Am I the only one who thinks Red Book is better than HiRez?

[Blizzard]

Yup... do this all the time. In fact... most every tape that comes in here I run through an analog console and "tweak" the sound to my liking (especially all the prog-rock albums). Anyone that has heard Greg's tapes at any of the shows has heard them.

But is it still considered "direct from master"? Seems misleading if it's still called that. Although I realize you are probably livening them up.

 

[Blizzard]

I think they drop the word direct but then imply with marketing and the diagram.

It's all a shame and is misleading. Just goes to show that format fidelity potential can be superseded by the transfer and mastering technique...

A fact that's at the hart of this topic and undermines many of our preconceptions regarding the importance of bit rates and alike.

Is there a problem with simply telling the truth? If it sounds better it sounds better. Who cares what they did. To me "direct from master tape to DSD" would mean that the R2R machine plays the master tape, and the Analog outs of it connect directly to the DSD capable ADC. A copy is made, and end of story.

Doing what Bruce described should be considered "Remastered in the analog domain from the original masters".

 

[rbbert]

Most of the early '70's Stevie Wonder albums have at least 2 Japanese SACD versions in addition to the hi-res PCM versions, as well as any number of CD versions (including Audio Fidelity HDCD). Is everyone sure we are all referring to the same things?

 

[cjf]

If you want to be in for a stunning treat, make a DSD rip of this album and upsample to DSD 256. The sound is astonishing good. Definitely doesn't fit into the classic rock "crap" sounding category. I agree with Bob about the 80's (other than Dire Straits of course) but some of the stuff from the 70's is killer. Especially the new high res releases.


http://www.mofi.com/product_p/udsacd2041.htm

Welp looks like I'm SOL on this one. I have no means to RIP SACD and my DAC upsamples to DSD128. Maybe I'll look for an old Redbook version instead

I'm a big time 70-80's fan, especially Disco and Hair Metal

 

[Blizzard]

Welp looks like I'm SOL on this one. I have no means to RIP SACD and my DAC upsamples to DSD128. Maybe I'll look for an old Redbook version instead

I'm a big time 70-80's fan, especially Disco and Hair Metal

It sounds stunning in DSD 64 as well. Grab an old PS3 off of Ebay and turn it into a SACD ripper. Tons of how to guides out there.

 

[Bruce B]

But is it still considered "direct from master"? Seems misleading if it's still called that. Although I realize you are probably livening them up.

Yes.... it's not going through a format change or anything.

 

[Blizzard]

Yes.... it's not going through a format change or anything.

I suppose "remastering" redbook doesn't required going through a format change either.

I find Mofi is pretty good most of the time with their descriptions. Like in the case of this Doobie Bro's. It says "Remastered from the original analog master tapes" Rather than "direct from master tapes" A lot of these misconceptions are the reason some guys like R2R or Vinyl better than Digital. Because they don't understand where the source originated from. And some of the "Remastering" might not be to their tastes.


http://www.mofi.com/product_p/udsacd2041.htm

 

[JackD201]

I think if the material was recorded or edited digitally past 2000-2001 chances are the masters are 24/48, 24/88.2 or 24/96. That pretty much coincides with the mass adoption of PT HD. Does that timeframe sound about right Bruce?

 

[zztop7]

Amg

??? The New logo on the left ??? Does AMG represent Audio Mastering by Genius

Yes.... it's not going through a format change or anything.

 

[amirm]

Seems like someone got a new car.

 

[Blizzard]

Blizzard three of us agree on something lol stevi sounds bad on shm SACD. This is a rare moment lets saviour it

No doubt. Hard enough getting 1 guy to agree with me

 

[Bruce B]

??? The New logo on the left ??? Does AMG represent Audio Mastering by Genius

+1

 

[Bruce B]

I think if the material was recorded or edited digitally past 2000-2001 chances are the masters are 24/48, 24/88.2 or 24/96. That pretty much coincides with the mass adoption of PT HD. Does that timeframe sound about right Bruce?

That's correct

 

[BlueFox]

Thanks but I was asking for the opposite scenario . A CD that sounds better than its high-res version.

Oops. Need to work on my reading comprehension skills.

The only way a CD can sound better than the 'high-res' version is if the the high-res version is just a mangled attempt to jump on a bandwagon.

 

[Groucho]

The development of Digital for audio applications is a exciting field to be in, full of innovation. No one would disagree with you on that. The potential for it, if the whole music industry gets behind a single medium (you argue for dsd I believe?) far exceeds that of vinyl for lots of reasons including sound quality.

I somehow doubt that it is all that exciting! If someone said to me "Right, I'm assigning you to a project to develop an exciting new product that ultimately will measure exactly the same as all the others and sound exactly the same as all the others- but we think it has potential to be marketed [winking]...imaginatively", I would start looking around for a new job.

 

[XV-1]

The best example for me is the 44/24 version of The Pale Emperor by Marilyn Manson versus the Redbook 44/16 version. When I bought the CD it was around $10 on Amazon, and $18 on HD Tracks. My first thought was 8 bits more on the download can't be worth $8 more, so I bought the CD. Turns out I loved the CD, and after a couple of months decided to try the download. Well, there is no contest. The download is quieter, and louder. In other words, it's dynamic range is much better. I have now deleted all the ripped CD tracks, and only listen to the download.

Generally, I avoid re-buying music and DVDs, but do so for my very favorites. I have downloaded Rolling Stones and Led Zeppelin albums that embarrass the CDs.

Also, I use my ears for this evaluation. I am not so insecure that I need measurements to validate what I hear.

The vinyl of Pale Emperor sounds awesome. Vs the hirez would be interesting but I know what my $$ would be on.

 

[cjf]

Oops. Need to work on my reading comprehension skills.

The only way a CD can sound better than the 'high-res' version is if the the high-res version is just a mangled attempt to jump on a bandwagon.

Exactly, and that's part of the rub. The majority of the HiRes stuff I own or have heard sounds like a poor attempt to keep up with the Joneses because the responsible party offering/recreating the HiRes version are only doing so because they caught a whiff that their are people who exist (audiophiles) that want that sort of thing and money is being left on the table.

The part they seem to fail to grasp is the audiophile only wants a HiRes version IF it's truly better than want came before it.

I've already mentioned my musical preferences earlier in the thread and as you can see its as far from Classical,Opera or anything close to those flavors of music as you can get. Well, unless Whitesnakes use of a violin stick against an electric guitar counts in the song "Still of the Night" . Either way, I won't argue that there is certanly a far greater number of Classical HiRes that is legit than there is of the other Generes and no doubt probably sound better than there Redbook counterparts.

So, it looks like I'll need to once again try to learn how to stomach classical music should I wish to hear the benefits HiRes music has over Redbook. I've lost count how many times I've already tried to like it but haven't been able to grasp the lure it has.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

So, it looks like I'll need to once again try to learn how to stomach classical music should I wish to hear the benefits HiRes music has over Redbook. I've lost count how many times I've already tried to like it but haven't been able to grasp the lure it has.

Why bother? I've tried many highly recommended non-classical recordings to see if I can appreciate them for music and/or sound quality but it rarely works. If the music doesn't speak to you, it doesn't matter how well it is recorded.