Can You Believe This-The Government Wants Us To Go EV but In So Doing They Will impose a gas surcharge

[DaveC]

That would be a perfect example of a car I would not care for. The SL is small on the outside, but big on the inside, with legroom greater than an S Class coupe.

SLs used to be small, new ones are actually pretty large cars and they weigh a ton, more than a Camaro! Compared to a Miata and many other 2-seaters it's a big car.

I can overlook the design choices made with the Camaro, it's incredible as a performance car. At my 2nd ever autocross race I had an instructor that showed us the course, line choice, etc, then rode with me and give me some pointers. At the end of the day I beat him by .6 sec on a 50 sec track, he was driving a BMW Z4 coupe, which is not a slow car. I'm not a great driver, the Camaro is just really fast, one of the best handling cars in the world actually.

My friend's Honda Fit is the best clown car ever, it's incredible how much room is in there. I'm kinda scared to drive such a small car though. Not what I want to get into an accident in.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

My friend's Honda Fit is the best clown car ever, it's incredible how much room is in there. I'm kinda scared to drive such a small car though. Not what I want to get into an accident in.

actually; the Fit is exactly the small car you want to get into an accident with. research Honda's ACE body structure.

https://www.honda.com/safety/safety-by-design

in most real world accidents you are more likely to walk away in a Fit compared to a much larger older car......or other current competitive small car. we have customers frequently show us pictures of their totaled Fit, Civic, CRV, etc. when they are buying their replacement car saying how they would not consider any other car. the ACE structure allows the structure to absorb the impact and keep the passenger safe. many times doors still open and close and windshields are intact (cocooning the passenger space), but the front crumple zones are compressed like a folded accordion. and ACE also raises the passenger compartment above the impact (the engine curls under absorbing energy instead of being pushed back) in off-set collisions which are the most dangerous 'head-on' type where it's a life or death margin and transfer of energy is most critical.

sure, mass can protect you; but improperly designed mass will transfer the energy of the impact to the occupant. if given a choice as to what would more likely save you, i'll take smart design over mass + the smaller car is more agile.

and it's much cheaper to replace cars than heal people.

 

[Ron Resnick]

SLs used to be small, new ones are actually pretty large cars . . . Compared to a Miata and many other 2-seaters it's a big car.

. . .

Yes, this is my point. It’s the biggest 2 seater with great trunk space that I am aware of.

 

[Empirical Audio]

actually; the Fit is exactly the small car you want to get into an accident with. research Honda's ACE body structure.

https://www.honda.com/safety/safety-by-design

in most real world accidents you are more likely to walk away in a Fit compared to a much larger older car......or other current competitive small car. we have customers frequently show us pictures of their totaled Fit, Civic, CRV, etc. when they are buying their replacement car saying how they would not consider any other car. the ACE structure allows the structure to absorb the impact and keep the passenger safe. many times doors still open and close and windshields are intact (cocooning the passenger space), but the front crumple zones are compressed like a folded accordion. and ACE also raises the passenger compartment above the impact (the engine curls under absorbing energy instead of being pushed back) in off-set collisions which are the most dangerous 'head-on' type where it's a life or death margin and transfer of energy is most critical.

sure, mass can protect you; but improperly designed mass will transfer the energy of the impact to the occupant. if given a choice as to what would more likely save you, i'll take smart design over mass + the smaller car is more agile.

and it's much cheaper to replace cars than heal people.

I believe the Tesla Model 3 has the best collision results of any car ever tested and it has two trunks.

 

[KeithR]

Perhaps George Carlin said it best:

 

[NorthStar]

Steve, of all the avatars here @ WBF yours is the best.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I believe the Tesla Model 3 has the best collision results of any car ever tested and it has two trunks.

more 'Tesla' speak.

being among the cars that get the highest rating, is a different thing than getting the 'singular' best of any.

highest rating does not = unique.

5 star....is 5 star.

Tesla Model 3 safety;

https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2018/TESLA/MODEL%25203/4%2520DR/RWD

Honda Accord safety;

https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2019/HONDA/ACCORD/4%2520DR/FWD

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Steve, of all the avatars here @ WBF yours is the best.

yes, but his 4" signature is irritating trying to navigate. ever heard of links?

 

[NorthStar]

Here comes the sun ...
? https://www.businessinsider.com/nis...af-sl-plus-looking-sharp-in-deep-pearl-blue-1

1. It's not cheap ... $44,000 (my neighbor has one by the way ... same color).
2. The mileage you get from the battery ... not enough.
3. Aesthetics are not moving my mojo, I prefer Tesla's designs.

 

[Empirical Audio]

more 'Tesla' speak.

being among the cars that get the highest rating, is a different thing than getting the 'singular' best of any.

highest rating does not = unique.

5 star....is 5 star.

Tesla Model 3 safety;

https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2018/TESLA/MODEL%25203/4%2520DR/RWD

Honda Accord safety;

https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2019/HONDA/ACCORD/4%2520DR/FWD

What I read was the ratings people at Consumer Reports said that they needed a higher rating for the Tesla, but didn't have one.

 

[PeterA]

Al M. joined me for a drive in my WPV (wind-powered vehicle) yesterday. Greta would have been proud. She drives the Model S. I have to make due with the Model 3.

Bob, it was all about existing within the forces of nature: the strength of the wind, the mass of the water, the sound of waves. There were no discussions about drive types or debates about analog versus digital. Just a simple celebration of life on this beautiful blue planet.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

What I read was the ratings people at Consumer Reports said that they needed a higher rating for the Tesla, but didn't have one.

Consumer Reports does not do crash tests. the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS) does that.

OTOH Consumer Reports does include the ratings from IIHS in their reports. and IIHS does not test every car every year. mostly at model changes.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Al M. joined me for a drive in my WPV (wind-powered vehicle) yesterday. Greta would have been proud. She drives the Model S. I have to make due with the Model 3.

Bob, it was all about existing within the forces of nature: the strength of the wind, the mass of the water, the sound of waves. There were no discussions about drive types or debates about analog versus digital. Just a simple celebration of life on this beautiful blue planet.

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Peter, it's redundant talking about belt v idler when you're trying not to fall overboard.

 

[DonH50]

Since this seems to be a Tesla thread (with some sailing diversion, nice!), did they get the QA bugs out of the Model 3? I know only a couple of people who bought them, both coworkers. One took the first back and accepted the second with some paint flaws the dealer promised to fix (but never did); the second finally accepted the third car, again with some fit and finish issues. There were some major issue with the first that I do not completely recall, and the second had a windshield leak and door that did not shut properly plus some paint problems. Both love driving the car but were surprised at the quality control issues.

 

[Empirical Audio]

Since this seems to be a Tesla thread (with some sailing diversion, nice!), did they get the QA bugs out of the Model 3? I know only a couple of people who bought them, both coworkers. One took the first back and accepted the second with some paint flaws the dealer promised to fix (but never did); the second finally accepted the third car, again with some fit and finish issues. There were some major issue with the first that I do not completely recall, and the second had a windshield leak and door that did not shut properly plus some paint problems. Both love driving the car but were surprised at the quality control issues.

I've talked with quite a few Model 3 owners and none of them complained about issues. This only happened initially, which is the case with all new models of any car IME.

 

[Steve williams]

There is no getting around it as yes the quality control is terrible.My son has a Model 3 that did have some issues needing fixing Having said that however the service on his vehicle was first class and handled quickly from the start. He was even given a Model S as a loaner car while his was being serviced quickly and to his satisfaction

 

[NorthStar]

View attachment 57330

That's a beautiful picture...nothing else matters...it says everything about living free and clean, taking care of business.

I'm reading the news from across the seas, about oil and wars, and it's a world of hurt.
We have zero, less than zero business with those tyrants and barbares.

I want to go sailing now, cry tears of life with the ocean ...

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I've talked with quite a few Model 3 owners and none of them complained about issues. This only happened initially, which is the case with all new models of any car IME.

and you would know that how?

Tesla is a rookie at high volume auto production and it shows. they are banking on the cultural benefit of the doubt from their fanboy customers. they are cashing in lots of good will. how much longer that holds up is the question.

 

[NorthStar]

Mike, you're no Honda fanboy aren't you?

 

[Steve williams]

Mike

Does Honda not have fan boy customers?



If it won't be Tesla, it'll be one of the other companies Mike and you know that. I still haven't figured out if you just plain despise Tesla and/or you are anti EV. I've seen you post both

Your dislike for Tesla is obvious but this is a new industry that is beginning to bloom and Im betting Honda won't be caught tn their dust. Further when Honda started as a car maker after making lawnmowers and other motorized devices I suspect that they were a small company much the same as Tesla is now in the EV industry. I think what you seem to dislike most is that Tesla has cut out dealerships with steel and stone structures that sell and service cars. The fact that Tesla has come up with a different game plan seems to always tighten your sphincter. To the end user it would seem that cutting out the middleman serves to reduce the final price of the car.

Yesterday I went shopping with my wife at a nearby shopping center for food and to pick up a pharmacy prescription. The distance between both stores was perhaps 1/10 mile. Driving down the road between all the parked cars I counted no less than 6 Teslas and 2 Volts. This is far from fan boy enthusiasm Mike. To me in the audio industry more and more mfrs are now dealing direct to customer. The days of high end audio stores is rapidly becoming a thing of the past and EV is here to stay.

Mike, you make blanket statements that always puzzle me