Stylus Wear, Stylus Life

[tima]

A friend of mine recently posted an article on The Vinyl Press offering extensive coverage on the topic of stylus wear and stylus life. If you're intrested , its worth a look:

The Finish Line for Your Phonograph Stylus…

The bottom line: it may be shorter than you think, a lot shorter.

If you have expertise on this topic, it'd be great to read your input.

 

[bonzo75]

A friend of mine recently posted an article on The Vinyl Press offering extensive coverage on the topic of stylus wear and stylus life. If you're intrested , its worth a look:

The Finish Line for Your Phonograph Stylus…

The bottom line: it may be shorter than you think, a lot shorter.

If you have expertise on this topic, it'd be great to read your input.

I heard this from both the General and Mik, stylus life is much shorter than you think, and to paraphrase them (I assume accurately), linear trackers hold it much longer.

 

[tima]

I heard this from both the General and Mik, stylus life is much shorter than you think, and to paraphrase them (I assume accurately), linear trackers hold it much longer.

Yes, to the extent an accurately aligned linear tracker maintains tangency - a stylus well centered in the groove - I expect that that reduces uneven wear.

 

[redcars]

I was coasting along loving my music until this thread caught my attention. Thanks for posting the link to the article, but if this doesn’t give you audiophile paranoia, I don’t know what will.

My Clearaudio Goldfinger Statement is now 5 years old. Time flies when you’re having fun.

I’m guestimating that it has about 2500 hours +/- ?? It sounds wonderful.

But now I am seriously looking at my options:

Trade it in to Clearaudio for about $9K on a new one. And go through 100 hours of breaking it in, and eating up 5-10% of its life.

Send it to Soundsmith to retip for < $1K. No new break-in required.

So far, pretty straightforward.

But then I think of all of the side effects:

I only have one cartridge and one tone arm. I probably need two of each to avoid future down time. $$$

My Aesthetix Io phono amp only accepts one cartridge at a time. I’d like to upgrade it to Eclipse level and add another phono input. $$$

Or I could try the Soundsmith strain-gauge cartridge and run it direct to my preamp. $$$

I have a Lotus Elise for sale and selling it would help out a lot here. Off topic, sorry (send me a PM )

Now I’m thinking of all the hundreds of records that I bought “NM” on Discogs, “visual inspection only.” Some of these that ended up in basement storage were likely caused by people just like me who procrastinated on stylus care.

I’m not sure if I’m contributing anything constructive here. But I feel a wee bit better having shared this.

Good luck to all of us,
Don

 

[Marcus]

Great article Tim. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Lagonda]

I was coasting along loving my music until this thread caught my attention. Thanks for posting the link to the article, but if this doesn’t give you audiophile paranoia, I don’t know what will.

My Clearaudio Goldfinger Statement is now 5 years old. Time flies when you’re having fun.

I’m guestimating that it has about 2500 hours +/- ?? It sounds wonderful.

But now I am seriously looking at my options:

Trade it in to Clearaudio for about $9K on a new one. And go through 100 hours of breaking it in, and eating up 5-10% of its life.

Send it to Soundsmith to retip for < $1K. No new break-in required.

So far, pretty straightforward.

But then I think of all of the side effects:

I only have one cartridge and one tone arm. I probably need two of each to avoid future down time. $$$

My Aesthetix Io phono amp only accepts one cartridge at a time. I’d like to upgrade it to Eclipse level and add another phono input. $$$

Or I could try the Soundsmith strain-gauge cartridge and run it direct to my preamp. $$$

I have a Lotus Elise for sale and selling it would help out a lot here. Off topic, sorry (send me a PM )

Now I’m thinking of all the hundreds of records that I bought “NM” on Discogs, “visual inspection only.” Some of these that ended up in basement storage were likely caused by people just like me who procrastinated on stylus care.

I’m not sure if I’m contributing anything constructive here. But I feel a wee bit better having shared this.

Good luck to all of us,
Don

I would take the conclusions of the article with a grain of salt, a lot of the
data seems collected long ago on older style cartridges with much
higher tracking force than what is used now

 

[timztunz]

I would take the conclusions of the article with a grain of salt, a lot of the
data seems collected long ago on older style cartridges with much
higher tracking force than what is used now

I really hope you’re right.

 

[tima]

Top styli can be expensive, so of course we want them to last. But I'm more concerned about the effect of stylus wear on record wear - if a stylus wears unevenly, what does that say about the records it played?

 

[redcars]

I am taking this opportunity to update my initial post #4:

I previously said:
I was coasting along loving my music until this thread caught my attention. Thanks for posting the link to the article, but if this doesn’t give you audiophile paranoia, I don’t know what will.

My Clearaudio Goldfinger Statement is now 5 years old. Time flies when you’re having fun.
I’m guestimating that it has about 2500 hours +/- ?? It sounds wonderful.


I previously said: Get it retipped for < $1K. No new break-in required.
So far, pretty straightforward.

Actually NOT so straightforward! After much reading and several phone conversations, I have decided to trade in my GFS on a new one at some point in the future. Too many people have told me that a retipped GFS will not sound like a GFS any more. (I think that this is even in the Mueller Report ) Let’s please leave it at that!


I previously said:
I only have one cartridge and one tone arm. I probably need two of each to avoid future down time. $$$
Two of each are now currently in the works.

I am planning for a second TT2 and a DaVinci cartridge. If the new DaVinci sounds as good as the GFS, then I’ll know that it’s time for the GFS trade-in.

There may also be a third (different) arm and non-CA cartridge in the future .


I previously said:
My Aesthetix Io phono amp only accepts one cartridge at a time. I’d like to upgrade it to Eclipse level and add another phono input. $$$
Ditto: in the works.


I do feel better about my current arm and cartridge after all of this. I do believe that a CA cartridge, properly set-up in a TT2 arm, will last longer than other available options (another inflammatory statement; ymmv)

Best,
Don

 

[tima]

Continuing interest on stylus life at The Vinyl Press. Testing, starting with a fresh cartridge and tracking wear by Bill Parkhurst.

A Running Experiment on Stylus Wear

 

[Bobvin]

Reviewing this, in light of the price of an Etsuro Urishi Gold cartridge @$20,000, needing a new stylus @500 hours, the cost of hearing one side of a record (avg. 20 minutes) is ~ $13. Add the price of a nice glass of cabernet, oh and the amortized cost of all my gear... good God don’t tell my wife!

 

[ddk]

Continuing interest on stylus life at The Vinyl Press. Testing, starting with a fresh cartridge and tracking wear by Bill Parkhurst.

A Running Experiment on Stylus Wear

I'm more of the good enough school Tim and find that pushing things beyond a certain point doesn't bring me more joy, in fact sometimes the opposite happens. If they sound good I play my cartridges until they die and as long as they're not damaging any records, good is good so why worry? Same goes for the suspension you can hear it when it breaks down.

david

 

[ddk]

By the time you know that your stylus is dead...guess what---so are your records!~

Only if I have wool in my ears like a wookie.

david

 

[Lagonda]

Only if I have wool in my ears like a wookie.

david

Yes the life experience and hands on
knowledge of a 21 year old always
baffles me

 

[microstrip]

Continuing interest on stylus life at The Vinyl Press. Testing, starting with a fresh cartridge and tracking wear by Bill Parkhurst.

A Running Experiment on Stylus Wear

Shure had very good documentation on stylus wear. Their advice was having the stylus properly evaluated every year by someone with expertise with a microscope - they edited a manual for their own microscope, the Shure Stylus Evaluation Kit. We can find it at : https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwj_2teKwJjnAhVCXhoKHWZFCUwQFjABegQIAxAB&url=https://pubs.shure.com/guide/SEK-2/en-US&usg=AOvVaw1vwhyj42JWH6YnsvaSybfE Great pictures of mint and worn stylus.

 

[tima]

I'm more of the good enough school Tim and find that pushing things beyond a certain point doesn't bring me more joy, in fact sometimes the opposite happens. If they sound good I play my cartridges until they die and as long as they're not damaging any records, good is good so why worry? Same goes for the suspension you can hear it when it breaks down.

david

Thanks David - I generally agree and pretty much do the same. Sometimes at 1000 hrs I wish I could be certain of my memory of a cartridge when it was at 300 hours.

 

[Grady98]

Thanks David - I generally agree and pretty much do the same. Sometimes at 1000 hrs I wish I could be certain of my memory of a cartridge when it was at 300 hours.

Me too, my ortofon jubilee has 1500 hours on it and sounds better than ever. Makes me wonder if my old ears have turned to brass.

 

[Solypsa]

Unfortunately vinyl is not for the perfection-oriented

Cutterheads wear out...
Stampers wear out...
Records wear out...
Stylii wear out...
Bearings wear out...

It's managing it all into an enjoyable experience that can be amazing!

 

[Lagonda]

Do tell us how a worn out stylus in your expert opinion has no effect on the record being played? I may be 21 but some things are pretty obvious...at least to some,

Regretfully Wookie you are on my personal ignore list, I will
not waste time engaging with you,
what would be the purpose

 

[Bobvin]

With the prior research into stylus wear, there is the assumption this will lead to damage of the record groove, but has there been any real science done showing what this damage looks (and sounds) like vs playing the same record, the same number of times, with non-worn stylus? Do different stylus shapes cause more wear than others? As they age? Seems a lot of variables at play, even quality of the vinyl would factor in? Clearly proper setup/alignment is critical, but what are the impacts of those values being off fractions of a degree? How much damage is done, i.e. how many plays with a worn needle before damage is done... how much damage, when does it become audible. Does wear cause sharp edges to develop on the stylus, or are edges smoothed off?

What about preservatives like LAST? (I used it long back, but not since I returned to the high end more than a decade ago.) Should vinyl formulations be improved to reduce friction? Or maybe add Graphene?

Seems there is plenty of room in the analog/vinyl world for advancements, but is there enough market to justify R&D?