Synergy is that which brings a smile to my face in appreciation of what I'm hearing. I don't analyse if the components or the media played more or less of a factor....I just enjoy the moment. The moment is the synergy.
John
John
Is There Such A Thing As "SYNERGY" Between Components In An Audio Chain?
- Thread starter RBFC
- Start date
Gregg
I doubt it is assumption #1 in my case ... Really, strongly , sincerely ..
maybe 2
What it is really to grasp there? Really ?
Dear Mep. Tom and Amirm: Stupid here in México is an insult and no one wants that any one tell him: stupid because this begin the fight I mean real fight.
In the other side ignorance/ignorant is exactly what Mep posted. How I see this word in our audio scenario or in any day by day life's scenario?:
exist a whole/world knowledge on each single subject that surround our life inany topic we can think. This " stock " knowledge is not private but someway " public " where each one of us that want to learn in some topics could have access to that in " stock " ( an always growing-up ) whole information.
Well, I see our brain as a " land " with a lot of " holes " some of them ( many ) are empty with no single information, other holes are with 10%-28%-69%-80% -etc of the topic information to achieve 100% and sveral other holes are already at 100%.
Through our each one learning process we are filling those holes where we are interested to. If we take any topic hole our ignorance level in that topic will be determined by how deep is still that hole: as deepest as higher the ignorance level.
As we follow learning and filling holes as our ignorance level comes lower. When we learn something new we say here in México: " that we fulfil/cover up a HOLE in our culture ".
And this is all about when I speak about ignorance level, I know for sure that I'm ignorant in a lot lot topics. Anyway I will try to take care about but maybe time to time when I will typing the keyboard that word could comes, please don't worry about: I can say to a person that he is ignorant ( because his poor/high ignorance level ) but certainly ( with out real reason ) I never tell a person: stupid.
Btw, I think is important too to take in count in which context in a discussion the " word " appear, with which tone appear the word: We know when some one ( due to that discussion level context/tone. ) try to hurt us.
Regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.
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Dear Frantz: I don't know in USA but here in México exist several different words where only in one country region the meaning of the word is what comes in a vocabolary/Wki and in other country regions the meaning is different. Synergy is not a word that we use very often but when we use it our meaning ( in my country region/friends/people surrounded. ) is that something that make synergy is on the top at perfect level where almost no other " change/manipulation " could achieve.
So, I take the word synergy to make my life easy: as I posted compatibility/matching between audio items is a main ( a must ) step inside the wider synergy word/meaning. Synergy for me is EXCELLENCE level and with out compatibility/matched audio items this EXCELLENCE level or synergy can't be achieve it.
There are audio systems where its audio links/items are matched but that shows no Synergy level, could sound good but no EXCELLENCE level there. This happen very often when for example a well matched speaker an amplifier just don't have synergy ( even if sounds good. ) because the " tone " of the amplifier design don't made synergy with the speaker that was voiced with different " tone " electronics in its design.
Synergy for me is the " perfection ": an accurate and matched audio links system that shows its quality performance sound reproduction at its best. This fulfil the Wki definition?, maybe not but give the understanding level that I need to express/talk on audio topics and that permit me a differentation over " matching ".
It is not important that you agree or not, that is only a way to talk in audio from my part. Easy for me.
regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.
When I was a student, without money for serious hifi, but already enjoying a good sound, I went to London and entered KJ Leisuresound, a nice shop in Wigmore Street. There, in a medium sized room, I heard music from a system that sounded different from what I was used - mostly it sounded full, rhythmic and really enjoyable. I sat there for some time listening for LP after LP, mainly jazz and rock. This system really could trigger some emotion and make me feel the music - I left to the HMV shop to buy some of the LPs I have been listening. It included a Linn Sondek, an active system with three Naim amplifiers and electronic crossovers and Linn Isobaric speakers. I heard a similar system several times in the following years, always with great pleasure. One thing I can tell you, the system was not edgy and was really enjoyable.
Much later I owned a Linn Sondek and listened to countless LPs with it. It complemented the balance of most of the rock LPs of the 70's much better than the competition. And no loudness button, tone control or equalizer could do the same.
Something I learned from thirty years of hifi is to keep an open mind. May be the term PRAT was and is very often badly used. But at that time this was a trend in sound type that had real boundaries and a defined meaning for us.
Raul
According to Wikipedia in Spanish this is the defintion for Synergy
Una sinergia (del griego ????????, «cooperación») es el resultado de la acción conjunta de dos o más causas, pero caracterizado por tener un efecto superior al que resulta de la simple suma de las dichas causas.
It seems the exact same for the term in English ...
I still haven't seen from you or anyone else an example of synergia en el Audio, according to these definitions
According to Wikipedia in Spanish this is the defintion for Synergy
Una sinergia (del griego ????????, «cooperación») es el resultado de la acción conjunta de dos o más causas, pero caracterizado por tener un efecto superior al que resulta de la simple suma de las dichas causas.
It seems the exact same for the term in English ...
I still haven't seen from you or anyone else an example of synergia en el Audio, according to these definitions
Man, you guys are beating this subject to death........and why? To prove or opine that your viewpoint bears more validity? Now you're bringing out dictionaries and Wiki posts...for what? Get a life people! Stop being so obsessed with what one component offers over another and just enjoy the darned music...you might actually like it more than the gear you fuss about so much.
220 posts have been written and nary even an agreement of any kind.
Excuse me while I actually take the time to enjoy the music.
John
220 posts have been written and nary even an agreement of any kind.
Excuse me while I actually take the time to enjoy the music.
John
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Question is whether synergy has anything to do with PRaT or vice versa?
We have one opinion of PRaT:
and we also have:
Sorry if I quoted out of context, but I am more aligned with the following:
I don't know if PRaT can be designed into a system. May be I am not a good enough designer, but I sure as heck know that it is easily lost. I don't know what systems Jack and Tim associate with PRaT if they associate PRaT with staccato quality and exaggerated bright and edgy treble, but in my book, it is about the furthest from that.
It is not staccato, but an ease and flow to the music that makes it rhythmic and really enjoyable. It makes you want to listen for hours on end, and it energizes you after a long hard day. I like Greg's position
However, I will add one thing - if you don't miss PRaT, don't stress it. Sit back and enjoy the music the way you enjoy it. That is the most important thing in this hobby.
We have one opinion of PRaT:
and we also have:
Sorry if I quoted out of context, but I am more aligned with the following:
I don't know if PRaT can be designed into a system. May be I am not a good enough designer, but I sure as heck know that it is easily lost. I don't know what systems Jack and Tim associate with PRaT if they associate PRaT with staccato quality and exaggerated bright and edgy treble, but in my book, it is about the furthest from that.
It is not staccato, but an ease and flow to the music that makes it rhythmic and really enjoyable. It makes you want to listen for hours on end, and it energizes you after a long hard day. I like Greg's position
However, I will add one thing - if you don't miss PRaT, don't stress it. Sit back and enjoy the music the way you enjoy it. That is the most important thing in this hobby.
John, I'm with you. Listen to the music. Stop listening to the gear, and in particular stop making up ambiguous names for what you *think* you hear.
This discussion reminds me of the discussion by the U.S. Supreme Court concerning its inability to come to a consensus definition of obscenity/pornography and the infamous Justice Stewart line: I know it when I see it.
The parallels with *PRaT*, another B.S. ambiguous word that only makes sense to audiophiles, and even then there remains disagreement amongst audiophiles over its definition - anyone remember the recent and eerily similar discussion over the likewise useless term "musical" - so to further expand on this discussion in order to unequivocally prove the point, let it be stated:
For those who cannot recognize obscenity/pornography, I can only make the following assumptions:
You have never heard/seen pornography, consequently you do not not what you are missing.
Every movie/show has obscenity/pornography. Therfore you have taken it for granted.
Either intentionally or unintentionally you are just unable to grasp the concept.
This discussion reminds me of the discussion by the U.S. Supreme Court concerning its inability to come to a consensus definition of obscenity/pornography and the infamous Justice Stewart line: I know it when I see it.
The parallels with *PRaT*, another B.S. ambiguous word that only makes sense to audiophiles, and even then there remains disagreement amongst audiophiles over its definition - anyone remember the recent and eerily similar discussion over the likewise useless term "musical" - so to further expand on this discussion in order to unequivocally prove the point, let it be stated:
For those who cannot recognize obscenity/pornography, I can only make the following assumptions:
You have never heard/seen pornography, consequently you do not not what you are missing.
Every movie/show has obscenity/pornography. Therfore you have taken it for granted.
Either intentionally or unintentionally you are just unable to grasp the concept.
Ron- lol. I just think the Supremes (What we lawyers call them)just wanted to see more movies. Oh yeah, Ron for your parody of my post to be complete you need to suggest an obscene and and non-obscene xrated film as an example.
True story. After a long trial of an xrated video movie producer the jury was out fou weeks with no note to the judge.The judge summoned them to the courtroom and inquired if they were having a problem. They replied out loud, "Yes,we need to see more movies. "
True story. After a long trial of an xrated video movie producer the jury was out fou weeks with no note to the judge.The judge summoned them to the courtroom and inquired if they were having a problem. They replied out loud, "Yes,we need to see more movies. "
PRAT is a term that is used to describe things that aren't happening. I had one of the 1980s Linn Sondeks. It subtlely boosted the bass, and the extra energy in that region did give the music more of a toe-tapping rhythmic beat. But that's all that happened. It was fun, but there was no change in pace or timing.
The terms PRaT and musicality, and obscenity have been adequately defined. Justice Potter Stewarts' statement, "I know it when I see it." was merely dictum. The term obscenity has been defined by the Supreme Court and many were tried and sent to jail. If you want to bore yourself See http://law.jrank.org/pages/8890/Obscenity.html. The fact that the definition has been strained is irrelevant. As one might expect, if you asked Larry Flynt and Pat Roberts to define obscenity you would get two diametrically opposed answers. Neither would doubt the existence of a serous issue regarding the first amendment and public decency standards.
Many have expressed thier opinion that descriptive words used to describe what we hear as inadequate or just wrong. Fair enough. But B.S.? Come on.
Many have expressed thier opinion that descriptive words used to describe what we hear as inadequate or just wrong. Fair enough. But B.S.? Come on.
FWIW, Gary, Tim associates PRaT with very active audiophile imaginations. Especially when he reads/hears PRaT used in conjunction with the Sondek or any turntable, as enhanced rhythm and timing and turntable are, pretty much by definition, a contradiction of terms.
Tim
The next time I get a summons for jury duty, I hope I get that kind of case!
Come to think of it, it is not only jurors but judges too. I've represented my share of women, usually in their late teens or early 20s, who worked in *massage parlors*. Like clockwork, when it comes time for the presiding judge to assign cases on the calendar for trial or preliminary hearing to the various departments, the PJ kicks the other cases and keeps my cases in his department. You can see it in the judge's eyes and body language as he is talking to me but giving the head to toe to my clients.
Sorry for the OT post here. Greg's post made me LOL and reminded me of some of my clients.
John,
I took your advice but became stuck at the first hurdle, deciding which remastered album (so many remasters for a single album) had the most synergy with my system
Sorry just could not resist
Cheers
Orb
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