He kind of has to write things like this…as if there is actually some kind of new technology inside it…there is not. I am skeptical of the design choice of using a super high torque motor. How evenly that motor delivers the torque matters more than the raw grunt…the speed control of a DD is of paramount concern…how tight is tha regulation, how many layers? How does it measure the speed and how frequently? All the heavy metal casting is nice but without really proper speed regulation it is for naught. A high mass platter helps to smooth irregularity but has its own issues with energy storage and release.And this about the K3
" In many ways, the K3 reminds me of the Continuum Caliburn, from the international design team to the effective mix of science, art, and reach-for-the-stars innovation. However, 16 years later, the K3's turbocharged, precision performance blows the chrome doors off of the Caliburn, although it is still a great turntable and a classic design. Time marches on. Records spin round and round."
Analog Corner #314: OMA K3 turntable & Schröder tonearm Page 2
Atmospheric pressure maintains a special grade of viscous oil at bearing height within the pressurized inverted bearing upon which the 14", 30lb platter rides.www.stereophile.com
State of the industry - Roy Gregory Editorial
- Thread starter Elliot G.
- Start date
Did you read the article? "The K3 produced the best overall measurements I've encountered (figs.1 & 2), but not by large margins. " He does not need to write things like these at all, nor does he.
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Technologically. Call urn is at least as advanced. The thinking in resonance control was impressive and the motor, although belt drive, was also very advanced and expensive (the designer once told me that motor cost them $8K) with zero cogging and ultra low torque ripple.
At around 6:14 here J. Weiss says Fremer bought it. Thanks to Bill for sending the link to point this out
At 11:10 Weiss says it was marked for Mike L who had to cancel so he sent to Mike F
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But it would really suck if he thought he could get away with saying wrong stuff in a public setting where people record. And then Fremer would be furious if such a claim was incorrectly made.
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Jonathan plays the game weapon's free. no filter. but i agree that what he said could be right. but not quite bankably right. when Fremer provides clarity we will know.
and that's now 2 weeks ago, a lot might have changed since.
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imagine that. that Ked was playing games. if Jonathan even knows my name he would not admit it publicly.
I agree. Also that Weiss explains that he opted for the version with external power supply rather than integrated stand is expanding on the statement rather than throwaway.
That measurement is taken with a cell-phone app name 'PlatterSpeed' that is no longer available. (The domain name 'platterspeed.com' is for sale.)
You play a record with a 3150 Hz sine wave and hold the phone in front of a speaker. Wow is calculated according to DIN IEC 386. The app says the results have limited precisions due to the limited audio capabilities of the phone. Fremer has been using the app as authoritative for several years now. The graphics look nice. I believe the app was a Feickert product and it acknowledges that Adjust+ is more accurate. No information is available about the accuracy of Fremer's phone or calibration of the app. It can yield different results depending on the record used.
The measurements cited are not measurements taken directly from the platter.
Yes he mentions that: "Remember: The Platterspeed and shaknspin apps are not scientific devices; rather, they're intended to provide an informal baseline. I continue using them because the better turntables measure better, but neither does much more than take speed and wow and flutter averages over time."
Strange that it developed problems after such a short time. I have 40+ year old DDs that run perfectly, power supplies give accurate voltages and bearings flawless
I actually was a beta user for Adjust+ and have a pre-production copy of it. I know both Chris and the software developer. Works brilliantly but requires a bit of user training to get it right.
I see that now. First time I have read something like that from MF, although I have not read every one of his TT reviews. It's good that he includes that caveat.
Tim,
Words have clear meaning in science and also in audio science - I am not addressing a few magazines articles, but thousands of papers published in refereed publications and books by audio experts. I stick to such lexicon.
People are free to negate the traditional and respected use of words, creating a lot of confusion and trying to emerge as the creators of something new. As long as they do it in their system threads I will respect their wishes, only participating in them if I find their alternative perspective and language denigrates and misleads people about the more frequent current views.
BTW, "valid individual subjective opinion" in this context means an "individual subjective opinion" that was formulated in conditions that assure us that it was an independent opinion of the person.
Believe or not, audio has formal science behind it - did you read about the listening tests that Valdimir Lamm carried to validate his perceptual models?
You can surely disregard such aspects considering them as "forum nattering" - my hope is that the WBF members are really interested in discussing something other than just then saying their reference is real sound and else is secondary.
it is confirmed that Michael Fremer did, in fact, buy the K3.
congrats to Michael! good for him. and good for Jonathan Weiss too.
The good friend who owns the Caliburn never had problems, although I think he once carried an upgrade. But yes, change is part of the life of reviewers - readers want it.
One problem with these non scientific devices is that they provide very limited information and can not be used in a reliable way - I know that if the measurements are nice looking and we like turntable sound we are happy to see them. But will people be happy to know that the equivalent measurements of the $20k Technics SP-1000R are better?
Just MHO, but I prefer no measurements at all to "informal baseline" data. BTW, we had a thread about this subject sometime ago.
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