4- 3 and 1/2 foot towers (each with it's own adjustments) if you wanted and place them anywhere in the room. so all options are open to you.

I'm not saying that adding subwoofers to full range speakers cannot result in great even amazing sound. many people have such systems and really enjoy them. I'm not somehow dismissing that approach. I'm only saying that it's not the ultimate solution. there is a better, less compromised way......in a relative sense. so we are talking degrees of good or degrees of excellence here. not good and bad.

at the end of the day, the best ground up, fully integrated uncompromised approach has the highest ceiling. then it's a matter of execution of concept. can a full range speaker with subs added around the room be better executed than an uncompromised ground up 4 tower approach? good friggen luck and have at it!

- you mention that you have made 50% improvements in recent months, but your system and room have been in tact for several years. What specifically have you done to get such large improvements, considering the fixed variables?

Bonzo gave you a link answering this.

- did I understand your post correctly, when you say that PCM on Trinity dac is the best digital you have heard, even better than "up-calculated" DSD?

Thanks!

the Trinity dac had been my top digital experience; yes.

however; I think I commented somewhere (or multiple somewhere's) in the last week that I think that my current Lampi GG combined with the HQ Player inside the SGM Server is better on PCM than my recollection of the Trinity dac through my CAPSv4 server. likely it's also slightly different. anyway I think I prefer it. could my system progression possibly influence this perception. likely it does to some degree. in a few weeks when my GG returns upgraded with the 512dsd, superclocks, top RTR PCM and new tubes then we will see what that jump up does for things.
 
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Guys, just quickly, is the font fine for you, or do you want one size small?

Are the embedded pics too small, and do you want them bigger?

Speaking as a font geek, and long time student of fonts, readability, and cognition, I would suggest you consider a serif font for your body copy. Some studies (I would have to do some digging to relocate them) have shown greater reading speed and retention when using a serif vs sans serif font. The little tails on the letters (the serifs) aid the eye particularly transitioning from word to word. Serif fonts also reduce fatigue... though there is some difference to the effect when reading printed documents vs reading a screen (transmissive vs reflected light).

Speaking as a font geek, and long time student of fonts, readability, and cognition, I would suggest you consider a serif font for your body copy. Some studies (I would have to do some digging to relocate them) have shown greater reading speed and retention when using a serif vs sans serif font. The little tails on the letters (the serifs) aid the eye particularly transitioning from word to word. Serif fonts also reduce fatigue... though there is some difference to the effect when reading printed documents vs reading a screen (transmissive vs reflected light).

 
I would like to add my 2 cents to this thread. I heard Mike's system 10 days ago, and my jaw dropped at the quality of the vinyl playback sonics. I have never heard vinyl playback where the level of coloration is so low as to be undetectable by my ears.

A big thumbs up to Mikes careful tuning of his system over months and years. My suspicion is that the two active anti-vibration tables which the support turntable, and the preamp, are major factors in delivering a bass that is so strong clear and uncolored.

We have in Holland, an early vintage Lampi Golden Gate which has been upgraded with USB receiver Superclocks and the DSD 512 module, so we know Mike is in for a treat and a significant narrowing of the gap between his vinyl and digital playback when he gets his Lampi back after the upgrades.

Mike's SGM has about 2 weeks running time on it, it will continue to improve as it approaches the 30 day mark. At 30 days, the Mundorf AG caps will have reached maturity and be singing at their full potential. Crazy for a digital device, but everything matters. On Mike's system, there is no hiding place for any sonic nasties !

Every serious audiophile should try to get an invite to Mike's barn !

thank you Ed, for the kind words. our sessions were fun for me, and I learned so much from you I'm still processing it all. the SGM Server has been a revelation to listen to.

I'm trying to get the GG shipped out this week back to Lukasz to get all those upgrades done and turned around back to me soon to hear the changes. I'm excited about it. I guess i'll have to slum it with vinyl and tape for a week to 10 days. damn.:D
 
and multiple subs around the room cannot be vertically arrayed in the room like the 7 foot tall towers can. those bass towers have 4 separate pods of two 15" subs each with it's own adjustments and 1000 watt amplifier. so they are plenty flexible if that is what is needed. it's just a better tool for the job than adding a sub to a full range speaker. and for 200 large it should be just that. you could even separate those -2- 7 foot towers into -4- 3 and 1/2 foot towers (each with it's own adjustments) if you wanted and place them anywhere in the room. so all options are open to you.

I didn't realize that, even though I looked directly at them and knew there were two separate pieces per tower. I guess I was being dense. But as you said the fact that it would be subs purposely made to go with the fullrange towers would mean that they'd match better than if you just tried to throw random subs in. You got all the options to play with, making the MM7's even better. But I can only image how long it would take to find the best asymmetrical placement in the room, at which point you might find you preferred them as towers :eek: ? You pointing that out I believe means that the MM7's have to be the ultimate speakers set that's out there, and will be, for some time. No one else offers that ability, even at higher prices (very few). And having the very deep bass adds a lot to the immersion so it's hard to call something truly complete, end game, without that low extension.

They have all been posted about on the forum in separate posts, I will just be cut pasting them. There are some good future posts coming up though.

Good, then I can find them easily. I imagine one or two pre-date my joining the forum.
 
Full of admiration for both Mike and you.
Thank you to you both for your passion, curiosity and last not least for your love of music.

Detlof
 
I just now caught up with this thread.

Ked, great blog, it’s so great to virtually ride along with you as you take in so many notable audiophile systems around the world. I have long wanted to hear Mike’s and Bruce’s systems so I envy you!

Mike, it was very exciting and enlightening to read about your system. Your configuration certainly had its surprises (near listening, attention to grounding) for me. I have no idea what a Tripoint is but I think now I will educate myself.

While it’s sad that the industry has become so expensive, it’s still a blessing that today there is a plethora of state of the art equipment to choose from, including brands that aren’t as widely known. I can easily count 10 different brands I have read about that I would love to hear one day. In the meantime there are the forums and Ked. ?

And of course, we continue to appreciate that all the best equipment doesn’t mean much if careful attention isn’t paid to setup and the listening environment.
 
I just now caught up with this thread.

Ked, great blog, it’s so great to virtually ride along with you as you take in so many notable audiophile systems around the world. I have long wanted to hear Mike’s and Bruce’s systems so I envy you!

Mike, it was very exciting and enlightening to read about your system. Your configuration certainly had its surprises (near listening, attention to grounding) for me. I have no idea what a Tripoint is but I think now I will educate myself.

While it’s sad that the industry has become so expensive, it’s still a blessing that today there is a plethora of state of the art equipment to choose from, including brands that aren’t as widely known. I can easily count 10 different brands I have read about that I would love to hear one day. In the meantime there are the forums and Ked. ?

And of course, we continue to appreciate that all the best equipment doesn’t mean much if careful attention isn’t paid to setup and the listening environment.

Ian, did you just order a Tripoint?
 
Ian, did you just order a Tripoint?

Nope, still don't really know what it is. Just like Entreq, I've tried reading some of the posts on it, but it goes over my head, lol.
 

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