LampizatOr Horizon - Tube Rolling Paradise

[plasmod3]

Hi Blake

Yup we talked about this before with laszlo and a few others. Problem is the resistor we use. For that value and the wattage needed they are quite long. We could change it for a lesser resistor but the sound signature would be very very different. To a point that the resistor (and therefore the adaptor) becomes an impediment to the sound rather than a positive contribution to the sound.

The adaptor as it stands atm uses a resistor that costs 25 pounds , you can never compare it to a resistor that costs a few cents.

Resistors as I have explained are an evil in any circuit but a necessary one. Which means the quality and type of the resistor used is paramount. All the small resistors used out there with small adaptors including the one Steve has are wire wound resistors with no damping or shielding. It has very poor inductance and damping qualities. If you compare that with thick film resistors like the pathaudio we use , the differences are quite a bit.

We simply can't compare resistors costing a few cents vs one with is costing 25pounds. And wire wound vs thin film. We have turned the adaptor into a positive contributor to the sound.

And I can confirm it is not the sound of the 2504 here that has made the difference but the adaptor. There was a lot of testing in between and having the 5 to 6 prototypes we have, it was very clear there is an effect on sound with the resistor used.

 

[plasmod3]

The resistor we use

PathAudio.eu

www.pathaudio.eu

Pathaudio Resistors 10 Watt 1% Resistors | HIFICollective

Pathaudio Resistors 10 Watt 1% Resistors

www.hificollective.co.uk

Resistor Shootout: Duelund, Pathaudio, Jantzen

Do It Yourself Hi-Fi and Reviews for Audiophiles

guneytuncer.blogspot.com

 

[dminches]

All the small resistors used out there with small adaptors including the one Steve has are wire wound resistors with no damping or shielding.

That’s not entirely true. The adapter I made uses a metal film resistor that is small. It doesn’t match the quality of the pathaudio resistor but it also did cost a couple cents.

 

[plasmod3]

That’s not entirely true. The adapter I made uses a metal film resistor that is small. It doesn’t match the quality of the pathaudio resistor but it also did cost a couple cents.

Which one did you use David? The pathaudio one is a crossover resistor specced for loudspeaker crossovers and an audio resistor

Worth adding that the one Tibor uses is wirewound. I have seen the photos. Happy to be corrected if wrong

 

[dminches]

Nothing special. A Vishay which is heat resistant.

 

[plasmod3]

Nothing special. A Vishay which is heat resistant.

This one I believe

https://au.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Vishay-Dale/CPF31R0000DKB14?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtG0KNrPCHnjcem%252B2QAUVt5ajIbp9%2Fs22w%3D

Sure I can offer this to the community as well if they want. It won't sound the same but will look nicer Tibor doesn't use this though.

 

[dminches]

This one I believe

https://au.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Vishay-Dale/CPF31R0000DKB14?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtG0KNrPCHnjcem%252B2QAUVt5ajIbp9%2Fs22w%3D

Sure I can offer this to the community as well if they want. It won't sound the same but will look nicer Timor doesn't use this though.

I think this one:

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Vishay-Dale/CPF31R0000FKE14?qs=AgiByKCM3cA8oo7VoF1b7Q%3D%3D&countryCode=US&currencyCode=USD

 

[plasmod3]

I think this one:

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Vishay-Dale/CPF31R0000FKE14?qs=AgiByKCM3cA8oo7VoF1b7Q%3D%3D&countryCode=US&currencyCode=USD

Thanks David

Yup looking at the 2 models it comes down to resistance tolerance and also if lead is used in the wire material. The base material being tin

 

[steve williams]

And I can confirm it is not the sound of the 2504 here that has made the difference but the adaptor. There was a lot of testing in between and having the 5 to 6 prototypes we have, it was very clear there is an effect on soun

so you’re saying it’s not the tube we’re hearing but the resistor I maintain that it is indeed the tube we’re hearing but what this adapter is , is merely a different flavor. I don’t dispute they’re great Ian. It’s just that it is butt ugly and just way too tall for my liking. As for Tibors adapters I have no idea what he uses but in my system the sound is nothing short of spectacular.

 

[plasmod3]

Also interestingly. With the vishay resistor is derates quite quickly. Tolerance is to 230 degrees but it derates from 70 degrees

 

[plasmod3]

so you’re saying it’s not the tube we’re hearing but the resistor I maintain that it is indeed the tube we’re hearing but what this adapter is , is merely a different flavor. I don’t dispute they’re great Ian. It’s just that it is butt ugly and just way too tall for my liking. As for Tibors adapters I have no idea what he uses but in my system the sound is nothing short of spectacular.

Indeed butt ugly I agree but it does sound good and looks can be subjective. For eg i hated my Panamera when i got it but its certainly growing on me. Hard to know without trying Steve. Same as tubes if you didn't try the 6900 ecc32 2504 2004 you won't know they are better?

I stand by my thoughts that the adaptor makes a huge difference to the sound.

 

[steve williams]

I’ve said all along that I agree with everything you say. I bet the sound is indeed terrific I truly can’t get past the looks and I listen in the dark

 

[steve williams]

As for the Panamera I understand however I owned a 928 for years and loved the look just shows that beauty is in the eyes of the beholder

 

[plasmod3]

I’ve said all along that I agree with everything you say. I bet the sound is indeed terrific I truly can’t get past the looks and I listen in the dark

I can paint it black or create a wooden sleeve over it but wood can be costly - labour charges in australia are crazy. Might even be able to 3d print a carbon fiber filament sleeve as well if that helps The part already has some 3d printed parts in there that i custom designed - wont be hard to add more in there

btw i found a few more 2504s in my stash if you need any - should be good. enough for all i hope

 

[plasmod3]

As for the Panamera I understand however I owned a 928 for years and loved the look just shows that beauty is in the eyes of the beholder

yup indeed same page there my friend same page

 

[steve williams]

As for the Panamera I understand however I owned a 928 for years and loved the look just shows that beauty is in the eyes of the beholder

It must be my OCD personality Ian.

 

[plasmod3]

It must be my OCD personality Ian.

Always good to enjoy the finer things in life my friend better doing that than leaving it to the kids my friends say and i couldn't agree more haha!

 

[steve williams]

Bottom line Ian is I agree that sonically you’re onto something and you make perfect sense I have no disagreement. You’re obviously a smart man. Redesign so that it’s not an eyesore and I would onsider but for me once seen it can’t be unseen. It sit right on the bow of the Horizon and as good as I’m sure it is, it’s like a pimple on the face of a very smart and beautiful woman. Again looks don’t improve sound and I listen in the dark but I hope I’ve made my point. I hope none of the readers here think I’m discounting this on the basis of SQ improvement. I’m not. If you don’t mind the looks it’s priced very fairly IMO. Maybe version 2 Ian will have a redesign to appease nuts like me

 

[steve williams]

And BTW to all reading Ian just found a few more G2504 ( I assume Valvo) I would contact Ian real quick because I can bet you that he’ll sell out real quick. A Valvo and his adapter I’m sure would be quite something. So one stop shopping

 

[plasmod3]

Bottom line Ian is I agree that sonically you’re onto something and you make perfect sense I have no disagreement. You’re obviously a smart man. Redesign so that it’s not an eyesore and I would onsider but for me once seen it can’t be unseen. It sit right on the bow of the Horizon and as good as I’m sure it is, it’s like a pimple on the face of a very smart and beautiful woman. Again looks don’t improve sound and I listen in the dark but I hope I’ve made my point. I hope none of the readers here think I’m discounting this on the basis of SQ improvement. I’m not. If you don’t mind the looks it’s priced very fairly IMO. Maybe version 2 Ian will have a redesign to appease nuts like me

Thanks matey Yup ok let me see what i can do Will put the brain cells to work