Entreq Tellus grounding

[rockitman]

I am amazed how many pages of posts have been wasted on this thread arguing about blind tests for Entreq gear. Talk about OT Mr. Purite...how about we get back to the thread...actual user experiences of Entreq grounding gear ? If you don't believe in the stuff, why not grind your axe in another thread ?

 

[spiritofmusic]

+1 Christian. You'd think I'd get credit from Keith for volunteering to potentially drop my pants in public (apologies to the more sensitive people here!) by offering the trial for Keith to administer in the way he describes. No, no credit, my offer of a trial is ignored and in the very same post he says the trial must be carried out! But prob by someone other than him. So ignoring the offer but saying what I'm offering is essential, and continuing to diss us good grounding folk when a trial isn't forthcoming despite me being available to do the trial. Maybe Keith can't make the 5 miles across London to me w/the possibility in his mind that things might not turn out the way he thinks. A terrible expectation bias.
Am I missing something? Or are my intentions plain as the midday sun?

 

[TBG]

Why are there no posts from Shun Mook/Entreq/Troy users saying these products have improved my system and here are the measured results to qualify that improvement.
Keith.

Why would anyone bother with measured results? No body thinks that there are valid measurements for what the ears cans sense. Without our ears, we would be long gone as a species. Don't pretend that there is a measure of perfect audio reproduction. If a customer hears, sees, tastes, feels, or smells what they like that is all that matters.

 

[spiritofmusic]

I just don't get this. I really don't. Somebody put me out of my misery. All is measurements. Blind trials are essential. Offers of blind trials are ignored. Deliberately. I'm out of here. Will restrict myself to all thoughts Entreq. Are the inmates taking over the asylum?

 

[bonzo75]

Keith you need to get past the first chapter of Audio for dummies. Turn the page, there is more to read on observations

 

[TBG]

I just don't get this. I really don't. Somebody put me out of my misery. All is measurements. Blind trials are essential. Offers of blind trials are ignored. Deliberately. I'm out of here. Will restrict myself to all thoughts Entreq. Are the inmates taking over the asylum?

Spirit, I haven't a clue what you are trying to say here.

 

[spiritofmusic]

TBG, Keith only believes improvements are as such if measured. If they can't be measured, they aren't impvts. Entreq can't be measured, de facto anything we hear thru it is imaginary/isn't an impvt. You hit the nail on the head y'self re post 553. He harps on and on and on about blind trials. I offer him the chance to do one at my place. He doesn't take up the offer, but at the same time says they must be done. He has a chance to prove me wrong and my assertion that Entreq is radical and publicise this here, and actively resists. I just can't follow this logic, it really seems I'm going somewhat mad if there is any consistency, and more vitally, integrity, in his tbh borderline badgering of the Entreq proponents on this thread.

 

[LL21]

Why are there no posts from Shun Mook/Entreq/Troy users saying these products have improved my system and here are the measured results to qualify that improvement.
Keith.

Having spoken with major manufacturers whose name is on the box, even THEY will say you cannot measure everything. Lew Johnson was even quoted as saying i know that capacitors are supposed to such and such and measure likewise...but they dont and i know know why.

So i am definitely not going to pretend i could figure that out.

Plus, like guys who tune pianos (often the work is done with a few basic tools and then a lot by ear and feel)...I use my experiences from studying piano for years, or being involved with some live productions years ago and finally...i admit it...i like what i like.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Keith, you're on the thread I have originated, and even if it's not your intention, you have in effect crashed it w/your oft repeated assertions re objective measurements and need for blind trials. De facto you are saying a blind trial must be carried out on Entreq.
I would like you to answer this question directly, succinctly and w/out straying. I have invited you on this thread, and privately, to do said trial at my place in any way you see fit, viz. me blinded as you control the Entreq rig. You haven't just declined, you've point blank ignored my offer. And beyond the realms of belief, you have mentioned my offer in detail on a follow up post, saying that a blind trial absolutely needs to be done. But you won't do it at my place.
WHY NOT?

 

[microstrip]

Why are there no posts from Shun Mook/Entreq/Troy users saying these products have improved my system and here are the measured results to qualify that improvement.
Keith.

Can you tell us exactly what measurements do you think are necessary to confirm the improvements in high-end systems due to what we audiophiles usually call "small differences"?

 

[TBG]

I would strongly suggest that it is easiest to just ignore his posts. I don't think there are measurements for valid concepts as science has not found measures for them Total Harmonic Distortion is a perfect example. Many have all but abandoned this measure. I certainly have heard amps with higher THD that sound much better than those with lower THD.

 

[spiritofmusic]

I concur TBG, but as the originator of this thread, and as someone who feels it's been crashed by Keith, I would like the courtesy of a direct answer to my question.
But I will continue to chip in w/my positive experiences.

 

[Frank750]

I for one was enjoying and learning from both this and the Tripoint threads until the measurement fanatics invaded this thread and destroyed it. I'm really getting tired of this kind of thing happening on WBF. Doesn't matter if it's cables, amps or whatever, they come, takeover, and the useful exchange of information typically comes to an end.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Frank, don't go. Stay, stay!!!
I have to tell you, I deliberately disconnected my whole Entreq rig in preparation for putting my proposal to Keith. I haven't done this before, having incrementally built up to a Silver Tellus and now 6 Apollo cables (another 2-3 possible, plus Cleanus in due course).
Well, the effects were instructive. An immediate shrinking of the soundstage, esp. diminution of the stereo image, nothing wider than the spkrs, a clouding of dynamics, and most disconcertingly a greying of the sound, as if colour had been drained away, w/a sort of soup of low level hash audible. Truly dramatic and immediate.
Reconnecting the rig reintroduced an immediate spike in dynamics, and better stereo spread, but it took a good 24hrs for music to become technicolor again.
Truly fascinating, and IMHO, Entreq (and Troy) grounding is a fantastic option to supercharge system performance w/no compromise on voicing.

 

[dmnc02]

I have certainly lost any interest in trying to reason with Mr. Purite.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Frank, I would love to know if Entreq or Troy can work alongside Shunyata conditioning. I have no idea. You run Shunyata, and might be the ideal candidate to try.
It seems that there is the balanced power approach, like Equi=Tech, your Torus and my Westwick 8kVA; grounding i.e. Entreq and Tripoint; mains regeneration like PS Audio and Isotek; standard conditioners/filters like my Burmester 948 and Audience Adept.
I believe balanced power works w/grounding, or Shunyata, or conditioners.
But can Shunyata work w/grounding and/or regeneration?
Anyone out there know?

 

[Frank750]

Frank, I would love to know if Entreq or Troy can work alongside Shunyata conditioning. I have no idea. You run Shunyata, and might be the ideal candidate to try.
It seems that there is the balanced power approach, like Equi=Tech, your Torus and my Westwick 8kVA; grounding i.e. Entreq and Tripoint; mains regeneration like PS Audio and Isotek; standard conditioners/filters like my Burmester 948 and Audience Adept.
I believe balanced power works w/grounding, or Shunyata, or conditioners.
But can Shunyata work w/grounding and/or regeneration?
Anyone out there know?

Love to be able to tell you but my dealer doesn't seem able to get his hands on any Entreq at this point. He's probably the largest high end dealer in Chicago now too. Seems a shame.

 

[spiritofmusic]

i've surmised from info on the web, that Shunyata and Entreq may share some similarities in approach. Of the neutral, positive and earth in the mains, Entreq filters two of these, and leaves the other alone. This concept runs thru all their products incl pc's, and I suspect esp in the Cleanus. Shunyata may be following a similar path, so the two brands together may be superfluous. Worth trying, 'though.

 

[dmnc02]

i've surmised from info on the web, that Shunyata and Entreq may share some similarities in approach. Of the neutral, positive and earth in the mains, Entreq filters two of these, and leaves the other alone. This concept runs thru all their products incl pc's, and I suspect esp in the Cleanus. Shunyata may be following a similar path, so the two brands together may be superfluous. Worth trying, 'though.

What is the source of this information? I assume you are referring just to their power products? The ground boxes are designed to act on the signal ground plane only. That seems like a completely different approach from Shunyata.

 

[spiritofmusic]

There are one or two comments on other forum boards on Entreq re two of positive, neutral and earth being manipulated, the other left alone. Maybe this is just applicable to their cabling, Cleanus filter- and Powerus distribution-units, and not the Tellus and Atlantis ground boxes. I should refrain from commenting on Shunyata, I really have no useful knowledge of them. Apologies. The q remains, would Shunyata and Entreq complement each other, or step on each other's toes?