Visit to Chris to See Magico M9 and VYGER and Pilium in Southlake, Texas

[Rexp]

I agree it gets old. Not only does it get old, it degrades discussion.

I suppose blaming forum members (flies?) for their responses to a post is a perspective. Another perspective is to ask what in the post might have caused those responses.

I see a visit to an audiophile's home to hear his system and talk with hm about it in a video as a different sort of animal from a 15 minute visit to a dealer's showroom.

In this thread the dealer is not interviewed on camera. Rather than learning about the showroom from the dealer's description a video is posted along with Ron Resnick's subjective opinion about the room, but not about the system. The video has the camera walking around a room showing different components in the system while overlaid by a montage of audio recordings of the system being shown. At first blush, without written or verbal comment about the showcased system, it seems that it is the job of the video to speak for the system in the room. Once someone asks "where's the bass?" we are told the audio portion of the video is not representative of the actual sound of the system and only included for casual musical accompaniment. (Which is rather odd as we have plenty of posted videos with decent bass.)

Then responses to that come from forum members. As usual it is ****** who turns the discussion from the dealer or the system to editorialze about videos in general. (That is not an attack but a statement of fact.) That devolves into talk about DACs. Then the thread goes this way then that as do many threads when the discussion gets off topic, when it turns to videos -- not about the subject of the video, but the truth-value of the video and all videos. People have different opinions.

WBF could disallow system videos -- harsh perhaps but effective. Or WBF could say posts that discuss the truth-value of videos or the representativeness of system videos will be deleted. Or WBF could say that only system videos are allowed where the video maker attests that the video is representative and discussion about whether someone believes any video can be representative will be deleted. WBF has many options to act in its best interest -- it censors out politics and religion, why not talk about the general value of videos? It is personal choice to watch a video or not. Simply railing about the redundancy of the video topic gets nowhere and as long as such discussion is available, people will continue to react.

Many people are listening to system videos on faulty equipment that doesn't reproduce the sound properly so it's no surprise they don't find them useful.
Currently I'm demoing dongle DACs for my new phone and so far, out of the 6 tried, not one can reproduce a youtube video as well as the headphone jack in my old phone.

 

[the sound of Tao]

no one has ever, EVER, made that claim. EVER.

The claims have always been twisted. There’s a world of difference between the notions of being indicative in ways rather than an exact replication, in being representative rather than being the same, or in being some evidence rather than being an absolute proof. It’s hard to understand all the angst.

 

[bonzo75]

It’s hard to understand all the angst.

people want to prove the point they made a few years ago was right. They couldn’t have been wrong. How dare you

 

[tima]

Many people are listening to system videos on faulty equipment that doesn't reproduce the sound properly so it's no surprise they don't find them useful.

Yes, playback is a big variable.

I believe it is incumbent on the poster only to present videos they believe are representative. After that, the viewer should understand the adequacy of their playback and comment (or not) accordingly.

 

[the sound of Tao]

people want to prove the point they made a few years ago was right. They couldn’t have been wrong. How dare you

I just know that Ron added a video which brought an addition of dimension to his sharing of his story and how it’d be a shame to not have that freedom because the concept of supporting with some moving visuals blows people’s minds and then creates irredeemable endless conflict.

 

[PeterA]

The thread title says it all. It is about seeing the system, not hearing it. The video let’s us see it. We have seen it many times before. This is the first time there is system sound of Chris’s M9. I am still surprised this was even allowed. And here we are.

Ron tells us cone speaker listeners would love the M9, but he tells us nothing about how it sounds. He lets the video do the talking because he does not do the writing. And here we are. Ron set this up. The following discussion was inevitable: both the comment about the bass and the super moderator stepping in to editorialize.

 

[Al M.]

Ron tells us cone speaker listeners would love the M9, but he tells us nothing about how it sounds. He lets the video do the talking because he does not do the writing. And here we are. Ron set this up. The following discussion was inevitable: both the comment about the bass and the super moderator stepping in to editorialize.

Well summarized, Peter.

 

[Alrainbow]

a few thoughts and why I can’t enjoy positing anymore
1- Ron puts the time in and I do love his videos not just the sound but is interesting questions and follow up questions.
what ever he is up to to my view shows a clear love of this hobby yet gets kicked often.

2- why the cost of parts in any audio product and how it relates to end consumer cost is childish and shows hate of makers.

3- I can’t say where and maybe it was a private videos shared to me , but it was the magico in that room.
And while some feel videos are meaningless, the sound was amazing in every way.

4- Kedar and a few others have shared to me and posted links of such videos that no matter how I played back were a holy trinity sound.

Most were rock oldies like what Ron commented on
Now maybe it’s just childhood nostalgia or maybe i was stoned back then , but these videos portray versions of sound I’ve not got close to hearing myself before.
It’s a truly shameful how some post with such harsh and purposely worded comments to offend others.
and lastly some do with far less then adequate systems and claim to have bat hearing to extract from.

 

[joey_v]

For such a high end forum, why are we requiring Ron to put a preceding caution that his video will not capture the extent of the sound?

 

[thedudeabides]

I just don’t understand the point of taking 15 mins to get only video clips of 1/3rd part of such an interesting venue.

Didn't the OP say he had only two hours to visit the showroom including 15 minutes of music listening? Three other observations. The two dudes listening to the music seemed like they were overjoyed with the experience. The constant discussion / litigation of video sound quality as pointed out by the Moderator. And finally, the criticism of the OP's well intentioned efforts.

 

[joey_v]

Sure reads like that was your visit.

You said nothing about other activities -- why not? I had no reason to interpolate. You had plenty of opportunity to be clear about your activities. Only in retrospect are you adding to your story.

edit: and Ron, if you want to fuss about reading and processing, look unto yourself. You should note I never mentioned you in my contrast. A stand alone sentence...

Regardless if you don’t mention Ron’s name specifically - posting about a 15 minute dealer visit in a dealer visit thread with the exact 15 minute that was wrongfully extracted from the post means you were discussing no other person but Ron.

 

[bonzo75]

Didn't the OP say he only had 15 minutes?

Exactly. If you had only 15 mins would you go for a movie or a concert? Just don’t go. The objective of going somewhere is not to just high five the person there and go back

 

[Al M.]

For such a high end forum, why are we requiring Ron to put a preceding caution that his video will not capture the extent of the sound?

Because it is obvious that people *still* take sound from videos far too seriously.

 

[joey_v]

Exactly. If you had only 15 mins would you go for a movie or a concert? Just don’t go. The objective of going somewhere is not to just high five the person there and go back

Kedar
Ron went for 2 hours.
You do understand that Ron just covered SWAF and went to visit Todd’s that same week?
I went to SWAF for a few hours each day, engineered the Dallas Audiophile Club Dinner and hung out with Ron at a bar after dinner and I was already wiped.
Cut the man a break.

 

[bonzo75]

Kedar
Ron went for 2 hours.
You do understand that Ron just covered SWAF and went to visit Todd’s that same week?
I went to SWAF for a few hours each day, engineered the Dallas Audiophile Club Dinner and hung out with Ron at a bar after dinner and I was already wiped.
Cut the man a break.

Yes my point is I wouldn’t go it’s quite simple. When you visit someone take time or don’t go. When I go to Munich and I get only a weekend I don’t visit people in Germany, I make a separate trip. There are many people in all cities I have been to i want to meet, I will visit them when I have time.

Also, this is the first we are hearing two hours. Previously it was 15 mins.

 

[Argonaut]

There are many people in all cities I have been to i want to meet, I will visit them when I have time.

The sudden rush for restraining orders has brought legal systems across Europe to a grinding halt

 

[Kingrex]

I wish Ron would have chimed in and said the music is a CD overlay on the video for ambiance. Let people analyze that.

 

[Chop]

a few thoughts and why I can’t enjoy positing anymore
1- Ron puts the time in and I do love his videos not just the sound but is interesting questions and follow up questions.
what ever he is up to to my view shows a clear love of this hobby yet gets kicked often.

2- why the cost of parts in any audio product and how it relates to end consumer cost is childish and shows hate of makers.

3- I can’t say where and maybe it was a private videos shared to me , but it was the magico in that room.
And while some feel videos are meaningless, the sound was amazing in every way.

4- Kedar and a few others have shared to me and posted links of such videos that no matter how I played back were a holy trinity sound.

Most were rock oldies like what Ron commented on
Now maybe it’s just childhood nostalgia or maybe i was stoned back then , but these videos portray versions of sound I’ve not got close to hearing myself before.
It’s a truly shameful how some post with such harsh and purposely worded comments to offend others.
and lastly some do with far less then adequate systems and claim to have bat hearing to extract from.

What he said. (my emphasis).
Nuff said...

 

[Kingrex]

a few thoughts and why I can’t enjoy positing anymore
1- Ron puts the time in and I do love his videos not just the sound but is interesting questions and follow up questions.
what ever he is up to to my view shows a clear love of this hobby yet gets kicked often.

2- why the cost of parts in any audio product and how it relates to end consumer cost is childish and shows hate of makers.

3- I can’t say where and maybe it was a private videos shared to me , but it was the magico in that room.
And while some feel videos are meaningless, the sound was amazing in every way.

4- Kedar and a few others have shared to me and posted links of such videos that no matter how I played back were a holy trinity sound.

Most were rock oldies like what Ron commented on
Now maybe it’s just childhood nostalgia or maybe i was stoned back then , but these videos portray versions of sound I’ve not got close to hearing myself before.
It’s a truly shameful how some post with such harsh and purposely worded comments to offend others.
and lastly some do with far less then adequate systems and claim to have bat hearing to extract from.

Ron does get kicked at times. But video of an audio system playing is a snake vs scorpion match. If you post a video as such you have to accept the meaning your trying to convey will soon be lost. Youtube and Audiogon forum are plasters with them. When I accidentally pick one I shut it off as fast as I can and pray the metadata or whatever they use to track me does not think I like it.

Per my comment above, I would much rather someone walk the room and talk about the equipment. Then overlay music from a CD for affect. That to me would be a real educational production.

Rons video where he interviews people are fun. I like the one on Field Coils.

 

[Bobvin]

Well I personally don’t understand the visit? Ron sells a competing panel speaker, and has heard what Chris offers elsewhere — so that aspect is suspicious.

He goes to a place with one of the premier speakers available (M9) and doesn’t allow time for a genuine audition? Is the purpose to do a quick visit like visiting a room at an audio show?

Chris has a couple superbly built rooms for auditioning, was the visit to learn about that? Is Ron trying to solidify his bona fides as a youtube influencer? As an audio reviewer? All while now having a commercial interest?

Was it a social visit? Then why post a video and just instead write a couple paragraphs?

Seems odd for a competitor to visit and post anything?