Hi Emile, I could only test 5 db attns from RiteAV on both ends and the green best the blue in my system. Don't know exactly why, but may be due to the angle cut on the green attns that makes the returned light disperse more at the tip avoiding saturation.
Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème
- Thread starter CKKeung
- Start date
I will consider the MSB Pro USB and compare with the renderer V2 + etherregen ThanksIf I'm allowed to make a suggestion there I'd consider getting the MSB Pro USB module to go with that
*video in Mandarin
Is anyone of you aware what are the pros and cons of each of this 3 top servers ?
I understand that many already pointed innous being little worst than the other 2, but also costing significantly less.
How about Extreme v Memory Player pros and cons ?
It's interesting, from my comparisons lower loss solutions appeared to sound better. Losses are lower with increased wavelength, 1550nm is lower loss then 1310nm, 850nm, 550nm etc. OS2 fiber quality is typically lower loss, I have a slight preference for the ACT RL1700 series (RL1701 is 1 meter, RL 1702 is 2 meter etc). This is UPC (straight cut), I have an APC (angled cut) cable but did not prefer it, though it's an old used one I borrowed. APC does make sense though. I did not try attenuators, in fact I initially bought the Startech 80km SFPs as they are about the only ones I could find not requiring attenuation by factory specification, so it seemed to be counter productive. Will definitely try now though.
Here's a nice link to explain the differences between UPC/APC:
https://www.ppc-online.com/blog/picking-the-right-fiber-connector-pc-upc-or-apc
I did not waste my time.
You and Emile know that I already got it.
It is being curious only
steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
IMHO (and I am biased) when you compare servers on the market, there is the Taiko Extreme on one side and all others on the other side. There is no comparison. Having owned an Extreme now for a few months I marvel at it daily at what it does, how it does it and how it does it so quickly without even a hiccup. It has been difficult for me to get back to playing vinyl and tape since the Extreme is in my system
Steve, I think this is a bit of a leap and this is no disrespect to Emile’s great designs. Many people feel that running software such as HQPlayer is essential to the sound they desire. My understand it is that the Extreme doesn’t support HQ Player or isn’t part of Emile’s desireddesign. I know the earlier versions did support it. I do agree that from a hardware perspective Emile’s is unequaled.
I avoid making absolute best of the best comments since I haven’t heard anything.
steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I apologize for the hyperbole but for my ears, my system the Extreme is simply bullet proof.
I have seen and heard many if not most of the servers and compared to wheat I heard I honestly stand by my statement as I searched the market for 2 years. I have yet to hear a hiccup and its responsiveness is virtually instantaneous. I do know earlier versions supported HQ Player and if I am not mistaken there is still an option to install HQ Player on the Extreme.
The build is second to none but what never ceases to amaze me is the sound quality. It's digital but better than what I have ever heard with other servers so much so that I find I am listening to the Extreme more than listening to vinyl and tape.
while i agree with Steve on the performance side of things, i think the overall point is that as hardware technology has advanced and the top level dacs have evolved to be more bit perfect, up-sampling based tools like HQ Player are not relevant at the bleeding edge. this is why it's not used in the Extreme. the best tools for optimizing this newest crop of dacs is now different. i'm not an expert of which of these tools are best, but my ears tell me that whatever Emile is using seems to be doing it.
i recall when i first got my MSB Select II that we did some testing with HQ Player and by far the best set-up with my SGM 2015 was basically turning it off.....no up-sampling. and going bit-perfect.
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steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I agree Mike
When I asked Emile about HQ player he basically said the same
I know that if you go through the setup menu on the Extreme there is an option to install HQ player IIRC
When I asked Emile about HQ player he basically said the same
I know that if you go through the setup menu on the Extreme there is an option to install HQ player IIRC
Of course this begs the question, what else can be tuned? How about collimating? Is that something to try?
I think fibre optics is something I should start taking an interest in. I think my wireless isolated ethernet stream is pretty much optimised, so it would be interesting to see if fibre can do better. Maybe my New Years resolution....to try FO (Hey, nobody says you must resolve to do something you hate and probably won’t do.ha ha)
steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
That is the reality of evolving DAC technology.
You did not quote my entire post which was (with typos corrected) "My understanding it is that the Extreme doesn’t support HQ Player or isn’t part of Emile’s desired design." That second part is important because it addresses the point that you (likely) don't feel it is necessary for optimal sound.
For the record, I no longer use HQ Player in my setup and prefer things played back natively (if that is the right term).
From what I have seen, the extreme is the most impressive design on the market. Since I have not heard it in my system I can't comment on the sound but I am sure it is top shelf.
I hold HQ Player, and its creator Jussi, in very high regard. Jussi’s filter and modulator algorithms are in a league of their own. There is much more to Jussi then meets the eye. We may all be using algorithms, or parts of, he designed without even knowing it on a daily basis. It does provide a way to very high levels of playback fidelity without the need of very expensive DAC designs.
You can get remarkable results from a whole range of relatively affordable DACs by using HQ Player algorithms rivaling much more costly solutions.
We designed the original SGM 2015 to do exactly that, extract top level performance out of affordable DACs, using HQ Player algorithms. The value for money equation is beyond dispute.
The current upper market segment DACs all do a much better job at “bit perfect” playback then a few years ago, it’s just where the market demand is in this segment, so logically DAC development focuses on that. We are following suit with the Extreme, we do indeed primarily focus on improving “bit perfect” playback. But we are in no way suggesting nor implying HQ Player is an invalid approach. It can run on the Extreme, but the Extreme is just not partnered with DACs benefitting from this approach.
We had the SGM 2015 / EVO for that segment, unfortunately we cannot build it anymore, we will replace it, though priority is not high, as the market demand / interest is not there.
