Mike perhaps you should hold back your opinion unitl you hear the Q5 in a decent sized room. At what is now $60k the Q5 should be a reference and subject to strict criticism. The problem is doing bass correctly is always a tough sell. My opinion is that bass drivers should not call attention to themselves. You should hear the insrument not the speaker. I find more elite speakers including the Q5 achieving that goal.
Reference Speakers to Audition
- Thread starter KeithR
- Start date
fair enough. you cannot get the full measure of anything at a show.
i did hear the Q-5 last year at CES in a very large room and was underwhelmed overall with that experience and so dismissed it as not a useful viewpoint. i liked the Q-5 much more at RMAF.
the comment in my above post regarding taste being partly a matter of what one considers possible comes to mind. the Q-5's rendition of an instrument when it is set up optimally may be correct......until you hear it with the added weight of a speaker capable of that but still possessing the precision. that's my point. and as i said; given the choice between precision and weight i'll take the precision.
as i said; given the choice between precision and weight i'll take the precision. I agree. It's always fun to hear room shaking bass. Synthesizers and organs can bring down the house. At the risk of being called an objectivist I think the Q5's modest but heavy foot print and petite bass drivers may have influenced some opinions.
Of course Mike you have far more long term exposure to reference equipment than I have.
Of course Mike you have far more long term exposure to reference equipment than I have.
Last edited:
Mike- thanks for the response and feedback on the Q5s. i think "taste" or "prerogative" as I mentioned is clearly at play in the high end---and certainly have no problem with it. i'm sure there were folks offended with MFs review, but I saw no problem at all with it. and the fact he was honest about it speaks volumes to his integrity, unlike a lot of reviewers.
i doubt that but who knows.
my feelings on this subject have more to do with my recent progress in my own system. after 6 years in this room, i've solved a number of room and signal path issues which have allowed the Evolutions to go to a place in bass performance i had not previously experienced. it has caused me to re-think where my reference is for bass performance. when i traveled to RMAF it was easy to hear what did not happen in the show systems.
would other speakers get me to where i am now in my room? i don't really know.
anyway; a year ago i would not have questioned the Q-5's bass performance in the same light as i do now.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
I think that one of the biggest potential areas of improvement for bass has to be the power system. I first discovered this when I tried the IsoTek Titan on the subwoofer amps of my speakers. Then, from what that Titan did, and re-designing the power supply, I developed subwoofer power interface cables that tighten up the tracking of the bass signal even more.
A shameless plug.... but Mike's got my power cables on his MM3's.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
True, many times, when doing demos in crappy sounding hotel rooms, I wished that I had brought two mini-monitors and a sub instead of a pair of full-range floor-standers. Audiophiles in Europe seem to accept the combination of monitor speakers + sub far more than audiophiles in the US. Any comments from our European/Asian members?
i know how 'radioactive' power cable claims are on this forum, but Gary's power cables, designed specifically for subwoofer power supplies, used on the subwoofer amps of my Evolution MM3's, did make a significant positive difference in my bass performance. it's not logical that a power cable would make the bass more linear, but it did.
Zu Audio updated their website today, which now includes this teaser:
http://www.zuaudio.com/store/dominance/
I recently obtained a pair of Zu Soul Superflys (I actually won them in their RMAF raffle, go me!) and I love the Zu house sound. I'm very curious to see what they manage to produce at a $40,000 price point.
TMM thanks- yes, i had heard a week ago or so that something was coming. i'm curious the drivers they will use. (hard to believe they would use the modified Eminence drivers in a 40k speaker)
Glad you scored those great looking Superflys....my Anthracite Def2s kick pretty well. my girlfriends favorite color is lime green, so maybe that is next
Glad you scored those great looking Superflys....my Anthracite Def2s kick pretty well. my girlfriends favorite color is lime green, so maybe that is next
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Hey MMM
Good to see you over hear and congrats on winning those speakers. I know they are good if Keith likes them
Asia here. Very true. It has a lot to do with average living space and wall construction (concrete or CHB as mandated by building codes).
Bill Demars
Well-Known Member
I might be biased as I carry these speakers, but the Acoustic Zen Crescendo's are one of the best speakers that I've heard. That's what prompted me to become a dealer after hearing the Triode Corporation of Japan 845SE with the Crescnedo's at RMAF last year. Very balanced sound with great dynamics and easy to drive. Awarded bass kings at RMAF 2009.
Brand new pair of Crescendos for sale in NY for $5K off list:
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?spkrfull&1295154057&/Acoustic-Zen-Crescendo-Speaker
On your list of speakers my preference would be for the Rockport Aquila followed by the Tad R1. It's a close one. I've listened to all the speakers on your list except the Magico Q5. The Maxx3 I found to have a bit more "sparkle" with very precise imaging, but I loved the overall presentation of the Rockports. Extremely good midrange, great texture in the bass, and overall to me sounds much more integrated and "live" versus all the other speakers. Some people I respect a lot love the Tad R1's but I listened to them in less than optimal conditions mated with Viola electronics which I did not think was a proper match for the TAD's. I listened to Rockports with Gryphon electronics and think Gryphon would be a much better match with the TADs.
In the end, I chose the Rockport Aquila for my own use mated with the Gryphon Mirage and Antileon Signature monoblocks.
In the end, I chose the Rockport Aquila for my own use mated with the Gryphon Mirage and Antileon Signature monoblocks.
Why won't line arrays work in your room? And what do you find complicated about them? Only thing about the Scaenas is they need two preamp outputs -- one goes to the array and another to the sub xover, but you could use splitters. And they are likely as more more efficient in terms of sound output than anything you list -- such is the nature of line arrays (and large panels, etc.)
If you are willing to try horns, the Oswalds Mill AC1 is a contender:
http://www.oswaldsmillaudio.com/Products/AC.html
Heard this at RMAF a couple of years ago and it was intoxicating.
http://www.oswaldsmillaudio.com/Products/AC.html
Heard this at RMAF a couple of years ago and it was intoxicating.
mulitiple speakers with multiple subs and active crossovers and separate amps for each part. that is complication to me.
you also need a lot of space ideally behind the speakers in my auditioning of line arrays---and i probably only have 3' or so tops unless i reconfigure my room---which has already had Rives treatment so dont want to do that.
they do create a wall of sound (i've heard the Pipes numerous times) that is very compelling. i'm sure the Scaenas are even better than the Nearfield line arrays.
I have heard the OMA AC2 and the OMA Mini Horns at the Mill and in my own home respectively. As it turns out and I have taken some heat for this here on the forum, I opted for OMA New Yorker Prototype horns speakers which I heard at the Mill before I took delivery. The production speakers should be out shortly. You do not need as much distance from the wall as you might think for these speakers. The New Yorkers are much smaller, with a different design and drivers than either the AC1 or AC2 speakers. They may well be more coherent from top to bottom than either of their larger kin. Additionally, I think that my speakers sound better. The speakers are exceptionally dynamic and efficient at 105 dB/1w/1m and I had to replace my amps with a 25 watt First Watt M2 power amp. Here is one of my new photos of the speakers along with my Nola LCR Reference speaker and Plasma TV:
The production speakers will not be finished like mine in the Cherry veneer and the black phaser (however, I believe that may be an option for an additional cost).
Rich
Last edited:
Similar threads
