Oh jeez - M6, another super-speaker from Magico

Al M.

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Sep 10, 2013
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Off course one can should design a full range standalone speaker thats hit the lowest registers.
For 170 k it definetively should
A bass tower doesnt neseccarily play lower it does it with more membrane surfaces which give the impression.
More impact
Well, more impact, yes. I couldn't care less if a speaker "nominally" hits the lowest registers.
 

XV-1

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May 24, 2010
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Al, I really appreciate that, but it is only my speculation from my perspective as an owner and someone who has heard a lot of their speakers and read a lot about what they are doing. I have no idea how accurate it is.

There is definitely the pre and post M Pro period. That was a real turning point, and I was thrilled to see a speaker with the curved front baffle of the Mini and Q series, and the curved side panels of the S series. I think the M Pro did merge what was best from those two distinct lines. Much has been written about the tweeter. I'll just reiterate that I don't hear the high frequency assault from my Q3 in my system, but I fully acknowledge the superiority of the new tweeters as I have heard in the S5II and MPro.

I would like to see Magico develop a more efficient and easier to drive speaker, but the sealed box of a realistic size seems to prevent it. It's only been about fifteen years. It will be interesting to see where they go from here.
They do. The Magico Ultimate 3 horn speaker. 16 ohms, 114db sensitivity.
 

morricab

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Apr 25, 2014
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But at shows Magico usually don't sound as they should. Sorry, but show impressions are often worthless, and probably mostly when it comes to Magico.
Why should they matter less with Magico? It is a pretty conventional sealed box speaker when all is said and done at the end of the day with the usual goals of flat frequency response, low driver/cabinet noise and wide dispersion. Now, I would argue that most speakers designed like that don't really sound that great but this was only about Magico.
 

morricab

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They do. The Magico Ultimate 3 horn speaker. 16 ohms, 114db sensitivity.
Yeah, those have potential ;). Heard them in Munich and wasn't bad at all but I think they were limited by the choice of Pass electronics...who needs big SS on 114db speakers??!!
 
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morricab

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Magico was heavily criticised before they started producing so many different models. People don't seem to be bashing the lower A series as much. I don't quite get the neverending part. Is VPI criticized for this? I don't think so. No, I think it is something else.
I don't hate the brand but everytime I have heard them (other than the massive horn speakers) I found it not to my liking in terms of dyanmics and tonality. That said, I haven't heard them with what I would consider musically consonnant electronics...maybe that makes all the difference.
 

PeterA

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Dec 7, 2011
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I don't hate the brand but everytime I have heard them (other than the massive horn speakers) I found it not to my liking in terms of dyanmics and tonality. That said, I haven't heard them with what I would consider musically consonnant electronics...maybe that makes all the difference.
One line of argument is that when one hears Magico speakers, he is really hearing the upstream components. My opinion is that, at least on their higher end models perhaps more so than their lower priced lines, Magico is trying to make a speaker with little to no sound of its own. Perhaps impossible, but if they are approaching this, then one is hearing the cables, the connectors, the amp circuit, the inadequate power, etc. more so than the actual speaker. And the new M6, with its curved surfaces, supposedly has even less sound of its own. Well, that is the argument from some, and I understand it, whether it is completely realized or not.

Brad, can you give an example of what you think would be "musically consonant electronics" for the Magicos you have heard? And do you remember what Pass amps you heard with the Magico Ultimate?
 

PeterA

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They do. The Magico Ultimate 3 horn speaker. 16 ohms, 114db sensitivity.
Yes, indeed, they do have a very efficient speaker in their line up, but I wonder if this is not more of a bespoke offering. It is rarely ever discussed, rarely demoed, and I wonder how many they really sell. I would love to hear it one day.
 
May 30, 2010
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One line of argument is that when one hears Magico speakers, he is really hearing the upstream components. My opinion is that, at least on their higher end models perhaps more so than their lower priced lines, Magico is trying to make a speaker with little to no sound of its own. Perhaps impossible, but if they are approaching this, then one is hearing the cables, the connectors, the amp circuit, the inadequate power, etc. more so than the actual speaker. And the new M6, with its curved surfaces, supposedly has even less sound of its own. Well, that is the argument from some, and I understand it, whether it is completely realized or not.

Brad, can you give an example of what you think would be "musically consonant electronics" for the Magicos you have heard? And do you remember what Pass amps you heard with the Magico Ultimate?
Peter,
I don't think so. Speakers must have an intrinsic voicing, like all high-end electronics. When people objectively reduce some distortions and noise the sound quality becomes dominated by some others and then they have to voice elsewhere .

"No sound of their own " is simply marketing jargon since the old days, often repeated by reviewers. Sometimes we can get the idea Magico are just technology driven , I hope it is not. As far as I have interpreted Alon Wolf words Magico designs speakers that should mandatory measure well according to a set of objective parameters they consider relevant and than are voiced to their preferences under the condition that it does not perturb the target measurements.

The same argument that with some speakers we listen mainly to the upstream components was often used with electrostatics.

BTW, curved speakers is not a Magico novelty!
 

PeterA

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Dec 7, 2011
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Peter,
I don't think so. Speakers must have an intrinsic voicing, like all high-end electronics. When people objectively reduce some distortions and noise the sound quality becomes dominated by some others and then they have to voice elsewhere .

"No sound of their own " is simply marketing jargon since the old days, often repeated by reviewers. Sometimes we can get the idea Magico are just technology driven , I hope it is not. As far as I have interpreted Alon Wolf words Magico designs speakers that should mandatory measure well according to a set of objective parameters they consider relevant and than are voiced to their preferences under the condition that it does not perturb the target measurements.

The same argument that with some speakers we listen mainly to the upstream components was often used with electrostatics.

BTW, curved speakers is not a Magico novelty!
I never said curved speakers are a Magico novelty. I said I was looking forward to them producing a speaker with the curved front baffle of the Q series in the curved sidewalls of the S series. The Mini has that and the M Pro has that. I thought I was fairly explicit about that.

I’m also not saying the Magico speakers have no sound. That is an incorrect interpretation of what I wrote. I said it is one argument for what people are hearing. One of Magico's stated goals is to lower noise and distortion. That is clear.

I don’t have the experience of others here, but I’ve heard a fair number of speakers and in many cases it is more difficult to hear equipment changes with other brands than it is with some Magico speakers, at least in my opinion and in my experience. That tells me that I am listening to the upstream components’ influence on the sound. I’m sure I didn’t invent that notion. Nevertheless I have heard that comment or argument from others, and I agree with it.

In the end we tend to buy things that sound good to us or components that we think add as little coloration as possible to the sound.

It doesn’t sound like you have a very high opinion of reviewers.
 
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Kingsrule

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Feb 3, 2011
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When I replaced the M Projects with the M6, the first thing I said was the M6's just disappear. Do they sound similar? No. The M6
is significantly better. Quieter, more dynamic, micro details more defined. And the tweeter. To die for! As Alon said to me "its like a horn but better". And this was to be expected IMO. Are Magicos fussy? Yes. All the good stuff is. I have them toed out a lot more than Magico suggests. Every little nudge changes everything. Just getting the two level with each other is very significant. Haven't gone straight on yet. And I go back and forth on removing the pins on the MPods. Mostly pins in.
Do I think there is a family sound? Well I only have experience with the Q3 as well as my two M's. I haven't even seen a S or A model. So I'll only comment on my M's. The change between the two is more than an evolution. Its a revelation. Can't wait for the new M......

And, having the benefit of owning M6, I can try and read between the lines a bit better on the reviews. They are basically correct.
 

ack

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When I replaced the M Projects with the M6, the first thing I said was the M6's just disappear. Do they sound similar? No. The M6
is significantly better. Quieter, more dynamic, micro details more defined. And the tweeter. To die for! As Alon said to me "its like a horn but better". And this was to be expected IMO. Are Magicos fussy? Yes. All the good stuff is. I have them toed out a lot more than Magico suggests. Every little nudge changes everything. Just getting the two level with each other is very significant. Haven't gone straight on yet. And I go back and forth on removing the pins on the MPods. Mostly pins in.
Do I think there is a family sound? Well I only have experience with the Q3 as well as my two M's. I haven't even seen a S or A model. So I'll only comment on my M's. The change between the two is more than an evolution. Its a revelation. Can't wait for the new M......

And, having the benefit of owning M6, I can try and read between the lines a bit better on the reviews. They are basically correct.
What's the rest of your system?
 

Tango

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When I replaced the M Projects with the M6, the first thing I said was the M6's just disappear. Do they sound similar? No. The M6
is significantly better. Quieter, more dynamic, micro details more defined. And the tweeter. To die for! As Alon said to me "its like a horn but better". And this was to be expected IMO. Are Magicos fussy? Yes. All the good stuff is. I have them toed out a lot more than Magico suggests. Every little nudge changes everything. Just getting the two level with each other is very significant. Haven't gone straight on yet. And I go back and forth on removing the pins on the MPods. Mostly pins in.
Do I think there is a family sound? Well I only have experience with the Q3 as well as my two M's. I haven't even seen a S or A model. So I'll only comment on my M's. The change between the two is more than an evolution. Its a revelation. Can't wait for the new M......

And, having the benefit of owning M6, I can try and read between the lines a bit better on the reviews. They are basically correct.
Mr. Valin have talked a lot of Magico disappearing act since Mini II. Now the M6 as you commented has yet another class of disappearing act comparing to previous models. Do you think that this disappearing act of the M6 could possibly be a different presentation or a different "story telling or projection of sound" from the M Pro. I mean some previous models could just already completely disappear but they were telling or projecting a different story of sound? I ask this because when I play with carts some do tell story or present sound so very differently that make me feel as if my speakers were out of play even more, but actually the speakers disappear just as well as with other carts.

Just for a record. I have no bad attitude toward Magico. I have listened quite a few previous top models because my good friend is a distributor. I did enjoy them very much with the music he played for me. I only shake my head on Magico in the way they keep pumping out newest top models too often.
 

BlueFox

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Nov 8, 2013
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Nothing wrong with Magico’s release schedule. At least they are improving their product, not sitting on their butt.
 

XV-1

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Nothing wrong with Magico’s release schedule. At least they are improving their product, not sitting on their butt.
OTOH, why release a product that you are updating in a smallish amount of time. One could say it was released premature in the first place. No customer likes buying something for it to be superseded not long after buying.
 
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Tango

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Nothing wrong with Magico’s release schedule. At least they are improving their product, not sitting on their butt.
Yes, nothing is wrong. They do what they do. The people who buys into $300,000+ speakers just reflect how they feel. ;)
 

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