Modern speakers vs Vintage speakers

[thomask]

A lot good speakers comes from britain, Harbeth, Spendor , B&W , Tannoy , KEF, LS 3/ 5A and Acoustic Energy.
My two best Speakers i have heard from Britain
Acoustic Energy AE 2 signature
B&W Matrix 800 old
View attachment 84680View attachment 84681

.


The above photo is not mine but my JA 500 looked exactly same as the above.

I had driven B&W Notilus 801(15 inch woofer) with JA 500 from 2000 to 2002.

The source was DCS Elgar and CEC TL0x transport.

It gave the most powerful and deep bass in my listeing room.

Even Altec A7 could not match it.

But power tubes(24 total) kept popping out.

Since it generated too much heat, it was rather difficult to use it during summer.


Thus I had switched from 350 watts Jadis 500 to 8 W Silbatone 300b SET.

What a downgrade in terms of wattage but not in quality of sound.


B&W Notilus 801 to 6.5 inch full range recommended by Mr Chung my vintage guru

 

[DasguteOhr]

.View attachment 84687


The above photo is not mine but my JA 500 looked exactly same as the above.

I had driven B&W Notilus 801(15 inch woofer) with JA 500 from 2000 to 2002.

The source was DCS Elgar and CEC TL0x transport.

It gave the most powerful and deep bass in my listeing room.

Even Altec A7 could not match it.

But power tubes(24 total) kept popping out.

Since it generated too much heat, it was rather difficult to use it during summer.


Thus I had switched from 350 watts Jadis 500 to 8 W Silbatone 300b SET.

What a downgrade in terms of wattage but not in quality of sound.


B&W Notilus 801 to 6.5 inch full range recommended by Mr Chung my vintage guru

ohh .. that gives a high electricity bill but well made amplifiers????
you save heating costs

P.S eye candy

 

[montesquieu]

Important for a Thorens, the plinth must be acoustically dead and absorb background noise from the Thorens. My plinth is made of beech plywood, filled with sand lead shot. 3 layers of roofing lead. 70 pounds

Yes I would totally agree - that's what the Permali (UK brand name for a phenolic material, finer grained, but otherwise very simlar to Panzerholz) is doing at the core of my plinth. The Permali core alone (first picture) is 40kg, adding the solid sapele-wood cladding, Thorens motor unit, 5kg Schopper plinth, solid permali + walnut veneer armboards, stainless steel Glanz tonearms, 500g tonearm stabilisers etc the combined weight of mine comes to 60kg (a two-man lift) converting that to Imperial measurements = 130 pounds for the assembled turntable. It sits on Townshend Seismic Pods.

It really is a world away from your typical TD124 on hollow plywood 'Ortofon' type plinth on rubber mushrooms ... though actually I have found that the lightweight approach also has its merits, can be really enjoyable and musical, albeit not up there with the hi-end in the manner of a heavyweight plinth in terms of resolution and noise elimination. Still need to pay proper attention to motor servicing, motor suspension and bearing/stepper pulley noise, all potential pitfalls of the TD124. To be honest, compared to relatively low-maintenance Garrard 301/401 or Lenco, the TD124 can be a pain to keep on top of, but worth it - in my opinion it really is the best of the idlers (and I've had just about all of them over the years).

 

[DasguteOhr]

Yes I would totally agree - that's what the Permali (UK brand name for a phenolic material, finer grained, but otherwise very simlar to Panzerholz) is doing at the core of my plinth. The Permali core alone (first picture) is 40kg, adding the solid sapele-wood cladding, Thorens motor unit, 5kg Schopper plinth, solid permali + walnut veneer armboards, stainless steel Glanz tonearms, 500g tonearm stabilisers etc the combined weight of mine comes to 60kg (a two-man lift) converting that to Imperial measurements = 130 pounds for the assembled turntable. It sits on Townshend Seismic Pods.

It really is a world away from your typical TD124 on hollow plywood 'Ortofon' type plinth on rubber mushrooms ... though actually I have found that the lightweight approach also has its merits, can be really enjoyable and musical, albeit not up there with the hi-end in the manner of a heavyweight plinth in terms of resolution and noise elimination. Still need to pay proper attention to motor servicing, motor suspension and bearing/stepper pulley noise, all potential pitfalls of the TD124. To be honest, compared to relatively low-maintenance Garrard 301/401 or Lenco, the TD124 can be a pain to keep on top of, but worth it - in my opinion it really is the best of the idlers (and I've had just about all of them over the years).

wonderful plinth amazing..respect!!!. I separated my tonearms from the plinth resulted in 4-5 dB less interference during playback. is now as noiseless as a modern one. I was lucky enough to meet someone from Thorens who worked in the development department at Thorens. got a berger e 50 engine in new condition.he made for me better bearings.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Yes I would totally agree - that's what the Permali (UK brand name for a phenolic material, finer grained, but otherwise very simlar to Panzerholz) is doing at the core of my plinth. The Permali core alone (first picture) is 40kg, adding the solid sapele-wood cladding, Thorens motor unit, 5kg Schopper plinth, solid permali + walnut veneer armboards, stainless steel Glanz tonearms, 500g tonearm stabilisers etc the combined weight of mine comes to 60kg (a two-man lift) converting that to Imperial measurements = 130 pounds for the assembled turntable. It sits on Townshend Seismic Pods.

It really is a world away from your typical TD124 on hollow plywood 'Ortofon' type plinth on rubber mushrooms ... though actually I have found that the lightweight approach also has its merits, can be really enjoyable and musical, albeit not up there with the hi-end in the manner of a heavyweight plinth in terms of resolution and noise elimination. Still need to pay proper attention to motor servicing, motor suspension and bearing/stepper pulley noise, all potential pitfalls of the TD124. To be honest, compared to relatively low-maintenance Garrard 301/401 or Lenco, the TD124 can be a pain to keep on top of, but worth it - in my opinion it really is the best of the idlers (and I've had just about all of them over the years).

Tom, if by divine providence (aka coincidence from atheist POV lol), I have a possibility of modding my rim drive Salvation with a Permali/Aluminium sandwich bespoke plinth, replacing stock slate.
I suspect it won't be anywhere near as massy as yours, for a start only 1/3-1/2 the thickness, and no other accoutrements.
But without doubt, your 124 demonstrated such swing and precision, no hint of a "dead" or emotionless over-neutral sound, I'd be hoping some of this goodness might be transferred to my analog.
Btw, this was the first time in a long time I was happy to listen to classical LP after classical LP.
I don't remember being similarly transfixed playing classical albums all day on The General's Vyger Mayers Pnoes system.
A real feather in your cap.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

wonderful plinth amazing..respect!!!. I separated my tonearms from the plinth resulted in 4-5 dB less interference during playback. is now as noiseless as a modern one. I was lucky enough to meet someone from Thorens who worked in the development department at Thorens. got a berger e 50 engine in new condition.he made for me better bearings.

It really is eye candy that plinth. It sounds excellent too. Beautifully executed carpentry as well.

 

[DasguteOhr]

It really is eye candy that plinth. It sounds excellent too. Beautifully executed carpentry as well.

I built ten different plinths, seven of which ended up in the fire. two dosen't burn concrete and slate. until i was satisfied. I think his way is probably easier.

 

[Argonaut]

It really is a world away from your typical TD124 on hollow plywood 'Ortofon' type plinth on rubber mushrooms ... though actually I have found that the lightweight approach also has its merits, can be really enjoyable and musical, albeit not up there with the hi-end in the manner of a heavyweight plinth in terms of resolution and noise elimination. Still need to pay proper attention to motor servicing, motor suspension and bearing/stepper pulley noise, all potential pitfalls of the TD124. To be honest, compared to relatively low-maintenance Garrard 301/401 or Lenco, the TD124 can be a pain to keep on top of, but worth it - in my opinion it really is the best of the idlers (and I've had just about all of them over the years).

I would concur, I found the TD124 to be the most musically engaging and nuanced of the usual suspect vintage idlers.

 

[DasguteOhr]

.View attachment 84687


The above photo is not mine but my JA 500 looked exactly same as the above.

I had driven B&W Notilus 801(15 inch woofer) with JA 500 from 2000 to 2002.

The source was DCS Elgar and CEC TL0x transport.

It gave the most powerful and deep bass in my listeing room.

Even Altec A7 could not match it.

But power tubes(24 total) kept popping out.

Since it generated too much heat, it was rather difficult to use it during summer.


Thus I had switched from 350 watts Jadis 500 to 8 W Silbatone 300b SET.

What a downgrade in terms of wattage but not in quality of sound.


B&W Notilus 801 to 6.5 inch full range recommended by Mr Chung my vintage guru

When I find the photos, I'll show you a converted B&W 801 F in pyramid mahogany. xover modified. a great speaker without bass reflex

 

[spiritofmusic]

I would concur, I found the TD124 to be the most musically engaging and nuanced of the usual suspect vintage idlers.

I can't disagree. Have heard my share of nicely modded 301s, 401s and Lencos. Tom's Permali plinth 124 absolutely convinced, showing none of the colorations I've heard in those others.

 

[Addicted to hifi]

A lot good speakers comes from britain, Harbeth, Spendor , B&W , Tannoy , KEF, LS 3/ 5A and Acoustic Energy.
My two best Speakers i have heard from Britain
Acoustic Energy AE 2 signature
B&W Matrix 800 old
View attachment 84680View attachment 84681

Yes agree that a lot of good speakers come from England but I’m a big fan of tannoys.I also llike Proac And many others.

 

[Addicted to hifi]

How do they compare to Vitavox, another English company that has been around for a while?

I actually have never heard vitavox speakers But have experienced the tannoy kingdom.

 

[DasguteOhr]

I forget the world best resolution and midrange speakers Quad ESL 57 in bigger rooms add some bass array.

 

[Addicted to hifi]

I forget the world best resolution and midrange speakers Quad ESL 57 in bigger rooms add some bass array.

Amazing speakers still after all these years.

 

[DasguteOhr]

Amazing speakers still after all these years.

one wonders what has been done in terms of development over the past 60 years. nothing at all.

 

[Addicted to hifi]

one wonders what has been done in terms of development over the past 60 years. nothing at all.

Yes I agree with you.

 

[Addicted to hifi]

The only improvements in modern speakers is they can handle more power these days but sound quality hasn’t improved much at all.

 

[DasguteOhr]

The only improvements in modern speakers is they can handle more power these days but sound quality hasn’t improved much at all.

add a few quads to it, and listen afterwards then you go into the garden and burn your speakers, I promise ... joke

 

[Addicted to hifi]

add a few quads to it, and listen afterwards then you go into the garden and burn your speakers, I promise ... joke

Wow that is a awesome system.

 

[MarcelNL]

The only improvements in modern speakers is they can handle more power these days but sound quality hasn’t improved much at all.

not only that they can handle more power but probably only because they NEED more power ;-)

I'd have snapped up the ESL 57 that I ran across years ago in a jiffy when they'd bring more authority to the table/room, IME ESL speakers require massive surface area and some support to be more than very fast and detailed...as much as I like them.