Entreq Tellus grounding

[spiritofmusic]

I've taken a little time responding to Barry's comments on the Entreq S. Minimus/Apollo grounding of pwr amp -ve spkr terminals, that I'm trialling myself right now. Partly because I wanted to take a break from extolling the virtues of Entreq grounding (which was a full time hobby at one time ), and also because my initial experiences were mixed to say the least, alongside other major changes I've made in the last 3-6 mnths. But now I'm ready to post the findings I believe to be accurate.
I have pretty much swapped out all my amps, changed a whole cable loom, and installed radical spkr upgrades, to whit Lundahl transformer Hypex Zu sub bass amps modules and Duelund caps to tweeters networks. So pretty radical changes, topped of w/a full suite of GIK acoustics panels just optimised.
I've actually gone thru a pretty stressful re-education process w/these changes, necessitating changing the Zu sub amps settings, moving the spkrs in the room, and experimenting w/placement of the GIKs.
When I first tried the Entreq amp -ve spkr terminals grounding, I found it all pretty underwhelming, adding too much unwanted warmth and slowness. 48 hrs in, I unplugged these Entreq amp changes.
Two weeks later, the last 48 hrs, after optimising all the strategic changes to the rest of my system, I reintroduced this new Entreq amp grounding...and proceeded to do a total 180 (tough at my age, and lack of hip mobility, I can tell you ).
Now, the cloying warmth that was so unwelcome has been transformed into really positive bass depth and extension, and since my Zu sub bass amps are driven directly by the system/pwr amps, I'm sure this is where the change is most being wrought.
This would make sense, since the recent changes have been most perceivable in the sub 30Hz region, esp via the new Lundahls. This Entreq amp grounding is maxxing this even further. My newly-Entreq'd Nat monoblocks are now driving the Lundahls more cleanly and w/even lower noise floor than ever, really allowing the Lundahls, and hence the Zu sub bass, to perform stupendously.

 

[Jazzhead]

Spirit good to hear on your positive results . I believe their new ground box The Poseidon , has been specifically designed with this endeavor in mind . 3 isolated Olympus Minimus ......

 

[spiritofmusic]

Yep, Jazzhead, I am looking at this unit. This would enable monoblock amp -ve spkr terminal uber grounding to in effect an Olympus Minimus each, plus my Eera Tentation cdp digital grounding to it's own Olympus Minimus, leaving my remaining 7 components and Silver Cleanus to share grounding btwn my current Silver Tellus and a future Olympus Tellus, enabling me to ground direct back to my balanced mains transformer. Advice is to keep digiatal and analog grounding separate from each other and this would be achieved.
Well into Troy SE pricing territory, but I can only afford this since Entreq allows this true modularity/upgrade path.
Remain really impressed w/how the Lundahls are being optimised by this specific application of grounding.
But as w/all things Entreq, YMMV big time, and had I not been able to adjust my Zu's bass output, I would have turned this Entreq variant down.

 

[Barry2013]

With all the other changes to your system I can understand it took a while to realise the benefits of the amp grounding Marc.
Good to hear it is now delivering the benefits I would expect.
Enjoy!

 

[Ron Resnick]

Good work, Marc!

 

[ddk]

Hi David,

I pulled up my old notes about this and here is the synopsis of putting and removing the Tripoint and Entreq grounding 3 times in my system. Each time i put the grounding system back in:

Clarity of Notes
- the best test for me is choral music. Can i understand the lyrics in the background? With the system in, i understood more words

Purity of tone
- I did not perceive changes to the tone of stringed instruments, other than they seem less mechanical/stiff. Additionally, i did notice that individual stringed notes were more intense, more 'pure' to use an oft-overused term. The note 'wavered' less which sometimes happens i suspect when there is grunge in the system obscuring the original signal

Delineation of Music Lines
- Here was a big improvement. I found that deep bass music often has loads of individual themes, musical lines and beats running throughout it. Generally, each track laid down has its own beat, often synchopated or in some other fashion related to the other beats on the track. I did not only find it easier to follow multiple beats...i actually discovered that there were several MORE beats from 'obscure pings, fizzes, whooses' that i had originally thought were just in the background...but i now realized actually had their own definitive beat in time and in synch with the rest of the track.

- That was a wonderful discovery.

Natural
- Things overall definitely seem less mechanical; not just greater ease of presentation; but in truth, notes also had a beginning, middle and end now, fully rounded rather than truncated on either side. This even applies to electronic music, where the beats and sounds are proper sound effects and beats rather than random scratches, or sizzles

Those are my notes that i came across. More on this later if i find more...and let me know if any of this was unclear.

Thank you Lloyd for sharing your detailed analysis.
david

 

[ddk]

There usually is. Like putting a blanket on the speakers.
It was not like that with the Minimus this time for me.
I am not so sensitive to grunt/hum, rather that than the boring blanket.
But, when done in the right way (whatever that is), the timbre of course appears clearer.
I did not experience it was the record noise that got filtered. In that case I would remove it.

hi Calle,
I didn't try grounding the speakers just the equipment in various configurations, I had a very different experience than you.
david

 

[spiritofmusic]

David, just what was your experience?
Just had Bonzo over, and we did a grand disconnect of all my Entreq grounding, and sq was rel impaired. Back to being fully-Entreq'd since he left, and my sense of ease is returning.
I've asked him to post his thoughts.
Despite my initial enthusiasm for amp -ve spkr terminal grounding, I'm going to pass at this juncture. Just getting a tad too much warmth in the sound which is somewhat program-dependent, and things are more neutral w/out.
I have some theories as to why this might be the case, and I'm going to revisit at a later date w/some revisions which may redress my concerns.

 

[Barry2013]

Can barely wait for the final thrilling instalment!

 

[spiritofmusic]

Not too much to build up Barry. The way my spkr terminals on my Nat amps are configured is that it's a very tight fit to install two sets of spades per terminal w/out some potential signal losses. My setup would work better if Fraser could provide spade-banana plug Apollos. I'll revisit amp -ve spkr terminal grounding when banana plug Apollos come thru.
Or this may be irrelevant, it may be this form of grounding, despite it's many positives, is just proving too "characterful" in my rig. As you know, I'm one of the few that didn't 'get' the Atlantis add-on box and Atlantis ground cables.
And this reiterates to me, just like everything in the high end, YMMV big time. And despite my coming across as an Entreq acolyte, I've turned down as much from them as I've gone for.

 

[Barry2013]

Thanks Marc.
He probably can.

 

[ddk]

David, just what was your experience?
Just had Bonzo over, and we did a grand disconnect of all my Entreq grounding, and sq was rel impaired. Back to being fully-Entreq'd since he left, and my sense of ease is returning.
I've asked him to post his thoughts.
Despite my initial enthusiasm for amp -ve spkr terminal grounding, I'm going to pass at this juncture. Just getting a tad too much warmth in the sound which is somewhat program-dependent, and things are more neutral w/out.
I have some theories as to why this might be the case, and I'm going to revisit at a later date w/some revisions which may redress my concerns.

Not positive Marc, specially with analog and that's why I'm asking to see what others are hearing and how is their setup.

david

 

[spiritofmusic]

Dave, YMMV is big in this hobby, esp the further you go up the quality/complexity scale. I've only found a handful of system enhancements to make meaningful changes in my system, Entreq being one of the few. But even w/Entreq, only half the combinations I've tried work totally for me.

 

[allvinyl]

Entreq Speaker Cables with 4mm Banana Plugs

... The way my spkr terminals on my Nat amps are configured is that it's a very tight fit to install two sets of spades per terminal w/out some potential signal losses. My setup would work better if Fraser could provide spade-banana plug Apollos. ...

You may already be ahead of me on this. The July 1st 2015 Entreq Retail price sheet shows that FOR SPEAKER CABLES a 4mm plug is available termination on request. We are asking them if this will be extended to their other cables but don't have the answer just yet.

John

 

[ddk]

Dave, YMMV is big in this hobby, esp the further you go up the quality/complexity scale. I've only found a handful of system enhancements to make meaningful changes in my system, Entreq being one of the few. But even w/Entreq, only half the combinations I've tried work totally for me.

I'm not arguing that Marc, that's what I'm trying to find out.

david

 

[Barry2013]

You may already be ahead of me on this. The July 1st 2015 Entreq Retail price sheet shows that FOR SPEAKER CABLES a 4mm plug is available termination on request. We are asking them if this will be extended to their other cables but don't have the answer just yet.

John

hi John.
May is the operative word as it was conjecture on my part but obviously it would be useful in some systems.

 

[allvinyl]

You may already be ahead of me on this. The July 1st 2015 Entreq Retail price sheet shows that FOR SPEAKER CABLES a 4mm plug is available termination on request. We are asking them if this will be extended to their other cables but don't have the answer just yet.

John

Entreq responded to us writing that the 4mm plug is available on the Eartha cables as well, but that the plug is fragile as it is made of either pure copper or pure silver, the metal is not stiff and should be treated accordingly.

John

 

[Barry2013]

Thanks for that John.
Useful to know but handle with care!

 

[allvinyl]

Thanks for that John.
Useful to know but handle with care!

Yes, Per Olof stressed the need for care in using the banana version.

I also meant to add that there is no price difference between spades and the 4mm plugs on any cable offering both.

John

 

[Barry2013]

Thanks John.
Do you have a price for the Poseidon yet