Not an easy life my friend..drink some Tokai while sorting them out and rollingI’ve visited my friend Tibor The rest is history…
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Not an easy life my friend..drink some Tokai while sorting them out and rollingI’ve visited my friend Tibor The rest is history…
View attachment 110619
I’m not from Hungary but i like something else HungarianI am from Hungary. I do like wine
I've read posts indicating the Horizon's two "Sub" connections are the same signal as the two adjacent "Output" connections. Does anyone know if they are exactly the same... level, sound quality, etc.?
Fred. now that Greg has experienced the greatness of the Horizon, it's time to start sending him some of your private stash of tubes so that he can really get a feel for it's greatnessThe first professional review of the Horizon DAC, by the esteemed Greg Weaver has gone live!
LampizatOr Horizon DAC Review A new benchmark! Review By Greg Weaver Of Enjoy the Music.com
LampizatOr Horizon DAC Review A new benchmark! Review By Greg Weaver Of Enjoy the Music.comwww.enjoythemusic.com
Glowing review, as the Horizon deserves.The first professional review of the Horizon DAC, by the esteemed Greg Weaver has gone live!
LampizatOr Horizon DAC Review A new benchmark! Review By Greg Weaver Of Enjoy the Music.com
LampizatOr Horizon DAC Review A new benchmark! Review By Greg Weaver Of Enjoy the Music.comwww.enjoythemusic.com
I think it vastly depends on the amp that has to be drivenGlowing review, as the Horizon deserves.
Greg: "My listening with the direct output from the Horizon was virtually identical to my experience using my line stage"
Greg's $46,000 True Life SSP-1 pre amp did not (clearly) outperform the Horizon DAC-direct.
I wonder how much you need to spend on a pre amp to substantially outperform the Horizon DAC-direct. Has anyone heard (of) any such pre amp?
Not sure if I fully understand what you mean, could you elaborate a bit please?I think it vastly depends on the amp that has to be driven
I do struggle to read between the lines with the 6moons man but there is a discussion (is review too loose a label ) on an upcoming Icon passive 4 step slagle based autoformer attenuator called Matchmaker which will have options of copper, silver and nickel or nano-crystalline to help high efficiency systems owners wanting to attenuate for high output sources.The issues are system gain matching, preamp (Horizon output) to amp input impedance compatibility, and related tonality. An amp which may be a challenge to drive properly because it needs linear current drive into a complex impedance may perform better with a preamp which can drive more like an amplifier itself. Although the Horizon has great sound quality, it doesn’t drive difficult loads well. Bass response may suffer, or possibly other performance areas.
The Horizon volume control doesn’t have enough attenuation in my system. My amp has an input sensitivity of only 1.0v for 100 watts of output. My speakers are 99db sensitive. So I can’t turn it down enough to play quiet, which is my typical level. But the speakers can easily handle 100 watts. Another volume control in the system would bring more available attenuation, but at a reduction in sound quality. I’ve tried a couple different preamps and an EMIA passive. The EMIA was best, but still has an audible reduction in SQ. These are issues I’m still sorting out. A lower powered amp with numerically higher input sensitivity may be the answer, or an integrated.
Using the Horizon without a pre limits system flexibility. I’m still looking for the right Goldilocks amp.
Could you translate you amp's input sensitivity from 1v for 100 watts to Ohms? My amp is 200K Ohm. The manual states the Horizon likes high input impedances.The issues are system gain matching, preamp (Horizon output) to amp input impedance compatibility, and related tonality. An amp which may be a challenge to drive properly because it needs linear current drive into a complex impedance may perform better with a preamp which can drive more like an amplifier itself. Although the Horizon has great sound quality, it doesn’t drive difficult loads well. Bass response may suffer, or possibly other performance areas.
The Horizon volume control doesn’t have enough attenuation in my system. My amp has an input sensitivity of only 1.0v for 100 watts of output. My speakers are 99db sensitive. So I can’t turn it down enough to play quiet, which is my typical level. But the speakers can easily handle 100 watts. Another volume control in the system would bring more available attenuation, but at a reduction in sound quality. I’ve tried a couple different preamps and an EMIA passive. The EMIA was best, but still has an audible reduction in SQ. These are issues I’m still sorting out. A lower powered amp with numerically higher input sensitivity may be the answer, or an integrated.
Using the Horizon without a pre limits system flexibility. I’m still looking for the right Goldilocks amp.
Thanks Tao, I’ll look into this further. The Icon are similar to the EMIA because they both use the Slagle autoformer guts. Mine is the copper version. Silver would be the way to go but that’s over $10k total with a proper interconnect. For now it seems better to put those funds into the amp upgrade.I do struggle to read between the lines with the 6moons man but there is a discussion (is review too loose a label ) on an upcoming Icon passive 4 step slagle based autoformer attenuator called Matchmaker which will have options of copper, silver and nickel or nano-crystalline to help high efficiency systems owners wanting to attenuate for high output sources.
Apologies in advance if this is a wild goose chase but deciphering Srajaen always leaves me both dizzy and confused Hope this in some way helps.
Icon matchmaker Icon 5 and icon pure
My current amp has 100k input impedance. As Al said, this is unrelated to the other parameters. The Horizon has no issues driving this amp. Staying above 20k is recommended, but this isn’t straight forward as complex impedance can be an issue too. The H has driven all of the amps I’ve tried so far without issue, other than gain. But there are quite a few high end amps that have low input impedance - Thomas Mayer, Gryphon, Constellation to name a few. Each of these manufacturers also makes excellent preamps that match well with their amps. So this supports the preamp approach. Too simple of a solution? Maybe.Could you translate you amp's input sensitivity from 1v for 100 watts to Ohms? My amp is 200K Ohm. The manual states the Horizon likes high input impedances.
Easy enough to test.The 2 sub out XLR are not labeled L and R. Are they same as reg out, as in top one is L and bottom R?
Thx so much!Easy enough to test.
1) Using the normal "Out-Left" (top) and "Out-Right" (bottom), run a stereo source normally . Note the L/R position of some instruments.
Using the "Sub-Out" (top) and "Sub-Out" (bottom), play the same segment. Are the L/R positions of those instruments the same? They are on my Horizon. So, regarding L/R, the Sub terminals are consistent with the normal terminals with Left on top and Right on bottom.
2) Using the normal connections, play a mono source. When seated at the exact midpoint listening position you should hear the sound coming exactly from the midpoint between the speakers.
Switch only one output from the standard connection to the adjacent "Sub" connection. Play the mono source again. Does the sound still come from the exact midpoint between the speakers, it should. If the mono "center" image point shifts left or right, then there is a different volume level between the normal terminals and the "Sub" pair. On my system that midpoint is exactly the same. You could try using a dB meter, but I've found that the ear/brain system can detect very slight differences in L/R positioning.
Summary. I can detect no difference between using the normal "Out-Left" "Out-Right" pair and the "Sub-Out" pair. One difference is that making the first connection swap, there is a temporary difference given that I've been running the normal outputs for close to a year and have never used the "Sub-Out" pair. That difference goes away after the sub pair of connections get exercised carrying a signal.