Is High End Audio Gear Worth the Money?

I have read a lot of bold claims and frankly some things mentioned here not entirely accurate.
Right up front I will say that I agree with Elliot G. I've never been in the business but after almost 50 years in this hobby and hanging around stores I agree with what he is saying. Everyone knows a customer is right, even when proven wrong. I myself returned a product twice claiming it was defective before I realized I was the dummy setting it up wrong. It happens.

Turntables/tonearms are as easy to set up as following a cookbook: Can't agree with that statement at all. First of all, given all of the various tonearm designs, each design type have their own unique set-up requirements and methods. But if one stops after making the basic VTA, HTA, VTF, Azimuth and anti-skating force adjustments, then the cartridge is hardly optimized. That's just the starting point. Every cartridge has be be dialed in by listening for optimum sound. That is something that has to be learned- and some may never be able to do it properly. All the tools in the world can't replace dialing in a cartridge by ear.

High end audio isn't deadly like high performance cars: Really? Grab a voltmeter and take some voltage measurements inside an amp. Take some voltage readings inside a tube amp or preamp and you'll see that they are quite deadly. They have a lot of stored energy in their oversized capacitors. Not a good idea to go poking around in there with your finger. Back in the day tube amps/preamps required putting a voltmeter directly on capacitors inside to measure and adjust bias voltage. You better watch yourself. These days I see most tube gear is auto biasing or have built in voltmeters and adjustments on the outside of the chassis. Definitely much safer. But I would not let small children around those glass tubes.

Quad speakers have text book step response while Wilson speakers are not ideal; Total nonsense. Take a few minutes to look up the step response of Quad, Thiel, Wilson or other speakers on the web. They all are quite similar. The Thiels have the best response but they are clearly underdamped as evidenced by the ringing after the step input. The Wilsons and Quads are critically damped giving just a slightly elongated recovery time but that prevents ringing.

My buddy builds speakers that sound better than Wilson XVX for a fraction of the cost: Hard to prove other than Wilson is a business with a pedigree and years of expertise in building speakers. You know, building a speaker is not just about selecting some drivers and crossovers off the web and stuffing them into a box made of special ingredients. The Cabinet design, structure and volume must be optimized for the type of drivers that will be used. Then the crossover networks must be designed to work with the selected drivers and the cabinet. The electrical properties are influenced by the mechanical properties of the cabinet design. Unless your buddy has an anechoic chamber and some good measuring equipment then he needs a really good ear to make a great sounding speaker. I tend to believe the high end speaker manufacturer have a lot of both. A lot of physics and math involved in building speakers. It's hardly a cut and try process these days.

I'm not trying to step on toes but listen to what some of these experts are saying. They may not always be right but they certainly have the battle scars and experience. And sure, now and then a really smart guy comes along and figures it all out in a day. Mozarts are far and few between.
I feel you are making the point for me. Is High End Audio Gear Worth The Money?

Didn't you just say, the user of the equipment is not qualified or capable of getting the gear to operate at its intended design level. Its like your saying, go ahead and buy a Ferrari, but expect to only drive it to the mechanics to be worked on. Why do you think a guy can make a solid box, put some drivers in it and use a BACCH to control the speakers respose and find it more satisfying than listening to friends Wilson that lack a pro setting them up. I have heard total disasters with Wilson and the dealer set it up. I see so many images on this site of systems shoved up and into a corner while lauding how wonderful their new $100,000 DAC is.
Is it "worth it" when a Schitt DAC and system set up well might sound better. Of course it is. The guy had the money and thought it was worth it. But the guy with the inexpensive system has a stereo that plays with less issues and is more enjoyable to a stranger to hear.
But, were not buying for strangers. Were buying for ourselves. So spending huge sums of money since you have it is worth it. Even if it produces poor sound to a guest listner.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Atmasphere
I agree with this however ALL speakers require positioning to sound their best. One doesn't need a heavily treated room, but one may need something to address obvious flaws. There are two different subjects being conflated here.
If you want the most out of what you bought then the set up and room is extremely import. The laws of physics don't bend to opinion. You can however in a "normal" room with little or no treatment still produce excellent sound with some effort and thought. There are levels of performance and the higher levels require that more and more issues in the environment be addressed. This is not either or it is a scale of what is and what can be.
I agree. What's so special about YG you can just set it and forget it. From what I hear its very analytical. Fancy cabinet. Nice looking. But room agnostic? I doubt it.
 
When we talk about audio it means we talk about passion/love. I think audiophiles love this hobby and it is simple to understand that why they pay extra for this love/passion. For many reasons the High end audio is expensive and No one think $50k 1meter interconnect is worth the money but we pay for it because we love it. Many times the sound upgrade is minor but when you think about next expensive upgrade you can not resist.

About the sound and getting better sound I think if you know what dynamic means (and how important is dynamic) then three parameters are the necessary conditions for good sound before any equipment upgrade.

1- Speaker placement (call Stirling Trayle)
2- Main AC power quality
3- Amplifier / Speaker matching (both drive and sound)

If you do perfectly these three condition then you unlocked the audio and spending more money for better audio equipment (I think many expensive audio equipments are not good and very few audio equipments are good in this industry) worth the money.

If you have problem in these three parameters then spending more money is not good.
 
Last edited:
Every cartridge has be be dialed in by listening for optimum sound. That is something that has to be learned- and some may never be able to do it properly. All the tools in the world can't replace dialing in a cartridge by ear.
That might be the case if your arm lacks adjust-ability. But if its truly adjustable and you have a proper protractor then setting up by ear is luck of the draw by comparison
 
  • Like
Reactions: ChrisMag2099
If you do perfectly these three condition then you unlocked the audio and spending more money for better audio equipment (I think many expensive audio equipments are not good and very few audio equipments are good in this industry) worth the money.
Don’t agree with you that very few companies make good product . in fact there are more good and excellent product than ever before. Price is only one factor and value is a completely different subject .
We are living in the best time ever for quality audio however the one who buys should do a basic amount of research to understand what is required to make it work at its best.
If you want to buy high priced gear and stick it Willy Nilly it’s your money your choice.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pokey77 and DaveC
Which do you prefer- a high school gym or an Opera House to hear a musical performance?
Who is playing? I have heard rock bands playing the SUNY Plattsburgh field house -- it is a gym. It is also where "Frampton Comes Alive" was partly recorded. I have been to a couple of Opera Houses, too. With the right recordings, the YG Sonja XVi can sound like both.
 
Don’t agree with you that very few companies make good product . in fact there are more good and excellent product than ever before. Price is only one factor and value is a completely different subject .
We are living in the best time ever for quality audio however the one who buys should do a basic amount of research to understand what is required to make it work at its best.
If you want to buy high priced gear and stick it Willy Nilly it’s your money your choice.
The "best money" or investment I ever made was getting my system optimized. I had the pleasure of being Stirling Trayle's 1st or 2nd customer in 2013. I have had him set up different systems in different locations over the years. He is amazing. I have also used Nathan Vanderstoep from NVS Sound and now Turnbull Audio and he has been awesome. Nathan has been around music and been a musician his whole life. In addition, in his performance days he was around live music every day for years. HP was right about live music as a reference in my experience. When Nathan sets up my system, I have watched him use a trumpet mouthpiece and walk around the room gathering live in the room info. Instead of chasing gear like I did since 1972 when I bought my first real speaker a JBL L26 Decade at Sam Goody's in the Sunrise Mall Massapequa NY (mom "lent" me the $$ :) I got to hear what I had optimized.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Elliot G.
Is high-end worth it? In my opinion no. I was a budget analyst and I get R&D cost and the cost of running a business, but personally find it hard to justify speakers costing over $100K.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lagonda
You know what bugs me about this whole "Worth It". It took a little introspective to come back around to something I said before. I know three people who have been severely impacted in a negative way by becoming caught up in buying more and more expensive audio gear. Spending retirement savings. One living in a disgusting house with literal holes in the roof. But darned if he don't have $250,000 into audio gear.

Its a fallacy to believe those buying expensive gear can afford it without serious consideration. There may be a greater percentage that buy expensive gear that are living beyond their means than those that have no worry about finances to get them to the end of the line.

So is it worth it???? What is the real impact of worth it. A job as a greeter at Wal-Mart so you can afford medical insurance. A job you would not need had you not bought all that expensive gear. Its a real issue. No one wants to share the stories publicly. But even Mike has mentioned a couple times having to ask his wife about a cable purchase. Others at his level have told me similar stories. They are tapped out on audio purchases. Yet every year its supposedly better and better and what they own is outdated and scaufed at. Heck, my old business partner was told by a sales guy at Diffinitive Audio his D'agostino amps sucked and had to be updated as the new ones were so much better. 4 year old amps suck.

So, Is It Worth It????? This isn't a question you answer on a forum. You have to decide for yourself. What are your priorities and can you control your addictions and impulses. Its a question beyond casual forum discourse. The cost of audio gear can be astronomical. It can ruin a life. It can impact your family.
 
Is high-end worth it? In my opinion no. I was a budget analyst and I get R&D cost and the cost of running a business, but personally find it hard to justify speakers costing over $100K.
No one should ever try to justify anything. One does not need it one wants it. If you want it you pay for it if not you don’t.
Price is never a determinate of quality although most great items cost more.
Does one need a 25k watch? A 200k car?
A 5 k suit, A 40k purse, a 10k pair of eyeglass frame of course not but we WANT them .
To each his own
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pokey77 and dbeau
No one should ever try to justify anything. One does not need it one wants it. If you want it you pay for it if not you don’t.
Price is never a determinate of quality although most great items cost more.
Does one need a 25k watch? A 200k car?
A 5 k suit, A 40k purse, a 10k pair of eyeglass frame of course not but we WANT them .
To each his own
That's why I said, "in my opinion". I'm not concerned with what others do with their money...first it's none of my business, I don't judge anyone for how they spend their money.

If you believe it's to each their own, than why attack me based on my opinion. It my sound like a contradiction, but I've spent a fair amount of money on audio, but can still feel it isn't worth it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pokey77
That's why I said, "in my opinion". I'm not concerned with what others do with their money...first it's none of my business, I don't judge anyone for how they spend their money.

If you believe it's to each their own, than why attack me based on my opinion. It my sound like a contradiction, but I've spent a fair amount of money on audio, but can still feel it isn't worth it.
I wasn’t even addressing you . I m expressing my opinion period. I didn’t attack you and if that’s how you took it then I apologize but it was not aimed at anyone .
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pokey77
I wasn’t even addressing you . I m expressing my opinion period. I didn’t attack you and if that’s how you took it then I apologize but it was not aimed at anyone .
Thanks. I appreciate your reply. Sorry, for accusing of something that you didn't do. I actually support the high-end, but still think the prices are out of control.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pokey77
Spending retirement savings. One living in a disgusting house with literal holes in the roof. But darned if he don't have $250,000 into audio gear.
That's an addiction and the drug of choice is audio. On the positive side, could be alot worse.
 
Thanks. I appreciate your reply. Sorry, for accusing of something that you didn't do. I actually support the high-end, but still think the prices are out of control.
I agree there is a high speed race to the cliff on the edge of the world .
Audio has IMO lost the experience base on which it was founded. All the shows, reviews and claims that IMO don’t lead to satisfaction is sad.
There are basics that are not taught and information that should be easy to find isn’t.
Why? The answer is obvious
 
Last edited:
The cost of audio gear can be astronomical. It can ruin a life. It can impact your family
Absent extenuating social circumstances / forces beyond a persons control, it's a voluntary choice made by an individual who needs to accept responsibilty for his / her actions.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Pokey77
You know what bugs me about this whole "Worth It". It took a little introspective to come back around to something I said before. I know three people who have been severely impacted in a negative way by becoming caught up in buying more and more expensive audio gear. Spending retirement savings. One living in a disgusting house with literal holes in the roof. But darned if he don't have $250,000 into audio gear.

Its a fallacy to believe those buying expensive gear can afford it without serious consideration. There may be a greater percentage that buy expensive gear that are living beyond their means than those that have no worry about finances to get them to the end of the line.

So is it worth it???? What is the real impact of worth it. A job as a greeter at Wal-Mart so you can afford medical insurance. A job you would not need had you not bought all that expensive gear. Its a real issue. No one wants to share the stories publicly. But even Mike has mentioned a couple times having to ask his wife about a cable purchase. Others at his level have told me similar stories. They are tapped out on audio purchases. Yet every year its supposedly better and better and what they own is outdated and scaufed at. Heck, my old business partner was told by a sales guy at Diffinitive Audio his D'agostino amps sucked and had to be updated as the new ones were so much better. 4 year old amps suck.

So, Is It Worth It????? This isn't a question you answer on a forum. You have to decide for yourself. What are your priorities and can you control your addictions and impulses. Its a question beyond casual forum discourse. The cost of audio gear can be astronomical. It can ruin a life. It can impact your family.
I can't afford a new wife because of audio purchases , and i only buy old stuff ! ;)
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing