Modern speakers vs Vintage speakers

[bonzo75]

Sorry, what speakers are playing there? They sound great!

That isn't speakers playing, that is music played over the video

 

[thomask]

Accuphase DG-68 Digital Voicing Equalizer​

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal. A great conceptsound enough to serve as the foundation for an independent democratic nation.

www.stereophile.com

It seems that JVS had been fascinated with Accuphase DG-68 Digital Voicing Equalizer .




I had been usin DG-28 model since 2001.

This weekend I will bring DG-28 down to second floor ( I have only few items left on third floor including my headphone set up and etc).

Altec A7 gave enough signal at 31.5 hz, but only faint rumbling at 25hz, 20hz, when I tested Stereophile test disc.

I may try to have A7 to give deeper bass and more flat response through all frequency.

 

[morricab]

Personal Ranking 1"driver
1. Tad 2001
2. B&C de250
3. Beyma Cp380
4. Radian 475

I had them all here to test, distortions mostly come from the crossover use good resistors, capacitors and coils. here the best resistors change the sound dramatically with heatsink 10 watt.

ISA PBH-10R0-F1 - Widerstand, Manganin, 10 Ohm, TO-247, 3 W, 1%

3 W Manganinwiderstand, gegurtet Bauform PBH (ähnlich TO 247) Präzisionswiderstandsmaterial MANGANIN® hohe Stabilität kleine Induktivität Wärmewiderstand zur Grundplatte: 4 K/W max. Leistu [...]

www.reichelt.de

CP350Ti is quite a bit better, IMO , than CP380M because the Ti diaphragm sounds more realistic. It is not harsh at all but to my ears metal diaphragms when something be right have higher potential than plastic ones, which seem to leave something out in the realism department.

 

[DasguteOhr]

if you don't want the horn driver's own sound, there's no getting around TAD Driver. if you hear differences is the flanged horn and its stability. For example when you Altec original horns build a wooden box, place the horn and fill the box with sand. that calms the horn enormously you no longer have any parasitic resonance from the horn. most important rule steam or build the horns so that they cannot resonate. i had hornspeaker a long and expensive journey for over 7 years. now likes more openbaffles because of the electrostatic-like spatial mapping of the music and fast deep-reaching bass.
i don't want to act like a senior teacher, but that's my experience with horn loudspeakers. so have fun with your speakers and enjoy your music over them.
a little informative video in my opinion

 

[morricab]

Personal Ranking 1"driver
1. Tad 2001
2. B&C de250
3. Beyma Cp380
4. Radian 475

I had them all here to test, distortions mostly come from the crossover use good resistors, capacitors and coils. here the best resistors change the sound dramatically with heatsink 10 watt.

ISA PBH-10R0-F1 - Widerstand, Manganin, 10 Ohm, TO-247, 3 W, 1%

3 W Manganinwiderstand, gegurtet Bauform PBH (ähnlich TO 247) Präzisionswiderstandsmaterial MANGANIN® hohe Stabilität kleine Induktivität Wärmewiderstand zur Grundplatte: 4 K/W max. Leistu [...]

www.reichelt.de

Interesting you put the Radian last. I have the 475pb Be version and can’t get it to sound really good. My Beymas sound better. The main one I use in my DIY system is the CP755TI with an 18 Sound XT1464 Horn.

 

[DasguteOhr]

Interesting you put the Radian last. I have the 475pb Be version and can’t get it to sound really good. My Beymas sound better. The main one I use in my DIY system is the CP755TI with an 18 Sound XT1464 Horn.

Radian 475 have two significant problems - they only emit sound at an angle of 20 degrees with high energy. you need a narrow horn to sound it good. the other problem is the sharp drop over 12khz with sound pressure output. You lost 10db at 16 khz* not my cup of tea.

P.S in my coax *

 

[morricab]

Radian 475 have two significant problems - they only emit sound at an angle of 20 degrees with high energy. you need a narrow horn to sound it good. the other problem is the sharp drop over 12khz with sound pressure output. You lost 10db at 16 khz* not my cup of tea.

P.S in my coax *

Ok, it seems like it is a good match for L'Cleach horns but not for the Iwata 600 I tried it with. I also noticed it was quite rolled off (the Be version is even worse than the Al version) comparatively... I compensated it but still didn't sound right...rather dry and forward.

 

[DasguteOhr]

Ok, it seems like it is a good match for L'Cleach horns but not for the Iwata 600 I tried it with. I also noticed it was quite rolled off (the Be version is even worse than the Al version) comparatively... I compensated it but still didn't sound right...rather dry and forward.

will definitely sound better, but somehow the driver lacks soul in the music.
Back to vintage speaker when you listen most time classical music, buy a Studer A727Cd a little set tube amp and fieldcoil speaker.
Amazing clarity in the tones,you will get a lot tears of joy and goosebumps.

 

[jeff1225]

will definitely sound better, but somehow the driver lacks soul in the music.
Back to vintage speaker when you listen most time classical music, buy a Studer A727Cd a little set tube amp and fieldcoil speaker.
Amazing clarity in the tones,you will get a lot tears of joy and goosebumps.

That is a fascinating looking speak, do you know much about it?

 

[DasguteOhr]

That is a fascinating looking speak, do you know much about it?

do you mean the fieldcoil speaker? I have someone in my circle of friends who listens to music with something like that. the speaker in the video is 2-way speakers are klangfilm bass 16 "on top of the horn and telefunken 8-10" in the frontloaded horn. supposition,I can't see it exactly. the Telefunken fieldcoils run well with 100-120volt DC.

Sorry the bass is not connected

 

[DasguteOhr]

The TAD 4003 is quite superior to the 4001 and 2001. The 2002 also to the 2001 and used as upper frequency to the 4001 and 4003.

Leif and his fellow Vikings have done more research on these drivers than anyone I have heard of

It may sound better, I haven't used it yet, but the Tad 2001 can be coupled much deeper from 200 Hz. when it is operated with a maximum power of 10 watts. the diaphragm has a polymer suspension so that it can move more without being destroyed

 

[bonzo75]

It may sound better, I haven't used it yet, but the Tad 2001 can be coupled much deeper from 200 Hz. when it is operated with a maximum power of 10 watts. the diaphragm has a polymer suspension so that it can move more without being destroyed

Most use the the TAD 2001 as upper frequency to the midrange 4001/2/3. That's how Tang's Cessaro Gamma uses it, and the Vox Olympian use the 2002. I have seen many DIYers use it from 1000 up. The lowest I have heard it used (and I have heard the speaker) is at 650.

 

[Verdier]

i had hornspeaker a long and expensive journey for over 7 years. now likes more openbaffles because of the electrostatic-like spatial mapping of the music and fast deep-reaching bass.
i don't want to act like a senior teacher, but that's my experience with horn loudspeakers.

Open Baffle - Interesting suggestion.

However, I'm afraid open baffles have much greater room and placement requirements in terms of distance from the back wall and side wall and to listener. Even the nature of the walls (smooth or diffusion) is likely to be important - at least that's how one electrostatic manufacturer explained it to me. In the case of horns, the distance to the rear wall and to the side wall should play a much more subordinate role, including the nature of the walls. Or am I mistaken?

Best regards
Verdier

 

[ddk]

Open Baffle - Interesting suggestion.

However, I'm afraid open baffles have much greater room and placement requirements in terms of distance from the back wall and side wall and to listener. Even the nature of the walls (smooth or diffusion) is likely to be important - at least that's how one electrostatic manufacturer explained it to me. In the case of horns, the distance to the rear wall and to the side wall should play a much more subordinate role, including the nature of the walls. Or am I mistaken?

Best regards
Verdier

IME every speaker type including horns, open baffled or not are sensitive to placement and room within the confines of a listening room even large ones.

david

 

[DasguteOhr]

Most use the the TAD 2001 as upper frequency to the midrange 4001/2/3. That's how Tang's Cessaro Gamma uses it, and the Vox Olympian use the 2002. I have seen many DIYers use it from 1000 up. The lowest I have heard it used (and I have heard the speaker) is at 650.

You are registered in the German analog forum, write to the user Dietmar. he repairs and magnetizes such horn drivers. that was a tip from him that he goes much deeper if you limit the power.

P.S you find find him Sato horn thread

 

[DasguteOhr]

Open Baffle - Interesting suggestion.

However, I'm afraid open baffles have much greater room and placement requirements in terms of distance from the back wall and side wall and to listener. Even the nature of the walls (smooth or diffusion) is likely to be important - at least that's how one electrostatic manufacturer explained it to me. In the case of horns, the distance to the rear wall and to the side wall should play a much more subordinate role, including the nature of the walls. Or am I mistaken?

Best regards
Verdier

I say minimun are 3 feet away from the corners of the room, so that a dipole speaker sounds good. you need 2 big woofers 12 "-15 in a baffle or Ripol subwoofer. the back wall should not be a window.

 

[bonzo75]

You are registered in the German analog forum, write to the user Dietmar. he repairs and magnetizes such horn drivers. that was a tip from him that he goes much deeper if you limit the power.

P.S you find find him Sato horn thread

Yes am aware of Dietmar.. Will visit him once

 

[dwhistance]

Most use the the TAD 2001 as upper frequency to the midrange 4001/2/3. That's how Tang's Cessaro Gamma uses it, and the Vox Olympian use the 2002. I have seen many DIYers use it from 1000 up. The lowest I have heard it used (and I have heard the speaker) is at 650.

Jean Michel LeCleach used to use the TAD2001 from very low, 200-250Hz from memory. I had some email correspondence in the early 2000's with him about it, he felt it was the best driver for this particular implementation, much better than the bigger TAD's or the later 2002. Sadly I can't seem to find those emails now as they were full of useful suggestions which I haven't seen elsewhere and my memory is no longer as reliable as it once was!

All the best

David

 

[bonzo75]

Jean Michel LeCleach used to use the TAD2001 from very low, 200-250Hz from memory. I had some email correspondence in the early 2000's with him about it, he felt it was the best driver for this particular implementation, much better than the bigger TAD's or the later 2002. Sadly I can't seem to find those emails now as they were full of useful suggestions which I haven't seen elsewhere and my memory is no longer as reliable as it once was!

All the best

David

I did read one post of someone using a tad without crossover from very low. Was this the one without a crossover?

 

[DasguteOhr]

I did read one post of someone using a tad without crossover from very low. Was this the one without a crossover?

OMG...no
Cut of 300Hz 24db linkewitz xover
Use this Radialhorn 80cm 200hz around 600-700€

r-Trak horns

Highend Manufaktur rund um Hornlautsprecher und Komponenten. Hersteller der Hölzhörner r-Trak - sTrak & eTrak. Sonderanfertigungen & Kleinserien.

www.lautsprechermanufaktur-heyder.de