Visit to Henk van der Hoeven -- Apogee Acoustics Re-builder/Restorer
- Thread starter Ron Resnick
- Start date
-
- Tags
- apogee acoustics grand henk
Speaking of Ayon, have you heard some of their top models?? I will get a chance to try the 6C33C based Helios at home soon I hope. The new Crossfire Evo looks VERY interesting as well. The smaller, stereo Crossfire III is considered one of the top rate integrateds in Europe. The guys from High Fidelity in Poland love this brand... One of the best, non-horn, demos I ever heard in Munich was with the Ayon 52B reference monos (made then by Mastersound I believe) and one of LumenWhites earlier designs. That was gobsmacking good.
Little known Apogee FK1 Perigee ribbon hybrid. The Rowan amps are interesting (not plugged in in the shots). 65 Watts at 8 Ohm.
But wait for it... 1 Kilowatt at 0.5 Ohms!!!!!!!!!!
Interesting, I heard the Perigees once in Rapperswil, Switzerland at a dealer there that was a long time Apogee dealer/restorer. The ribbon, fantatstic, but I felt the integration and bass were a step behind.
No, but Joel, who writes for 6 moons, and at whose place I compared Luxman m800 and the ypsilon aelius, rates the ayon orthos highly. He has been through quite a few SS amps on both Vivid G1s and Maggie 20.7, so I am interested in listening to them. 300 watts in triode and 400 in pentode
I'll be flat out honest and say I'm not keen on them. They are actually Jon's, the UK Apogee refurbisher. He likes them a lot. Other people did too at that bake off.
All those amp shots and some of the other bits of kit are just people bringing round gear to try on the Apogees. In other words it is just real world kit owned by people of normal means. I'll try anything, me, and it is always enjoyable to have people round to share experiences.
An analogy might be acquiring a high performance car, in which one is always aware of the suspension working; or another where the power of the engine is constantly brought to one's attention. My perspective is that experiencing the landscape through which I travel is the objective, and that the vehicle is merely the means of doing that, and will always behave exactly as required, in every situation - and will never make one aware of any limitation in its capabilities, no matter how "tough" the going is, or how fast you want to travel ...
I remember having heard Rockport Aviors with Tenor 350 OTLs and a top line Total Dac in a complete SMT room (flyer's), another Avior with Koda K10 and AR Ref 10 preamps going into Koda power amps and AR CD 9 in a decent room, and then an Avior with Spectral DMA 400s and an acoustiplan CD in a poor room. I never liked Aviors, and the third set up sounded the least good when I was playing the digital. Until, that is, we put on his SPJ Alba with its own air bearing linear tracker and Koetsu Blue Lace and FMA 122 (now replaced with audio tekne). And I went WOW! Till then, I had been wearing the same thing Frantz does () and trying to ignore vinyl, and that was when I decided screw all that, I have to get a TT at some point as much as I would not like to.
) and trying to ignore vinyl, and that was when I decided screw all that, I have to get a TT at some point as much as I would not like to.We do this fairly frequently as well. A lot of gear hauling and testing. Someone is always got something "new". We have tried many many different amps on Apogees over the years. Especially Studio Grands with the subs turned off (basically an advanced Duetta on a stand then).
I remember having heard Rockport Aviors with Tenor 350 OTLs and a top line Total Dac in a complete SMT room (flyer's), another Avior with Koda K10 and AR Ref 10 preamps going into Koda power amps and AR CD 9 in a decent room, and then an Avior with Spectral DMA 400s and an acoustiplan CD in a poor room. I never liked Aviors, and the third set up sounded the least good when I was playing the digital. Until, that is, we put on his SPJ Alba with its own air bearing linear tracker and Koetsu Blue Lace and FMA 122 (now replaced with audio tekne). And I went WOW! Till then, I had been wearing the same thing Frantz does (
Never much cared for Spectral sound...
My point was that three very different sounding amps did not make me like the speaker, but the TT gave the system a gigantic leap.
As for Spectral, it can sound boring, but requires careful set up and seems to like a valve pre, unlike what the company recommends. It also requires a very good room that does not restrict its dynamism and bass. If that dynamism and bass is constrained, it will sound like any other amp on those characteristics, plus feel dry and uninvolving.
Marty's system was considered by those who visited him to be one of the top systems, with Spectral 400 contributing significantly to that sound, but a VTL pre going into it. He owned the Siegfrieds before, and I compared the Spectral 400s to VTL S400 and can see the advantage of Spectral, though it's not my preference because of the insistence on MIT
Another example is the trio with the bass horns, which I have liked with class Avantgarde 150w power (and pre) and Esoteric transport, then an AN 5 dac added after the transport, then AG amps changed to 9w 300b Airtight integrated, and also with an Oppo and Exasound going Tom Evans electronics. The speaker sounds great.
It did not sound good with AN 9w 300b integrated because they could not control it. Keep the wrong amp out and you have many choices.
I have heard the Tune Audio Anima with Devialet (plus goldmund reference), Trafomatic 120w amps as in Munich, Aries Cerat Diana with EERA CDP and Verdier Platine, and Modwright 150w amps with Modwright Dac.
hORNS Universum heard with multiple amps too - 12w push pull EL34 valves, Ming Da 35k 80w, Ming Da 2k integrated, Lampi GM70.
Pick the speaker, the rest will fall in place quite easily, a few merry go rounds might be required based on the individual's level of OCD. If there is anything that will make people mismatch electronics, it is preconceived insistence on something like SETs, valves (which would be my first preference as well), etc, rather than being flexible enough to listen for that match.
It did not sound good with AN 9w 300b integrated because they could not control it. Keep the wrong amp out and you have many choices.
I have heard the Tune Audio Anima with Devialet (plus goldmund reference), Trafomatic 120w amps as in Munich, Aries Cerat Diana with EERA CDP and Verdier Platine, and Modwright 150w amps with Modwright Dac.
hORNS Universum heard with multiple amps too - 12w push pull EL34 valves, Ming Da 35k 80w, Ming Da 2k integrated, Lampi GM70.
Pick the speaker, the rest will fall in place quite easily, a few merry go rounds might be required based on the individual's level of OCD. If there is anything that will make people mismatch electronics, it is preconceived insistence on something like SETs, valves (which would be my first preference as well), etc, rather than being flexible enough to listen for that match.
I remember having heard Rockport Aviors with Tenor 350 OTLs and a top line Total Dac in a complete SMT room (flyer's), another Avior with Koda K10 and AR Ref 10 preamps going into Koda power amps and AR CD 9 in a decent room, and then an Avior with Spectral DMA 400s and an acoustiplan CD in a poor room. I never liked Aviors, and the third set up sounded the least good when I was playing the digital. Until, that is, we put on his SPJ Alba with its own air bearing linear tracker and Koetsu Blue Lace and FMA 122 (now replaced with audio tekne). And I went WOW! Till then, I had been wearing the same thing Frantz does (
IMHO this only proves that the system and room were not properly tuned to the digital source. Digital is much more critical to tune than analog reproduction. I have owned the CD9 - a great player - but most of the time I have listened to it sounding poor or just reasonable in shows and shops. It needs the proper power and signal cables to match a system (that should be preferably all ARC...). The previous unit, the CD8, was not as detailed as the CD9, but was much easier to match.
IMHO this type of vinyl/digital A/B in the same system will just show you if the system is matched to vinyl or digital. IMHO in order to have a correct perspective you have to listen to both showing their best - and forget about the certitude given by instantaneous A/B WOW!
He was a dealer of audio research. I don't remember which cables he was using but they would have been well matched (to his ears). I really don't think that was the issue, which is why I gave multiple examples.
Yes the SPJ system was matched to vinyl. But that was the only thing that made the aviors sound decent (to my ears), rather than anything else. This is not about digital vs vinyl AB
Yes the SPJ system was matched to vinyl. But that was the only thing that made the aviors sound decent (to my ears), rather than anything else. This is not about digital vs vinyl AB
A side comment - I have found that dealers in general have a real problem when mixing brands in systems - they must restrict to cables or equipment they sell. Although this limitation can be acceptable when assembling single brand systems, as they usually distribute accessory and cable brands that optimize their products, it is too restrictive when mixing. For example, the mix and change system does not allow a dealer to use the better Transparent Audio cables in the system you refer!
The best solid state sound I have ever listened to used the Constellation Audio Hercules II monoblocks / Altair II. I can imagine it would be a great match for ribbons ...
Possible, but you are focusing on one of the parts of one of the examples. Being in those different rooms, I am quite sure the only that made a difference to me was the TT.
Similar threads
