I have 3 copper plates under my streamer. I grounded the top plate to the Tripoint NG yesterday. I will say no more! If you don't try it, you won't believe it!
Tidal La Assoluta system
- Thread starter Audiocrack
- Start date
Thanks for this picture (on which I recognize the Aardvark isolator as well). Adding a third slab of pure (untreated) copper under four of my audio components - Wadax reference server and Wadax reference dac as well as my two Acoustic Revive powerstrips - brought significant sonic improvements. What are in your audio system the sonic benefits resulting from adding a third copper slab?
The insertion of the second copper plate resulted in an immediate and significant SQ improvement, the effect of the third plate increased slowly but gradually. I was amazed at the effect when I took it out to make a threaded hole for the ground connection, and until then I only had the streamer on two plates. What can I say? I couldn't wait to put the third disc back in. The third disc slowly but surely refined the sound! There are only two copper plates under the DAC, but I have already ordered the third one.
And the grounding of the top plate is a miracle!
People change their system a lot in order to have the sound they like best, and in the meantime there will be certain points, which will become an inseparable part of the system. The Aardvark insulator is like that for me.
Hi Audiocrack,
Until now, the streamer, DAC and the top copper plates below them were connected separately to the ground port of the Tripoint Troy NG. Yesterday I tried the following: I connected the streamer and the bottom copper plate with separate wires, but to the common port of the Tripoint. I did the same with the DAC and the copper plate underneath. I also connected these with separate wires to the other common grounding port of the Tripoint NG. I couldn't believe my ears! So far I have connected all the ports of the Tripoint NG with a single ground wire. Connecting the device and its own top copper plate to a common port was fascinating to me.
Audiocrack, if you know, try it please! I am very curious if you have experienced something similar. I hope so, because so far we have always had the same experiences.
Until now, the streamer, DAC and the top copper plates below them were connected separately to the ground port of the Tripoint Troy NG. Yesterday I tried the following: I connected the streamer and the bottom copper plate with separate wires, but to the common port of the Tripoint. I did the same with the DAC and the copper plate underneath. I also connected these with separate wires to the other common grounding port of the Tripoint NG. I couldn't believe my ears! So far I have connected all the ports of the Tripoint NG with a single ground wire. Connecting the device and its own top copper plate to a common port was fascinating to me.
Audiocrack, if you know, try it please! I am very curious if you have experienced something similar. I hope so, because so far we have always had the same experiences.
Hello, very interesting experiment. Currently I am waiting for two new Tripoint grounding cables. When they have arrived I will try it out. Thanks for sharing this.
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For those who want to have an idea why the Kondo equipment is ‘special’ - their purity / non-mechanicalness has always appealed to me anyway - as well as expensive I refer to the following link:
Aluminium is a material that is ‘popular’ with audio manufacturers and that is of course for a reason: it is relatively easy to work with and relatively cheap in comparison to materials like copper and silver. However, aluminum has to my ears a ‘greyish’ tone of itself that I do not like because it does imho not resemble acoustic music being played live in a music hall. For this reason I have opted for (i) loudspeakers with cabinets which are not made out of aluminum - Tidal La Assoluta’s - and (ii) a preamp as well as power amplifiers with a chassis made out of copper (Kondo G-1000, Kondo Kagura’s and Kondo Gakuoh’s).
However, it is quite a challenge to avoid audio components made (partly) out of aluminum completely. For example the chassis of my Wadax reference dac, reference server and reference PSU are made out of aluminum. The same applies to the (two) powerstrips of Acoustic Revive I recently added to my audio system (one strip is solely being used for digital audio devices, to the other one I have connected only analog audio components). However, in order to ‘cancel out’ the negative sonic effects of aluminum I employ platforms made out of high quality, oxygen free and untreated (that is no coating is being used) copper under all my components (the LA’s are the only exception: although I would gladly place copper platforms under both my loudspeakers I am not looking forward to somehow lift these massive and very heavy transducers (each weighs nearly 500 kg).
In addition I am massloading all my digital audio components, my power amplifiers as well as my three Tripoint Audio ‘grounding’ stations with - again - pure copper slabs.
Recently I stacked three pure copper slabs (each slab weighs 25 kg) and placed them under my Acoustic Revive powerstrips. In addition I removed this week the standard four footers from each of these strips and replaced them with three RevOpods. Lastly I placed (again) a piece made out of pure copper on top of one of these strips (ideally I would have placed copper pieces on both strips but to my regret I have only one copper piece available). I will add a picture of this set up in a few minutes.
And as was to be expected the system greatly benefitted from these last steps regarding the two Acoustic Revive powerstrips. You do not need a ‘trained ear’ at all to hear immediately that with these steps I got rid off quite some distortion. In one word: wow!
However, it is quite a challenge to avoid audio components made (partly) out of aluminum completely. For example the chassis of my Wadax reference dac, reference server and reference PSU are made out of aluminum. The same applies to the (two) powerstrips of Acoustic Revive I recently added to my audio system (one strip is solely being used for digital audio devices, to the other one I have connected only analog audio components). However, in order to ‘cancel out’ the negative sonic effects of aluminum I employ platforms made out of high quality, oxygen free and untreated (that is no coating is being used) copper under all my components (the LA’s are the only exception: although I would gladly place copper platforms under both my loudspeakers I am not looking forward to somehow lift these massive and very heavy transducers (each weighs nearly 500 kg).
In addition I am massloading all my digital audio components, my power amplifiers as well as my three Tripoint Audio ‘grounding’ stations with - again - pure copper slabs.
Recently I stacked three pure copper slabs (each slab weighs 25 kg) and placed them under my Acoustic Revive powerstrips. In addition I removed this week the standard four footers from each of these strips and replaced them with three RevOpods. Lastly I placed (again) a piece made out of pure copper on top of one of these strips (ideally I would have placed copper pieces on both strips but to my regret I have only one copper piece available). I will add a picture of this set up in a few minutes.
And as was to be expected the system greatly benefitted from these last steps regarding the two Acoustic Revive powerstrips. You do not need a ‘trained ear’ at all to hear immediately that with these steps I got rid off quite some distortion. In one word: wow!
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For those who have never tried or heard it for themselves I suppose it is (quite) hard to imagine the tremendous positive sonic impact of the pure copper slabs which I am employing - be it as platforms for the audio components or as tools for mass loading - in my LA system. But believe me that I am not exaggerating when I remark that they are in combination with the grounding an absolute crucial part of the foundation on which my complete audio / LA set up is based. Just to illustrate the significance of these copper pieces: I am currently using 40 of them (they are all 2,5 cm thick). However, 40 copper slabs is not enough for an ‘ideal’ set up which in my view consists of three stacked pieces under each audio component and two stacked copper pieces on top of each audio device. Therefore I now and then experiment with these copper slabs and move them around in order to find the ‘best’ combination. Last week - and I had never done this before - I placed one copper slab on top of the PSU of my Kondo g-1000 preamp and another copper slab on top of the head unit of my Kondo g-1000 preamp. Both these units are being grounded with Tripoint Audio’s top of the line grounding cables: the one I am using for grounding the PSU of the g-1000 is connected to the Tripoint Audio Emperor NG ‘grounding’ station (Miguel’s state of the art ‘grounding’ box’) while the other statement grounding cable is connecting the head unit of the g-1000 to the Tripoint Audio Elite NG mk ii ‘grounding’ station. I was (again) surprised and absolutely impressed about how much better the LA system performed after this step. I just mention two sonic aspects: added serinity and more beautiful tonality.
I am currently waiting for two new Tripoint Audio grounding cables: they are going to be used for grounding the six diamond (midrange) drivers/tweeters in my Tidal La Assoluta loudspeakers. In addition I am thinking about adding a few more copper slabs to the LA system because they are so important.
I am currently waiting for two new Tripoint Audio grounding cables: they are going to be used for grounding the six diamond (midrange) drivers/tweeters in my Tidal La Assoluta loudspeakers. In addition I am thinking about adding a few more copper slabs to the LA system because they are so important.
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Hello Audiocrack. I'm relatively new to WBF. I think you have an incredible system. It reminds me of Carl's alias Apexorca's on AA who has a vintage Krell/Sonus Faber Fenice system. Your speakers are quite beautiful and I am sure that they produce beautiful music. Carl was and is very much into grounding and isolation and so am I, just in a far more modest and less expensive way. I have always maintained that having a well thought out plan essential to the success of any high end system but having said that, there is no substitute for having the money to afford the very best. Your system including your Wadax certainly ranks in the top three or four I have seen and your attention to detail may be the most meticulous.
I have attempted in a far more modest way to emulate you. Here is a picture of my XVX and MC3500's on their custom made granite blocks and Wilson Heavy Pedestals made especially for power amps. Also a pair of my AQ Niagara 5000's. My noise floor is exceptionally low. I have zero hum or hiss ear next to the speaker at full volume. I have a silent room. But having said all this, it's not much compared to the execution of grounding and isolation that I see here, which doesn't even look opulent or excessive it is so well thought out.
I have included some picture of my XVX. It's a very nice speaker.
Amps: McIntosh: MC3500MKII (2); MC1.25KW (2); MC2.1KW An
Preamp: C-12000 An
Sources: MCD12000 An; MVP881; MVP851; MR87; Marantz 510LV; Lenovo Yoga laptop
Speakers: Wilson Chronosonic XVX
Sub-Woofer: Wilson Thor’s Hammer; Wilson ActivXO Stereo Electronic Crossover
Cables Main System AQ: WEL Signature speaker cables; 24’ balanced IC; balanced 1-meter Dragon IC ; WEL Signature digital, Coffee digital coaxial cables; Diamond optical (2); Diamond USB; Dragon (5 HC, 3 source cords); Thunder & Monsoon power cords
Cables Subwoofer System AQ: Redwood speaker cable; Wolf balanced subwoofer IC; Wind balanced IC to ActivXO; Hurricane HC; Firebird HC; Firebird Source; Dragon HC, power cords
Power Conditioners: AQ Niagara 7000; Niagara 5000 (3); (4) dedicated 20-amp lines.
Isolation: Wilson Pedestals; Bassocontinuo McIntosh Ultra Feet; X-material plinth
Cabinet: Double Custom Woodwork & Design (CWD)
Acoustic Treatments: Room and Echo Tunes
I have attempted in a far more modest way to emulate you. Here is a picture of my XVX and MC3500's on their custom made granite blocks and Wilson Heavy Pedestals made especially for power amps. Also a pair of my AQ Niagara 5000's. My noise floor is exceptionally low. I have zero hum or hiss ear next to the speaker at full volume. I have a silent room. But having said all this, it's not much compared to the execution of grounding and isolation that I see here, which doesn't even look opulent or excessive it is so well thought out.
I have included some picture of my XVX. It's a very nice speaker.
Amps: McIntosh: MC3500MKII (2); MC1.25KW (2); MC2.1KW An
Preamp: C-12000 An
Sources: MCD12000 An; MVP881; MVP851; MR87; Marantz 510LV; Lenovo Yoga laptop
Speakers: Wilson Chronosonic XVX
Sub-Woofer: Wilson Thor’s Hammer; Wilson ActivXO Stereo Electronic Crossover
Cables Main System AQ: WEL Signature speaker cables; 24’ balanced IC; balanced 1-meter Dragon IC ; WEL Signature digital, Coffee digital coaxial cables; Diamond optical (2); Diamond USB; Dragon (5 HC, 3 source cords); Thunder & Monsoon power cords
Cables Subwoofer System AQ: Redwood speaker cable; Wolf balanced subwoofer IC; Wind balanced IC to ActivXO; Hurricane HC; Firebird HC; Firebird Source; Dragon HC, power cords
Power Conditioners: AQ Niagara 7000; Niagara 5000 (3); (4) dedicated 20-amp lines.
Isolation: Wilson Pedestals; Bassocontinuo McIntosh Ultra Feet; X-material plinth
Cabinet: Double Custom Woodwork & Design (CWD)
Acoustic Treatments: Room and Echo Tunes
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As your power amplifiers are high power the question is Does Audioquest Niagara 5000 (high current outlet) affect on dynamics in comparison by direct wall ?
You have assembled a beautiful system, Charles. My sincere congratulations!
Although my noise floor is extremely low due to all the grounding and my various copper platforms, I - unlike you - can hear some hiss/hum when I put my ear in front of the tweeters of my (pretty high sensitive) Tidal LA loudspeakers. So apparently your foundation is rock solid. Congrats again.
Amir, thank you for the question. Here is a quote from Audioquest concerning the Niagara 5000:
"Our Transient Power Correction ensures an ultra-low impedance buffered source for power amplifiers, providing over 90 amps peak for AC current transients, resulting in tighter, more powerful, and well-defined bass."
Whether there is any truth to this claim I have no idea. Each of my 3500's have their own Niagara 5000 and dedicated 20-amp line with no.10 wire straight out of the fuse box.
The MC2.1KW An Power Modules are plugged into a dedicated Niagara 5000 that has a similar 20-amp line. There certainly is a question as to whether one dedicated 20-amp line is enough for this beast to Power my Thor. Below is a picture of the needle at 2K watts required on "A Festive Psalm" track 10, The Turtle Creek Chorale. The bass blast at the end of the track is so prodigious that there is a heavy gust of wind that hits my legs and face from the massive ports of my Thor.
I think the AQ Niagara 5000's are excellent. I have made so many upgrades to my system that I will never have a definitive answer to your question, and I don't have enough wall outlets to run a test. It would be quite interesting if I could but even if I did, it would require more effort than I would be willing to expend. The AQ Edison outlets and the Dragon and Firebird power cords are so tight it is incredible, and I personally think too tight. Plugging and unplugging requires all my strength.
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Thank you Audiocrack so much. I have taken my available funds and spent it very carefully. Your system and speakers are on another level and your minimal hiss is totally acceptable, IMO. I will be following your system carefully as I also follow Apexorca and SCAudiophile's on AA. I wish that I could afford your amplification and your Wadax blows me away. Also, your arrangements of gear are quite meticulous and the extensive use of copper for your foundations are within the top 4 o5 I have ever seen.
Amps: McIntosh: MC3500MKII (2); MC1.25KW (2); MC2.1KW An
Preamp: C-12000 An
Sources: MCD12000 An; MVP881; MVP851; MR87; Marantz 510LV; Lenovo Yoga laptop
Speakers: Wilson Chronosonic XVX
Sub-Woofer: Wilson Thor’s Hammer; Wilson ActivXO Stereo Electronic Crossover
Cables Main System AQ: WEL Signature speaker cables; 24’ balanced IC; balanced 1-meter Dragon IC ; WEL Signature digital, Coffee digital coaxial cables; Diamond optical (2); Diamond USB; Dragon (5 HC, 3 source cords); Thunder & Monsoon power cords
Cables Subwoofer System AQ: Redwood speaker cable; Wolf balanced subwoofer IC; Wind balanced IC to ActivXO; Hurricane HC; Firebird HC; Firebird Source; Dragon HC, power cords
Power Conditioners: AQ Niagara 7000; Niagara 5000 (3); (4) dedicated 20-amp lines.
Isolation: Wilson Pedestals; Bassocontinuo McIntosh Ultra Feet; X-material plinth
Cabinet: Double Custom Woodwork & Design (CWD)
Acoustic Treatments: Room and Echo Tunes
Just to be sure about this Charles: the pure copper platforms are key for dealing with unwanted resonances. However, without the Tripoint Audio grounding I would never have been able to achieve the level of audio fidelity I am currently experiencing. The reason why I am lately concentrating my efforts on the Kondo G-1000 preamp is because I have grounded both the G-1000 PSU and G-1000 head unit with Tripoint Audio’s state of the art grounding cables. Through this grounding I am removing so much distortion that it makes my preamp sound not only clearly better in all important sonic areas - and I mean absolutely superior to the situation without the Tripoint Audio grounding - but also so (much more) transparent that the efforts with the copper slabs - as platforms as well as tools for mass loading - are more rewarding than ever before.
To illustrate this point: yesterday I removed the two copper pieces standing on top of the copper slabs which are being used for mass loading my two Kondo Gakuoh mk ii power amps: these are the same copper pieces as the one I am employing on top of one of my powerstrips: see the latest picture I shared in this thread. Thereafter I placed these two copper pieces on top of the G-1000 preamp.
The three reasons for trying this were the following:
- the copper slabs on top of my G-1000 preamp are larger and heavier than the copper slabs on top of my power amps (with the latter I can only place a copper slab on top of the relatively small transformer housings at the back of my Kondo Gakuoh mk ii power amps).
- each of the copper slabs on top of my G-1000 preamp is resting on three RevOpods while this was not the case with my Gakuoh mk ii power amps (with the latter this is quite ‘hazardous’ because the RevOpods can be tipped off quite easily)
- both units of my G-1000 preamp are being grounded while I am not yet grounding my two Gakuoh mk ii power amps (as was mentioned earlier in this thread I am currently waiting for two new Tripoint Audio grounding cables. At first I am going to ground the (in total) six diamond (midrange) drivers of my Tidal LA loudspeakers with these new cables; I know for sure that the sonic results for the better of this next step are going to be very impressive indeed. But of course I will ground my two power amps somewhere in the future as well).
The sonic benefits of placing the two copper pieces on top of the G-1000 were clearly more profound than the sonic losses I experienced by removing these pieces from the two power amps. Actually I was pleasantly surprised by the magnitude of the sonic differences for the better: of course I had hoped for better results but I did not expect them in this magnitude. Apparently the three afore mentioned reasons play an important role.
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Audiocrack, I went back and read Alex3's very positive comments regarding the grounding cables. I also read your feelings concerning aluminum as a material vs copper. I think the thing that I admire the most about you is that you have made some very astute fundamental decisions, first your wonderful speakers and their extensive use of diamond deposition. This must be an incredible technology. I am sure that your La Assoluta's will be keepers for years to come. Next was your choice of single ended triode power taking full advantage of their high sensitivity. Next because your amps and pre are single ended the use of the very expensive copper power strips followed by the incredible grounding and copper isolation, resulting in a noise floor that is incredibly low. You have put together a masterpiece and I an not exaggerating. I can hardly wait to know your impressions when you get your mids and tweeters grounded.
I have gone a less expensive but IMO quite effective route which begins with a Transguard TG60 whole house surge protector that has a superb main power line filter. It sits between the enormous transfer switch of my whole house GE 60K watt generator and my light pole. It makes an incredible difference in my noise floor, more than any power conditioner possibly could. Next I chose to go fully balanced whole system that included my C-12000 An and MCD12000 An and of course my 3500's. All my power cords in my main system are Dragons and all my cables and IC's are solid silver, very expensive, either Wel Signature or Dragons. My cables, cords, and conditioners are significantly more expensive than my Mac gear. And of course I went with a Niagara 7000 with HC Dragon power cord that powers all my source gear from a dedicated 20 amp line. And 3 Niagara 5000's for my amps with judicious of Wilson Pedestals for excellent isolation. All this results in what I believe to be quite excellent resolution/transparency through my XVX. It is surprising how resolving/transparent the new McIntosh reference gear can be using exclusively solid silver.
But my efforts pale in what you are doing with your superb single ended tubes powering your La Assoluta's with those amazing copper power strips, copper grounding cables, and copper foundations and isolation feet. I went the conventional route as you know. But you have chosen a remarkable unconventional way to wring the absolute best out of your La Assoluta's. Quite amazing and congratulations on achieving such a unique system that as I have said previously is among the top 4 or 5 systems I have had the privilege of admiring. And you are still improving it.
You can listen to wellfloat boards under kondo electronics and kondo power supply and also wellfloat delta under tidal speakers. Wellfloat has great impact on the sound and decrease distortion without killing life and energy of music.
You will be shocked if you use wellfloat.
I also use Neodio B2 under cables.
There a taiwan corporation produce ground conditioner it’s name is Telos, it seems $50k telos is better than other ground conditioner.
If you hear minor pink noise in your speakers it means your kondo amplifers are the best amplifiers in the world, minor pink noise shows Kondo does not use negative feedback so do not worry about it.
Kondo, Audio Note , Vitus Audio (SS) , Robert Koda (SS) all do not use negative feedback and all of them are Class A .
I agree Charles about lowering noise by using good AC power generator because the main reason of pollution is wall AC. If you get good result from copper plates maybe it is about emi/rfi rejection .
Kevin designer of Living Voice use metal plates under each floor of Rack. I am not sure but I think metal surface return the electromagnetic wave
Kevin designer of Living Voice use metal plates under each floor of Rack. I am not sure but I think metal surface return the electromagnetic wave
