The Colibri “Master Signature”

[howiebrou]

Howie. Maybe you Forgot I said this before. The JPA66 can be configured at time of ordering to have two or three inputs with gain more than 70db for low output MC. My second unit has three inputs for low mc carts. Have your dealer send it back for reconfigured.

Kind regards,
Tang

Tang, yes I do make note of everything you advise when I spoke to my dealer about this, he told me that the I would be better off keeping the standard config and using SUT through the MM. He thought it would get a better final result. I guess I could compare the sound from the low MC input against the SUT/MM and see which sounds better.

 

[Tango]

I have never tried to measure crosstalk. I don't have the gear to do it.

Using the meter, quite a few times my tonearm guy and I got near perfect reading but the sound were obviously skewed. Strange. To be clear, those incidents were not with Master Sig.

 

[tima]

Using the meter, quite a few times my tonearm guy and I got near perfect reading but the sound were obviously s[kewed

How was the sound obviously skewed with near perfect crosstalk? Yeah ears, and instruments can't account for everything, but that makes no sense. I could believe the other way around - skewed stylus, perfect sound. Maybe that's what you intended.

 

[tima]

Yes, it is very slightly off, but it was much worse before. It also depends on the camera angle. This is as close as I can get it with my hands to being completely straight. It is an awkward adjustment because I can't rotate the headshell finely enough to get it any closer. It does sound excellent. This method has given me good results. Perhaps they could be even better. I may try again.

I have never tried to measure crosstalk. I don't have the gear to do it.

Until now I can see where you would not because of the nature of the V12 arm.

If one of your friends has a Fozgometer or Feickert Adjust tool you might try it - measuring for crosstalk makes for an interesting experiment. If nothing else it lends repeatibility. Some carts are more azimuth sensitive than others. I find the Master Sig sensitive to it but not as sensitive as some (for example Transfilguration carts.) My experience with tools finds better sound (better focus particularly) comes with better crosstalk measurement. ymmv

Its more time consuming but you can use your ears too, just as with VTA. Play a female vocal with minimal instrumentation and singer at center stage. Try to get her mouth as small as possible so her vocal does not splay to either side.

 

[ddk]

Until now I can see where you would not because of the nature of the V12 arm.

If one of your friends has a Fozgometer or Feickert Adjust tool you might try it - measuring for crosstalk makes for an interesting experiment. If nothing else it lends repeatibility. Some carts are more azimuth sensitive than others. I find the Master Sig sensitive to it but not as sensitive as some (for example Transfilguration carts.) My experience with tools finds better sound (better focus particularly) comes with better crosstalk measurement. ymmv

Its more time consuming but you can use your ears too, just as with VTA. Play a female vocal with minimal instrumentation and singer at center stage. Try to get her mouth as small as possible so her vocal does not splay to either side.

DIN plugs almost always have crosstalk and that's what you're measuring! There are various test records that you can actually do the azimuth but listening to the track but not always consistent either.
david

 

[Tango]

How was the sound obviously skewed with near perfect crosstalk? Yeah ears, and instruments can't account for everything, but that makes no sense. I could believe the other way around - skewed stylus, perfect sound. Maybe that's what you intended.

As I said "strange." You believe what you want to believe sir. My Fozgometer is detecting your tone of supreme confident off the scale.

Tang

 

[tima]

As I said "strange." You believe what you want to believe sir. My Fozgometer is detecting your tone of supreme confident off the scale.

Tang

But it's a legitimate question Tang - why near perfect crosstalk reading gives obviously skewed sound - no need to take it personally.

Wasn't your tonearm guy curious about a strange result? Did he abandon the meter and do some other technique?

 

[Lagonda]

As I said "strange." You believe what you want to believe sir. My Fozgometer is detecting your tone of supreme confident off the scale.

Tang

Tango, when you cleaned your ears
this morning, was the cotton tip missing in one side as you pulled
the swab out ? Another case for
inspector Columbo !

 

[Ron Resnick]

been frustrated with my vdH Koa Master Signature 1.1mv. it seemed very splashy and had a severe hum issue. tried it at the lowest gain on the dart pre, and on the fixed output of the CS Port phono, and could not get it to settle down. so i've not been listening to it. last night just to make sure all was well with my dart phono, i installed the 10 hour old vdH Strad .38mv I also have. it was fine.

. . .


then it dawned on me; maybe that 1.1mv output MS would work well with one of the 40db of gain CS Port MM outputs? so tonight i removed the Strad .38mv and re-installed the MS 1.1mv. the captured phono cable on my Durand Telos Sapphire just barely reached the CS Port MM output......but it did reach.

bingo! the Koa MS 1.1mv sounded at home from the get go. the gain was comfortable with plenty of room up and down the volume range. no more overloading. zero hum. zero drama. right now the MS has under 20 hours on it. the cool thing is i can now put it anywhere on any of the tt's and know i have a channel that works.

. . .
it's nice when something just works out all around. and i'm looking forward to finding the best tt and arm for the Master Signature 1.1mv.

Mike,

Are you able to identify any consistent sonic differences between the .38mV vdH and the 1.1mV vdH?

 

[Ron Resnick]

. . . once I settled on the best VTA.

Peter,

Are you finding yourself having less of a desire to change VTA record by record with the 3012R than you did with the V12?

 

[Tango]

Tango, when you cleaned your ears
this morning, was the cotton tip missing in one side as you pulled
the swab out ? Another case for
inspector Columbo !

Columbo cannot comprehend. Things that happened in my room need at minimum agent Boulder of XFile.

Tang

 

[PeterA]

Peter,

Are you finding yourself having less of a desire to change VTA record by record with the 3012R than you did with the V12?

Ron, it's difficult to say. I have learned a lot from ddk lately about system set up and tuning. My goal is to not have to adjust VTA for each individual LP, as I had done before with the V-12. So far, that is proving to be the case with the 3012R tonearm, though I have only played standard, original, typical weight vinyl on this arm so far. So, I really don't know yet. The desire is not there. I do it only if I feel it is necessary. Then, I find it worth the effort. I may try some thicker reissue LPs this weekend to see what happens, if anything, to VTA. Ideally, I would like to set VTA and forget it.

I will say that I was actually quite surprised to find that VTA adjustment on the 3012R is really extremely easy once you figure out how to do it. It is faster, more accurate, and more easily repeatable than the method I was using on the V-12. I have learned a lot recently about tonearm set up, having thought I already knew what I was doing. Clearly, I still have a lot to learn.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike,

Are you able to identify any consistent sonic differences between the .38mV vdH and the 1.1mV vdH?

you are going to have to pay close attention to the details in this post as it attempts to navigate the vdH swamp of cartridge naming.

these two cartridges are completely different in the vdH Colibri family. although in the cone of confusion chaos of the vdH naming nomenclature they share some terminology.

the .38mv is called "vdH Colibri XGW Koa Stradavarious .38mv" here is a Myles Astor review from 2017 of this cartridge;

https://positive-feedback.com/revie...libri-xgw-stradivarius-moving-coil-cartridge/

it lists for $7995. i bought it two years ago, but before i even received it, i bought another different vdH Colibri cartridge, called the Stradivarious Signature .7mv (not the Master Signature) which listed for $11,995. that cartridge i did listen to for about 20 hours and then sold it (i preferred my $16k GFS). i never listened to the .38 version. i did loan this brand new .38 to jazdoc who had it for a few days and listened to it for 10 hours or so and returned it to me. i've had it for sale since that time. and the other day i only listened to it for a couple of hours to verify that there was nothing wrong with my phono or arm causing the issues with my Master Signature 1.1mv.

here is an Absolute Sound review regarding the .7mv Strad Signature from Andre Jennings (again, not the Master Signature) that i sold. accompanying it is a review of another vdH 'Crimson' which is different than my Koa Strad .38mv above. confused? we all are.

https://www.theabsolutesound.com/ar...arius-and-colibri-xgw-signature-stradivarius/

i'd say that feedback from my brief Thursday night listen to this XGW Koa Stadavarious .38mv would be that it's a bit more behaved and polite and less propulsive than the Master Signature 1.1mv.......but it's more "like", than "not like", the MS 1.1mv. and i used the dart pre phono which worked great for it, whereas the MS 1.1mv is now on the MM 40db gain output of my CS Port phono.....so with the different phono's hard to get too deep into differences.

but that is just a quick take and i'm just in the early stages with the MS 1.1mv, finally now finding an electrical solution that allows it to 'work' properly.

the Master Signature 1.1mv is really a whole different beast than the Koa Strad .38mv i think. but i am just brushing the surface so far.

btw; my almost new .38mv is still for sale.....and i am motivated.

 

[Ron Resnick]

you are going to have to pay close attention to the details in this post as it attempts to navigate the vdH swamp of cartridge naming.

these two cartridges are completely different in the vdH Colibri family. although in the cone of confusion chaos of the vdH naming nomenclature they share some terminology.

the .38mv is called "vdH Colibri XGW Koa Stradavarious .38mv" here is a Myles Astor review from 2017 of this cartridge;

https://positive-feedback.com/revie...libri-xgw-stradivarius-moving-coil-cartridge/

it lists for $7995. i bought it two years ago, but before i even received it, i bought another different vdH Colibri cartridge, called the Stradivarious Signature .7mv (not the Master Signature) which listed for $11,995. that cartridge i did listen to for about 20 hours and then sold it (i preferred my $16k GFS). i never listened to the .38 version. i did loan this brand new .38 to jazdoc who had it for a few days and listened to it for 10 hours or so and returned it to me. i've had it for sale since that time. and the other day i only listened to it for a couple of hours to verify that there was nothing wrong with my phono or arm causing the issues with my Master Signature 1.1mv.

here is an Absolute Sound review regarding the .7mv Strad Signature from Andre Jennings (again, not the Master Signature) that i sold. accompanying it is a review of another vdH 'Crimson' which is different than my Koa Strad .38mv above. confused? we all are.

https://www.theabsolutesound.com/ar...arius-and-colibri-xgw-signature-stradivarius/

i'd say that feedback from my brief Thursday night listen to this XGW Koa Stadavarious .38mv would be that it's a bit more behaved and polite and less propulsive than the Master Signature 1.1mv.......but it's more "like", than "not like", the MS 1.1mv. and i used the dart pre phono which worked great for it, whereas the MS 1.1mv is now on the MM 40db gain output of my CS Port phono.....so with the different phono's hard to get too deep into differences.

but that is just a quick take and i'm just in the early stages with the MS 1.1mv, finally now finding an electrical solution that allows it to 'work' properly.

the Master Signature 1.1mv is really a whole different beast than the Koa Strad .38mv i think. but i am just brushing the surface so far.

btw; my almost new .38mv is still for sale.....and i am motivated.

Thank you, Mike, for explaining the chronology of your vdH cartridge acquisitions, and for untangling the nomenclature.

I look forward to your future reports on the Master Signature 1.1mV cartridge!

 

[microstrip]

DIN plugs almost always have crosstalk and that's what you're measuring! There are various test records that you can actually do the azimuth but listening to the track but not always consistent either.
david

The crosstalk in DIN plugs is due to capacitance, that is lower than the arm wire mutual cable capacitance in the arm tube. Considering that MC cartridges have low impedance, I can't see how the DIN plug can affect crosstalk measurement at 1 kHz.

If we have crosstalk due to capacitance it is usually an indication of problems with the tonearm cabling or connectors. One problem with DIN plugs is that due proximity of the contacts sometimes micro solder whiskers, not easily seen but easily measured, are created when soldering wires. They will surely create crosstalk. Old or used arms should always be checked with an ohmmeter BEFORE assembling the cartridge - I have found some surprises in very nice looking tonearms.

 

[ddk]

The crosstalk in DIN plugs is due to capacitance, that is lower than the arm wire mutual cable capacitance in the arm tube. Considering that MC cartridges have low impedance, I can't see how the DIN plug can affect crosstalk measurement at 1 kHz.

If we have crosstalk due to capacitance it is usually an indication of problems with the tonearm cabling or connectors. One problem with DIN plugs is that due proximity of the contacts sometimes micro solder whiskers, not easily seen but easily measured, are created when soldering wires. They will surely create crosstalk. Old or used arms should always be checked with an ohmmeter BEFORE assembling the cartridge - I have found some surprises in very nice looking tonearms.

Me too and in new ones as well.

david

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Thank you, Mike, for explaining the chronology of your vdH cartridge acquisitions, and for untangling the nomenclature.

I look forward to your future reports on the Master Signature 1.1mV cartridge!

for completeness; in addition to those three vdH Colibri's, back in 2003--2010 i owned 7 additional vdH Colibri's. so the count is up to 10 so far.

they are like temperamental girlfriends; every day is a delightful surprise or a nasty melt-down. every case unique. but none the less irresistible.

 

[kodomo]

I have gone crazy (not that it is crazy enough for most of you) and ordered an Ortofon Anna Diamond and a Kuzma Car60. Now the VdH has to go or my wife will sack me! I have used it very little (less than 100hrs) and will sell it for an incredibly low price so it goes fast, if anyone is interested, please contact me. As paypal does not work in Turkey I could not put it on ads part of the site, sorry.

 

[tima]

an Ortofon Anna Diamond and a Kuzma Car60.

Wow. Interesting choices. Do keep us informed. GLWS.

 

[Marcus]

I have gone crazy (not that it is crazy enough for most of you) and ordered an Ortofon Anna Diamond and a Kuzma Car60.

Congrats kodomo. CAR 60 is an exceptional cartridge.