Should you have to pay to audition speakers

[jazdoc]

If you have a dealer's only piece of equipment/high-end speaker, that equipment is not available for others to audition in their store. If it was a dealer with whom I'd done business before, I'd hope that they would provide equipment for in-house audition gratis, but I'd have no problem paying for an in home demo. I always try and demo the local high end shop's equipment if I believe it is a potential 'contender'. Ironically, this has back-fired, as one local dealer (from whom I'd previously purchased other pieces of equipment) essentially divorced me as a customer after I auditioned 2 or 3 pieces of equipment but ended up going in a different direction.

I have paid the shipping costs for extended in-house auditions of very expensive equipment. Even if I don't buy the equipment, it's worth it to me to not make an expensive mistake. As someone who typically buys the best they can afford, I'd rather pay to avoid purchasing something I wouldn't be happy with for a very long time.

 

[garylkoh]

I recall a dealer I had who had an interesting model - he charged $500, but if you bought it, he would give you double your money back. Sadly, because of the economy he is no longer around.... or may be because of that practice he is no longer around.

 

[NorthStar]

I am quite amazed at some of the answers here.

Here's my take: I've been dealing with audio dealers since the 60s, and when you are in good terms with a dealer, he would let you bring anything from his store to your home (weekends are best).
You are responsible to anything that could happen; and you might be required to pay a certain amount as a guaranty (I have no problem with that), but you get full refund of your deposit after bringing back the goods.

I'm talkin' people who know each other here, not incognitos.

 

[Andre Marc]

Repititive fabricated posts.

I was speaking to a dealer last week that carries a speaker I am Interested in. He told me he could set up a private audition at his store for me but he would require a 250.00 deposit. He said If I purchased the speakers he would apply the 250.00 towards the purchase price. I have been around audio since the late 70's and this is the first time I have been asked to pay for an audition.

You have posted this multiple times on numerous forums. Please don't engage in this behavior here. This is clearly NOT the first time you have been asked to pay for an audition, if you are to be believed at all.

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/archive/index.php/t-226554.html

http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.mpl?forum=general&n=586281&highlight=

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?cspkr&1240430491&openusid&zzJazzcourier&4&5

 

[Bill Hart]

So this OP is a faker? I want my money back! We should charge him a fee to post here! Or even to look around!

 

[Kal Rubinson]

There is a dealer in my neighborhood who has been doing something similar for decades and he has been successful. He does not cater to audiophiles but to ordinary folks and he provides extraordinary service. The charge is both a qualification by the dealer and a commitment from the consumer. He is, also, not the only dealer in the neighborhood, so one does not have to patronize him if this is an issue.

 

[LenWhite]

I would be willing to pay a reasonable non-refundable fee to an audio dealer for an in-home audition if that equipment required delivery and pickup. If I decided to purchase the equipment I would expect the fee to be applied to the purchase price. But I would not be willing to pay for an in-store audition.

 

[Ethan Winer]

He said If I purchased the speakers he would apply the 250.00 towards the purchase price.

I think this is key. I do in-home demos for my company's products in my living room, and people often take an hour of my time asking endless questions then don't buy anything. It's the in-person equivalent of people that request free advice from Auralex, who makes a custom drawing showing what to get and where to put it, then they use that advice to buy from a competitor selling cheap knock-off foam. I've seen people admit to doing this in forums several times. But I'm also an avid consumerist, so I can see both sides. I'll gladly spend time with a potential customer answering basic questions and suggesting products, but when they request a detailed drawing, or the questions sound like they're really just fishing for DIY advice, I charge a fee with the promise to apply it to the sale when they buy.

This is not that different from auditioning speakers. If someone tells a dealer, "I've heard good things about you, and you're local, so I will buy something, I'm just not sure which speakers I want," there should be no problem paying a reasonable deposit. Unless they're lying and just want to hear speakers they plan to buy online from someone else. A few years ago a guy came here for an in-home demo, and for two hours non-stop he asked endlessly what he needs, where to put it, and even how our products are built. He swore he planned to buy a room full of treatment. A month later I called him to follow up, and without even being embarrassed he told me he can't afford to buy treatment and he's making it all himself based on my extensive advice. So it works both ways. And that's why we now charge a deposit when the questions are extensive.

Now, listening to speakers is not the same as acoustics, where people are often clueless and legitimately have many questions. A loudspeaker dealer doesn't have to provide the same level of education. But still, a demo could easily take an hour of their time as the customer listens to different speaker models with many different CD sources.

Sorry this was so long! But it's not a simple question with a simple answer.

--Ethan

 

[Sonus]

Ethan,

Let's say i want to buy a pair of speakers that cost 100K.
do you really think while listening to 2-4 of them I need to pay 250$ for each audition?
When a manufacturer decide that his product cost X amount of money I would like to think that demos, warranty and returns are already a part of the equation, especially in the high end audio market where there are so much $%% that cost a lot!

 

[Bill Hart]

Ethan's post made me think that the guy wants to audition something totally over the top- big Wilsons, MBLs, whatever, and then is going to go home and build them himself!

 

[Andre Marc]

So this OP is a faker? I want my money back! We should charge him a fee to post here! Or even to look around!

Good idea!

Yes, the OP has zero credibility.

 

[Peter Breuninger]

Good for Andre for outing him.

Look at it this way... he got us all thinking and posting. How about that shop Kal knows... I'll be darned.

 

[Sonus]

According to some of the replies to this thread even if OP is a fake it looks like the subject is very much valid, don't you think?

 

[Andre Marc]

Good for Andre for outing him.

Look at it this way... he got us all thinking and posting. How about that shop Kal knows... I'll be darned.

Hi Peter:

Well, this is the first forum I have ever joined, as I saw too much acrimony, baiting, and disingenuous posts on other audio forums.

This poster goes from forum to forum until he wears out his welcome, gets booted, then starts all over again.

BTW, you and Kal are two of my favorite writers. Your Ayon piece was amazing. Having seen and heard those amps in person
they are quite remarkable.

 

[Andre Marc]

According to some of the replies to this thread even if OP is a fake it looks like the subject is very much valid, don't you think?

You have a point.

But I don't think it is a good precedent to allow fabricated posts posing as real experiences. The poster claimed "last week" was the first time
he was asked to pay to play, but this a repeat of posts from more than 2 years ago.

 

[Gregadd]

It used to be called a sales pitch. Overture Audio demos products with the manufacturer present and puts on a pretty good spread to boot.

 

[NorthStar]

There is a dealer in my neighborhood who has been doing something similar for decades and he has been successful. He does not cater to audiophiles but to ordinary folks and he provides extraordinary service. The charge is both a qualification by the dealer and a commitment from the consumer. He is, also, not the only dealer in the neighborhood, so one does not have to patronize him if this is an issue.

-----And that dealer Kal, do you personally do business (deal) with him?

 

[NorthStar]

Ethan,

Let's say i want to buy a pair of speakers that cost 100K.
do you really think while listening to 2-4 of them I need to pay 250$ for each audition?
When a manufacturer decide that his product cost X amount of money I would like to think that demos, warranty and returns are already a part of the equation, especially in the high end audio market where there are so much $%% that cost a lot!

-----Exactemente! ...And the people shopping for those are serious people with serious money.

* I understand Ethan's views, and like him I agree that it's not that simple (each customer is different). ...It is the job of the dealer to respect, get to know, and recommend the right products to his customers. ...And it is his job to know more about relationships between dealer/customer (seller/buyer). It is a real life situation (person to person), and different than from online (Wide Web World: Internet).

When you choose to be a high-end audio dealer as your main job, it is part of it to show.
The money you make is from the talent you're good at selling and servicing customers.

Methinks honestly.

 

[NorthStar]

According to some of the replies to this thread even if OP is a fake it looks like the subject is very much valid, don't you think?

-----Exactemente! Forget the OP, and get to the matter of the question. :b

* It ain't about the poster, it's about the post. ...No? :b

 

[Bruce B]

Even on my end I got a customer in here to master his project. He wanted to know all of my settings that I used. He later told me that he tried the same setting with his Waves plug-ins and it just didn't sound good/right!

There's all the time people on other forums asking what pre-sets do you use on such and such plug-in. It's crazy out there. Folks don't want to put the time or money into anything nowadays.