Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[John T]

Emile,

We are probably purchasing a loom of top of the line Albedo cables for our system. However, they don‘t make an Ethernet cable at this time.

Will an A-B Tech REN Ethernet Isolator work well with the Extreme + Switch. Or would you suggest something else?

PS: If my dealer can make it here (traffic at the beaches is horrible and he’s normally 2 + hours away in regular traffic) I will be ordering a black Xtreme and black Switch later this week.

Joe, I've tried a number of ethernet cables. As Emile indicated Cat 5 or 6 seems to be the winner. I have also talked with a number of other Taiko users and they found the same results...

 

[Audire]

Joe, I've tried a number of ethernet cables. As Emile indicated Cat 5 or 6 seems to be the winner. I have also talked with a number of other Taiko users and they found the same results...

Thanks. I presently have a Shunyata Sigma, which is a Cat 6a cable. So, I’ll try it first.

 

[wil]

Will the router be in your listening room? If so, there’s your Wi-Fi.

Oh…. Thanks! You guys are saving me a lot of heartache and trouble!

 

[RUIN*ish]

Will first run black routers ship at the same time as chrome?

 

[Audire]

In Purchasing the Taiko I’ll have to rethink my rack arrangement.

If I’m correct the Extreme is 19” wide - the same as my present shelves. This means a less than optimal location for the Taiko as will have to go on the top shelf - Taiko’s instructions state it should go on the bottom shelf.

There‘s no room to purchase another shelf to place the Taiko on a dedicated rack by itself.

Does anyone have any other suggestions?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Will first run black routers ship at the same time as chrome?

Cannot say for sure, I hope so but black does take much longer then chrome.

 

[Taiko Audio]

In Purchasing the Taiko I’ll have to rethink my rack arrangement.

If I’m correct the Extreme is 19” wide - the same as my present shelves. This means a less than optimal location for the Taiko as will have to go on the top shelf - Taiko’s instructions state it should go on the bottom shelf.

There‘s no room to purchase another shelf to place the Taiko on a dedicated rack by itself.

Does anyone have any other suggestions?

I wouldn’t worry that much about it as long as it’s a solid rack.

 

[Steve Williams]

In Purchasing the Taiko I’ll have to rethink my rack arrangement.

If I’m correct the Extreme is 19” wide - the same as my present shelves. This means a less than optimal location for the Taiko as will have to go on the top shelf - Taiko’s instructions state it should go on the bottom shelf.

There‘s no room to purchase another shelf to place the Taiko on a dedicated rack by itself.

Does anyone have any other suggestions?

My Extreme occupiers a top shelf. It is a very secure frame so I’m not worried because something this beautiful shouldn’t be hidden on the bottom shelf IMO

 

[MarkusBarkus]

Does anyone have any other suggestions?

Is the floor an option? Taiko on Daiza with EVP footers. Movable dog bass trap (recommended).

 

[Audire]

Is the floor an option? Taiko on Daiza with EVP footers. Movable dog bass trap (recommended). View attachment 112747

Unfortunately not at this time. There is no space on the left or right and I have to be able to access the TT thru the middle. Also I normally access the Transport thru the middle (normally on top right shelf, but the MC-10 Clock is there now - just finished our demo of it).

Our architect is about done with designing our new home which will have a dedicated room in it. If we proceed then I’ll have some space …

PS: You have a beautiful room.

 

[MarkusBarkus]

PS: You have a beautiful room.

...back at you, sir. Excellent set up, even without the dog! Good luck with the new plan. And that rack looks very sturdy, re: Taiko load, IMO.

 

[oldmustang]

AES and SPDIF are always intermediates.

I2S -> AES -> I2S
I2S -> SPDIF -> I2S

So that wouldn't make sense.

Easier adoption is why we switched to the modular format so we can supply AES/EBU, SPDIF, I2S outputs and proprietary formats like PRO ISL.

Dual AES/EBU compatible with dCS dual AES/EBU, to support up to 24/384 and DSD128?

Steve Z

 

[Taiko Audio]

Dual AES/EBU compatible with dCS dual AES/EBU, to support up to 24/384 and DSD128?

Steve Z

Yes that is “split wire”, although AES/EBU does not support native DSD128 it is implemented as DSD over PCM (24/176KHz over each wire), though I’m sure you already knew that part Just adding for completeness.

 

[oldmustang]

In the Extreme, with all it's processing power, and our custom USB driver this has become a limitation, we're capable of sending data at much smaller intervals, like somewhere between 500-1000 times smaller. Why does this matter? Each data packet creates noise when it is processed, so we have noise spikes at 125 microsecond intervals (at 8KHz), you can actually clearly hear this if you run an unshielded USB cable close to (unshielded) tubes. If you make that interval much smaller, create a continuous data stream at a very high frequency, way out of the audio range, it basically transforms into a continuous low level noise at very high frequencies which can easily be filtered out. And we eliminate 2 relatively noisy USB controllers. The biggest audible advantages are a much better flow in the music reproduction, much blacker backgrounds with all it's accompanying advantages, a much smoother and less "choppy" sound, especially noticeable in the upper midrange and high frequencies.

Interesting and congruent with what I understand as a design philosophy for the Extreme of providing a powerful platform and then minimizing, distributing and spreading out over time current-consuming and noise-producing processes.

I see that Luxman (who coincidentally uses the same Rohm DAC chip as the upcoming TACDA DAC daughter card) has also identified data transmission as an important process to optimize. They call it Bulk Pet™ and it utilizes USB evidently with a custom driver. The information I have been able to find has been rather sketchy. Luxman's advertising copy says:

"In addition to conventional, “isochronous” file transfers at fixed bitrates, the USB input supports two modes of Bulk Pure Enhanced Technology (Bulk Pet) high-resolution audio file transfer. This optimizes data packaging and delivery to the converter, easing the processing load for both the host CPU and the device CPU. This in turn reduces the workload between reading and reproduction, enhancing playback stability and improving sound quality."

The use of "bulk" though makes me think of larger amounts of data happening all at once. Maybe the philosophy of transfer big chunks of data interspersed with longer periods of little or no activity in-between events?

Steve Z

 

[cat6man]

In the Extreme, with all it's processing power, and our custom USB driver this has become a limitation, we're capable of sending data at much smaller intervals, like somewhere between 500-1000 times smaller. Why does this matter? Each data packet creates noise when it is processed, so we have noise spikes at 125 microsecond intervals (at 8KHz), you can actually clearly hear this if you run an unshielded USB cable close to (unshielded) tubes. If you make that interval much smaller, create a continuous data stream at a very high frequency, way out of the audio range, it basically transforms into a continuous low level noise at very high frequencies which can easily be filtered out. And we eliminate 2 relatively noisy USB controllers. The biggest audible advantages are a much better flow in the music reproduction, much blacker backgrounds with all it's accompanying advantages, a much smoother and less "choppy" sound, especially noticeable in the upper midrange and high frequencies.

@Taiko Audio
will you be able to send data at the smaller intervals over aes/ebu to the totaldac?
i seem to remember that vincent said that his implementation of aes/ebu was 'not limited'.

 

[grandsoir]

When it comes down to music collection and storage, I have around 30-40TB worth of music. I find local files to sound better than streaming.

From what I understand, 16TB is the standard maximum of storage when ordering, but 96TB is the maximum what can be possible installing. I heard it´s a "service job" to expand, but as an IT-guy I´m pretty sure I manage

So two cards will be used if 16tb is ordered? and for the 3rd disk I can insert 32tb for example? So if 16tb from start, I can then get 48TB maximum.

I can always use external discs if I want, but would it be any difference in some other way if I go for the larger disks?

 

[grandsoir]

another question;maybe a stupid one, but it´s very late here in Sween

Do the extreme switch + extreme network card alter the sound on local files (Flac,dsd, SACD an wav)

 

[jelt2359]

Our current recommendation is to stick to a maximum of 8 internal drives, you can fit more drives but this does come with an impact on sonics. Each can be sized up to 8TB for a maximum of 64TB internal storage, but yes this not cheap, 2TB drives are far more economical then 4 or 8TB drives. You can also add more U.2 internal drives which are available up to 16TB each, but this is very impractical and we do not recommend it.

External USB drives can of course be used, if powered externally the power supply would definitely impact things, significantly.

We have the upcoming Router which is equipped with 2 M.2 slots which could hold 2 8TB drives for 16TB, it can also be used to connect multiple USB drives.

With XDMS we're working towards eliminating storage location sensitivity, and I am very confident we will accomplish that. Looking into the future I'm envisioning a more modular system with both Router and Storage being location insensitive appliances with some firmware/hardware solutions to eliminate Roon's sensitivity while XDMS can solve a significant part in software and will ultimately be cheaper to run at the same performance level, but perform better at a similar expense.

In the end it will matter what we have all spend, a lot will change in the next 1-2 years, and we are progressing on a path where we are trying to "waste" an absolute minimum of our customers investments. Hence I should disclose that purchasing 8TB M.2 drives is risking a significant write off and therefor I do not really recommend taking that route.

This post is probably relevant for you

 

[cat6man]

another question;maybe a stupid one, but it´s very late here in Sween

Do the extreme switch + extreme network card alter the sound on local files (Flac,dsd, SACD an wav)

Yes. Hugely! Run don't walk down that road

 

[Kris]

With all due respect, you are a bit unique in your preferences

This is a must not a preference. And this is unfortunate for me as I cant just plug in new thing and have fun. I always have to run number of tests and swich cables , supplys , isolators to get it right.

I think this is due to the very noisy power ( especially neutral) that comes to my home.
Will order the professional help to find what is in that power lines.

My systems were always to bight sounding, whatever I had for testing for last 25 years
so there must be something there. It got much worst in last 7 years.
Harmonics ? To high neutral impedance ? To much of solar pannels in the area?
To close to the end of the power line ( just one home afrter mine) ?
To many single phase homes that overload the neutral line ( 3 phase area)?
Street lights that use a separate phase but unfortunate common neutral line ?

Or all together ?