Denafrips product owners please fall in

Blake

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Jun 28, 2018
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Hi, great thread so far!

As I’ve dived down the deep end again into my music system, I currently have an Ares II but also an MSB S202 (way different price ranges but I got an offer to trade in my S201 that I couldn’t pass up!).

Does anyone have experience comparing the Terminator + to MSB Dacs? Does the TP compare with the Direct Dac (I believe the same price range) or even the Premiere? Or is it more of a fair comparison of the TP and Gaia vs the range of MSB dacs?

Considering the Zenith MK III as the server streamer.

You might have already watched this, but in case you have not, the reviewer here mentions MSB DAC's in his review:


One of the big selling points of the Terminator Plus is the ability to engage the clock out feature, to the upstream DDC and the only professional review I have seen using a TPlus/Gaia combo is 6Moons. I wish that some of the reviews out there of the Terminator Plus would use this feature as it brings a very nice further improvement and it is using the TPlus to its full potential. I was shocked by the additional improvement and things were already very good with just the Terminator Plus by itself. I think if the professional reviewers would experiment with upstream clocking, the TPlus would be even more impressed.
 
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Nuprin

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Jan 9, 2020
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Watched that one before but he doesn't really say much about the differences, just his preference of the Terminator vs the Premier DAC. Also his system may not be revealing enough to give an accurate comparison between the two. Wondering if anyone has done a side by side comparison.
 

joyck88

New Member
Jan 28, 2021
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very impressed with T plus + Gaia with my Field coil speakers. Best DAC so far....very very happy with it.

Some sound impression of Dac.

 

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Blake

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MRJAZZ

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Jan 20, 2014
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Venus 2 arrived in Salt Lake City just 3 1/2 days after shipping from China. A new record in shipping time for my Denafrips purchases!

I hooked up all my digital cables (HDMI, Toslink and spdif) between the Venus 2 and Iris. After I burn in the Venus I will start switching around to different inputs to see which digital input I prefer
Venus 2 arrived in Salt Lake City just 3 1/2 days after shipping from China. A new record in shipping time for my Denafrips purchases!

I hooked up all my digital cables (HDMI, Toslink and spdif) between the Venus 2 and Iris. After I burn in the Venus I will start switching around to different inputs to see which digital input I prefer. View attachment 71937 View attachment 71938
Can you describe in what areas the IRIS improves the USB connection from the PC, and does the basic tonality change in any way ( if the sound was neutral to slightly lean prior, does the IRIS in anyway impact that?)....
Thanks
 

JimK

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Jun 8, 2015
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Delivered today by FedEx via Anchorage, Memphis, and back to Los Angeles.
The Pontus is superb right out of the box and I just want to share my congratulations and appreciation for a great product and superb sales and delivery process
 
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Blake

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Jun 28, 2018
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Can you describe in what areas the IRIS improves the USB connection from the PC, and does the basic tonality change in any way ( if the sound was neutral to slightly lean prior, does the IRIS in anyway impact that?)....
Thanks

The sound is a bit fuller and more fleshed-out, but the biggest enhancement is in clarity, resolution, holography/sound stage. It is not quite apples to apples though, since we are now comparing the performance of the USB input vs I2S via HDMI input to the DAC.
 
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matthias

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Mar 14, 2019
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very impressed with T plus + Gaia with my Field coil speakers. Best DAC so far....very very happy with it.
Some sound impression of Dac.

Nice videos. :)
Which software music player do use in your system?
Thanks

Matt
 

Lobster

Member
Feb 4, 2021
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Great info here, maybe you guys can help. I need to pull the trigger on a new DAC, but there’s no opportunity to audition them. My shortlist and considerations:

Terminator Plus DAC & Gaia DDC $8,700
+ Big box, DAC only: no budget/space wasted on volume control, remote, ethernet, etc.
+ DAC gets very clean signal from DDC over I²S
+ Buy direct from distributor, no dealer mark-up
- Less well-know Chinese manufacturer

Tambaqui DAC $9,500
+ Relatively cheap in my market
+ Very reputable manufacturer
+ Compact one box solution with ethernet/streaming
- DAC gets noisier signal via USB or ethernet, not via I²S
- Sold through dealer network, increased mark-up
- Small box with lots of features crammed inside: volume control, pre amp, ethernet, bluetooth

I suspect the Denafrips combo gives the best value for money. Still, the Tambaqui could simply sound better, despite my considerations.

I listen to Tidal through a Roon Nucleus. Two channel, no headphones.
Amp: Dan D’Agostino Momentum Integrated. Speakers: Focal Stella Utopia Evo.

So which one? Help! :)
 

Lobster

Member
Feb 4, 2021
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Hi Robert. You posted this question on a Denafrips product owners thread.
I understand that, but in the USA the Tambaqui is $11,500 vs. $6,700 for the Terminator Plus. Almost double the price. I can image people saying "Yes, the Tambaqui sounds better, but it's outside my budget, so I choose Terminator (Plus)". I'm looking for people having heard both.
 

alvin1118

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Nov 2, 2015
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www.vinshineaudio.com
The Terminator Plus featuring premier, precision Oven Controlled Crystal Oscillators.

The OCXOs are hand-crafted, calibrated, and hand-picked for absolute lowest jitter. The two independent OCXOs cater for native 44.1kHz and 48kHz based audio frequency family.

TPlus Unboxing (18)R.jpg

Take a closer look of the DENAFRIPS Terminator Plus R-2R DAC!
https://www.denafrips.com/single-post/terminator-plus-unboxing
 

RikkiPoo

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Nov 4, 2020
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The sound is a bit fuller and more fleshed-out, but the biggest enhancement is in clarity, resolution, holography/sound stage. It is not quite apples to apples though, since we are now comparing the performance of the USB input vs I2S via HDMI input to the DAC.
I have a TP and IRIS clocked and agree the USB is improved from an Innuos Statement as Blake describes. Clocking just brings clarity to another level, it seems to me noise is removed and the sound is further unmasked.
 
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richard_crl032

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Sep 10, 2019
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Can you describe in what areas the IRIS improves the USB connection from the PC, and does the basic tonality change in any way ( if the sound was neutral to slightly lean prior, does the IRIS in anyway impact that?)....
Thanks

Hi Jazz,

I find using Denafrips ddc depends on your usb source and you have to try to really know.

I had/have the allo usb bridge signature, nuprime omnia S1 and the Antipodes cx+ex stack and with both the Gaia and Hermes, sound quality improves with the allo and the Nuprime but with the Antipodes, sound quality is slightly veiled with loss in dynamics.

Now with Uptone etherRegen for notable sound quality improvement, the Antipodes remains directly connected to the TP even more so.

Cheers.

Richard
 

PavelDosko

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Feb 11, 2021
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is there any difference in conversion from usb to i2s between Gaia and Iris (the only input I will use is usb)?
 

RikkiPoo

Well-Known Member
Nov 4, 2020
118
82
95
Hi Jazz,

I find using Denafrips ddc depends on your usb source and you have to try to really know.

I had/have the allo usb bridge signature, nuprime omnia S1 and the Antipodes cx+ex stack and with both the Gaia and Hermes, sound quality improves with the allo and the Nuprime but with the Antipodes, sound quality is slightly veiled with loss in dynamics.

Now with Uptone etherRegen for notable sound quality improvement, the Antipodes remains directly connected to the TP even more so.

Cheers.

Richard
Richard,
How does the TP connect directly with the Etherregen, there is no ethernet input though I wish there was?

I have an Etherregen between an Antipodes Core and Innous Statement then the Statements USB goes to an Iris and then HMDI to the TP.

In my system even though the Statement has an excellent USB the TP sounds better with the I2S input over the direct USB, and way better with the clock in on the Iris.

The Denafrips manual suggests I2S is the superior input for the TP.
 
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richard_crl032

Well-Known Member
Sep 10, 2019
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Richard,
How does the TP connect directly with the Etherregen, there is no ethernet input though I wish there was?

I have an Etherregen between an Antipodes Core and Innous Statement then the Statements USB goes to an Iris and then HMDI to the TP.

In my system even though the Statement has an excellent USB the TP sounds better with the I2S input over the direct USB, and way better with the clock in on the Iris.

The Denafrips manual suggests I2S is the superior input for the TP.

Hi Rikki,

Sorry for being not clear ....

The EtherRegen is before the cx as server only which is direct via ethernet to the ex as player only and then via usb to TP .. ethernet input of the Antipodes is not in same level of specialised EtherRegen and hence I find obvious improvement when it was added BEFORE the cx server.

Not familiar with the Innous Statement but guess similarly used as a player only and unless you have 2x EtherRegen and it is far from your Antipodes Core as server only, your single EtherRegen should be better before the Antipodes Core and not after which will then be too late to avoid detrimental ethernet effects which EtherRegen is for ?

I have the Avatar cdp and the Gaia/Hermes daisy chain clocked and switching to hdmi i2s via Gaia/Hermes into TP certainly sounded worse than switching to RJ45 i2s directly from Avatar .. less is best I believe but most importantly is what sounds the best to you. If your usb source is already excellent, I do not think it benefits from synced oxco clock of TP and i2s connection since it still have to change digital format and I will leave this directly into TP for also i2s to the R2R ladders within cm(s) on the pcba and not 0.5m i2s cable for the same "less is more".

End of the day, too many variables in all our systems to really know what will sound the best imho and our shared experience can only be for reference. For example, all say hard wiring ethernet cable can only be better than my dedicated wifi mesh to the Antipode cx which I am using now but my 25m supra cat 8 is up for sale as it sounded worse for my system to my ears ....

Cheers.

Richard

PS: i2s being better than usb in Denafrips manual may indeed be the case but since we are using usb source, it really does not apply for us ... you still need to convert in the ddc and would have been best if TP has ethernet digital input for my Antipodes electronicdesign_com_sites_electronicdesign.com_files_uploads_2015_12_0716_CTE_cypressEE_F1.png
 
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RikkiPoo

Well-Known Member
Nov 4, 2020
118
82
95
Hi Rikki,

Sorry for being not clear ....

The EtherRegen is before the cx as server only which is direct via ethernet to the ex as player only and then via usb to TP .. ethernet input of the Antipodes is not in same level of specialised EtherRegen and hence I find obvious improvement when it was added BEFORE the cx server.

Not familiar with the Innous Statement but guess similarly used as a player only and unless you have 2x EtherRegen and it is far from your Antipodes Core as server only, your single EtherRegen should be better before the Antipodes Core and not after which will then be too late to avoid detrimental ethernet effects which EtherRegen is for ?

I have the Avatar cdp and the Gaia/Hermes daisy chain clocked and switching to hdmi i2s via Gaia/Hermes into TP certainly sounded worse than switching to RJ45 i2s directly from Avatar .. less is best I believe but most importantly is what sounds the best to you. If your usb source is already excellent, I do not think it benefits from synced oxco clock of TP and i2s connection since it still have to change digital format and I will leave this directly into TP for also i2s to the R2R ladders within cm(s) on the pcba and not 0.5m i2s cable for the same "less is more".

End of the day, too many variables in all our systems to really know what will sound the best imho and our shared experience can only be for reference. For example, all say hard wiring ethernet cable can only be better than my dedicated wifi mesh to the Antipode cx which I am using now but my 25m supra cat 8 is up for sale as it sounded worse for my system to my ears ....

Cheers.

Richard

PS: i2s being better than usb in Denafrips manual may indeed be the case but since we are using usb source, it really does not apply for us ... you still need to convert in the ddc and would have been best if TP has ethernet digital input for my Antipodes View attachment 74943
I also wish I could output ethernet to the TP also.

I upgraded my HDMI to

AudioQuest Thunderbird 48 0.75m 8K-10K 48Gbps HDMI Cable (2.5ft)​

and it made a HUGE improvement over

AudioQuest Coffee HDMI 1.5 m HDMI Black Cable HDMI – HDMI Cable (1.5 m, HDMI Type A (Standard), HDMI Type A (Standard), 3d, 10.2 Gbit/s, Black)​

I also tried the Sommer HDMI recommended by Alvin, the Sommer was better than the Coffee but not in the league of the Thunderbird. I also upgraded my USB from a Curious Cable to

Network Acoustics ENO USB Cable Ag​

and it was definitely better also, much smoother and detailed, airy.

I agree it sounds good to try less is more but my experience is the more I add the better it gets with the expection that I am on the fence about my experience with adding a master clock to the Etherregen and SFP fiber between it and a SOtM switch.
 
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