Soulution 701 monoblocks and 711 stereo amplifier

[mep]

What the fox say?

I had a similar impression having owned the 710 and Dartzeel. I've heard them side by side in the same system. The 710 is more dynamic and can handle big orchestra with an iron fist. But the Dartzeel beats the 710 in every other category. I would say the 710 is more like an audio X-ray machine and the Dartzeel is more like a real music. But I think Krell smokes them both though.

Which Krell?

 

[dallasjustice]

Which Krell?

#80

Neutral and dynamic are the best descriptors for the 900e. Words like organic, sweet, beautiful and warm are Bar-B-Q sauce words in my vocabulary. In Texas, THE BEST Bar-B-Que joints don't offer sauces with the meat. It's discouraged because the meat stands on it's own. The meat doesn't need help from the sauce to cover up any weaknesses. That's the way I think about Krell. The 900e is so neutral, nothing else is needed. It is the music, no more. Of course , my experience is strictly using the YG Anat III speaker.

Btw, I really want to demo the new Krell iBias amps. I've tried and haven't heard back from my Krell dealer as to whether he will be sending me an iBias amp. I know he doesn't have them yet but I am a little suspicious.

 

[mick169]

Hello
what kind of preamp do you have with Krell 900e
Thanks

 

[morricab]

Really, comparing Soulution to Halcro? To quote a famous athlete from several years back "you cannot be serious". Time to come clean. What is the real reason for the constant Soulution bashing?

Simple for me. I live in Switzerland and have heard these amps now a number of times and found them to be lacking...something. They may be smooth and they may be transparent but they do not get tone colors right...giving a sort of drab grey where it should be vibrant. Soundstage is accurate but decay seems slightly truncated and despite what seems to be printed about these amps dynamics, especially micro, are lacking compared to better tube amps and even some other SS I have heard (The Edge NL reference being the best SS I have heard so far). To be fair they are not as fatiguing to listen to as I have heard from the Halcro and Spectral. The sound doesn't jump the way it should. I have heard them now with a number of speakers, a couple models of Magico, Thiel CS7.2, Eventus (don't remember the model but pretty big ones) and Focal. Wasn't as bad as Focal + Halcro I heard a couple of times but I cannot for the life of me figure out what the excitement is about with these amps because there is no excitement with these amps. I guess they are for truly analytical listeners who want tidy, well placed images, and outlines of instruments rather than the flesh and blood of the real thing. KR Audio is world's better sounding IMO and their new VA680 should be at the top of everyone here's list for audition.

 

[thedudeabides]

Sounds like potential system synergy issues.

I suspect Mr. Lavigne and other Dart owners may take issues with your second to last sentence.

 

[bonzo75]

Simple for me. I live in Switzerland and have heard these amps now a number of times and found them to be lacking...something. They may be smooth and they may be transparent but they do not get tone colors right...giving a sort of drab grey where it should be vibrant. Soundstage is accurate but decay seems slightly truncated and despite what seems to be printed about these amps dynamics, especially micro, are lacking compared to better tube amps and even some other SS I have heard (The Edge NL reference being the best SS I have heard so far). To be fair they are not as fatiguing to listen to as I have heard from the Halcro and Spectral. The sound doesn't jump the way it should. I have heard them now with a number of speakers, a couple models of Magico, Thiel CS7.2, Eventus (don't remember the model but pretty big ones) and Focal. Wasn't as bad as Focal + Halcro I heard a couple of times but I cannot for the life of me figure out what the excitement is about with these amps because there is no excitement with these amps. I guess they are for truly analytical listeners who want tidy, well placed images, and outlines of instruments rather than the flesh and blood of the real thing. KR Audio is world's better sounding IMO and their new VA680 should be at the top of everyone here's list for audition.

I think this is where one can calibrate with the ears of a guy on the net. I haven't heard the KR, but I know you like the NAT, Apogees, and Analysis Audio. I don't like the Soolution as well, for precisely the reasons you mentioned, they even managed to make verity Audio, the only box speaker I like, sound sterile (IMO).

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Sounds like potential system synergy issues.

I suspect Mr. Lavigne and other Dart owners may take issues with your second to last sentence.

you rang?

first of all, we dart owners are too busy listening to have issues. and my exposure to Solution would cause me to generally agree with his opinion, if not quite to the same degree. I'd put it more like Solution tends to be less lively and less tonally complex and less focused and delicate/refined than my ideal......but not in a negative sense.....just 'less' good by degrees.

second of all, morricab did include 'IMO' in his pronouncement so who are we to dispute a listening opinion.....he did not unconditionally 'anoint' it. I've heard the KR but it's never 'grabbed my attention'......but I've not ever had an extended listen. Edge NL Ref? as I recall; I liked the dart 108 ('a' vintage; pre-SCNP upgrade) better when i heard the Edge NL Ref 10 years ago. but certainly solid and competent for sure. of course; those were in different systems, the Edge NL Ref was at a show. so the value of that perception has it's limitations.

IMO. YMMV.

we all have our favorites.

 

[mcduman]

#80

Neutral and dynamic are the best descriptors for the 900e. Words like organic, sweet, beautiful and warm are Bar-B-Q sauce words in my vocabulary. In Texas, THE BEST Bar-B-Que joints don't offer sauces with the meat. It's discouraged because the meat stands on it's own. The meat doesn't need help from the sauce to cover up any weaknesses. That's the way I think about Krell. The 900e is so neutral, nothing else is needed. It is the music, no more. Of course , my experience is strictly using the YG Anat III speaker.

Btw, I really want to demo the new Krell iBias amps. I've tried and haven't heard back from my Krell dealer as to whether he will be sending me an iBias amp. I know he doesn't have them yet but I am a little suspicious.

I had Anat I's with Krell FBP 700cx and 202 preamps for a couple of years. I agree it was an amazing combinaiton. At no point in time did I hear the speakers as the source of sound. The walls melted and it was like magic. Then i I sold the krells after it was taken over by a private equity firm and could never drive the yg's to my full satisfaciton. then i let them go too which I regretted ever since. even at this moment.

 

[redsquare]

I am in total agreement with the Soulution criticism above. I auditioned it thinking they'd be amazing but it was so dry and lacking in musicality that I just walked out after 15 minutes. I gave them a few more chances but it was always the same story. I much preferred CH Precision from Switzerland as well, especially the new M1 mono amps, which are impossible to beat. Anybody thinking about Soulution MUST give CH a listen. It sounds far faster, more life-like and engaging. I did prefer Dartzeel over Soulution but found the Dartzeel too polite and lifeless - somewhat distant. I own a CH A1 amplifier but saving up for the M1.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I am in total agreement with the Soulution criticism above. I auditioned it thinking they'd be amazing but it was so dry and lacking in musicality that I just walked out after 15 minutes. I gave them a few more chances but it was always the same story. I much preferred CH Precision from Switzerland as well, especially the new M1 mono amps, which are impossible to beat. Anybody thinking about Soulution MUST give CH a listen. It sounds far faster, more life-like and engaging. I did prefer Dartzeel over Soulution but found the Dartzeel too polite and lifeless - somewhat distant. I own a CH A1 amplifier but saving up for the M1.

maybe your 87db, 4ohm (2.6 ohm min) Zellaton Grand's are not an ideal match for the dart 108 you had. not that it won't work, but it's not going to be at it's best on that speaker depending on the room and one's musical choices. there are other darTZeel amplifiers that would be a better match for that speaker. and if that dart 108 had not had the SCNP upgrade it would be an even worse match.

 

[MadFloyd]

I am in total agreement with the Soulution criticism above. I auditioned it thinking they'd be amazing but it was so dry and lacking in musicality that I just walked out after 15 minutes. I gave them a few more chances but it was always the same story. I much preferred CH Precision from Switzerland as well, especially the new M1 mono amps, which are impossible to beat. Anybody thinking about Soulution MUST give CH a listen. It sounds far faster, more life-like and engaging. I did prefer Dartzeel over Soulution but found the Dartzeel too polite and lifeless - somewhat distant. I own a CH A1 amplifier but saving up for the M1.

Which model Soulution? From what I've read the new generation is much different (warmer, more liquid) than the previous. It's also been touted as a product so good that it would appeal to everyone.

 

[mick169]

"warmer, more liquid " ???
711 based on new SMPS power supply will bring just more headaches
to the owners
So far found seven amps 710 refurbished after just 2-3 years in work ?
"Amazing build quality really", sealed modules, black painted PCB like made in China,
to HIDE masterwork ...
And more money as always

good luck with Soulution ...

 

[FrantzM]

Soulution bashing is full -tilt here ... Maybe time to take a serious look/listen at these electronics

 

[redsquare]

Mike - you're absolutely right about the Zellaton's but I also tried the Dart on my 96db Goldmund Dialogue's as well, and it just lacks the energy of CH. One can go either way based on tastes - but the grip and speed of CH appealed to me more.Â

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike - you're absolutely right about the Zellaton's but I also tried the Dart on my 96db Goldmund Dialogue's as well, and it just lacks the energy of CH. One can go either way based on tastes - but the grip and speed of CH appealed to me more.Â

did your dart 108 have the SCNP upgrade?

 

[microstrip]

Mike - you're absolutely right about the Zellaton's but I also tried the Dart on my 96db Goldmund Dialogue's as well, and it just lacks the energy of CH. One can go either way based on tastes - but the grip and speed of CH appealed to me more.Â

And what was the preamplifier? Although I can easily accept some amplifiers will have more "grip" than the DartZeel, I always felt it has plenty of "speed".

 

[microstrip]

Soulution bashing is full -tilt here ... Maybe time to take a serious look/listen at these electronics

Can we assume you have not looked at the price list?

 

[MadFloyd]

Can we assume you have not looked at the price list?

And the CH is not expensive? Or is it inexpensive like Dartzeel. Never heard of Zellatrons. I take it all these are European manufactured products?

 

[still-one]

Soulution bashing is full -tilt here ... Maybe time to take a serious look/listen at these electronics

I agree. The more a piece of gear is bashed is when in reality it probably sounds great.

 

[FrantzM]

Can we assume you have not looked at the price list?

Wrong assumption.

The thread is about Soulution, yet, at each opportunity many find a way to veer it into a DarTzeel one.. In other threads this would have been called "trolling", "hijacking" or even "crapping" .. Since Soulution adopts very different approach from the audiophile orthodoxy, namely switching power supplies and generous use of (local) Feedback, this seems to be accepted as fair game ... Reminds of some Magico threads in which all efforts is put forth to discredit the brand or their products .. In spite of this Magico is thriving and has become one of the most respected speakers in High End Audio.Many are acquiring them, replacing the former automatic goto brand. I would add that I have heard from people with taste similar to mine that the Soulution/Magico pairings are really great sounding affairs. Will hear such at a friend in NY very soon. (Early Jan 2015)