Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[wil]

Kris, can you share how your Modem/Router > Lan > iPad Remote is set up?

Is Wifi turned off on the iPad?
Is it connected to the same switch as your audio components or is it on another isolated
switch? (In my case, my audio switch is on Fiber Optic and my switch used for iPad is on
Copper.)

Independent of all that, this is the first I've heard of a tablet remote for Roon, TAS or any other player having any effect on audio quality.

 

[Kris]

Kris, can you share how your Modem/Router > Lan > iPad Remote is set up?

Is Wifi turned off on the iPad?
Is it connected to the same switch as your audio components or is it on another isolated
switch? (In my case, my audio switch is on Fiber Optic and my switch used for iPad is on
Copper.)

Independent of all that, this is the first I've heard of a tablet remote for Roon, TAS or any other player having any effect on audio quality.

Edgerouter is a wired router. This the brain of network

IT GOES LIKE THIS.

Optical Fibre from network provider (direct from their sever) 200 mbps.
None of the active switches on the way to my home. Zero. Just direct fibre.
- modem with pink faun ultra clock (2 rails from VINNIE ROSSI supply 5v and 12v) -
- Sablon ethernet copper
- router edgerouter ( no wifi is present) with pink faun ultra clock ( 2 rails DC4 5v and 12v)
- Sablon ethernet copper
- 1st Buffalo 2016 with pink faun clock ultra ( 2 rails DC4 5v and 12v)
- optical fibre Satrtech SFPs
-2nd Buffalo 2016 with pink faun ultra clock ( 2 rails DC4 5v and 12v)
- Extreme

there is side umbilical cord from edgerouter with pinkfaun network isolator that goes
with 8 cat cable to The Buffalo 2016 switch ( vinnie rossi supply)
and from there to external network card that is connected to my ipad.

on ipad everything is deinstalled that is possible , wifi off, sim off, BT off,
flight mode ON.

ALL DC are Mundorf silver gold wires.

I must say the Taiko Extreme really shines with this setup.

 

[steve williams]

Why changing the remote ( different ipads) influences so much the SQ of extreme?
unfortunate the better ipad the more controlled sound .
tested ipad pro v older ipad air . Pro is great,
What will be the best recommendation from Taiko Team as there are also Android ipads
I did not try ?
Is a general recommendation in that ?

You've totally got me on this one Kris

I'm mystified

 

[Kris]

You've totally got me on this one Kris

I'm mystified

I will test the android gears also in next few days as Edward mentioned it is better than the ipad.

Yes. I think there are more things like this that are waiting to be discovered.

 

[steve williams]

I will test the android gears also in next few days as Edward mentioned it is better than the ipad.

Yes. I think there are more things like this that are waiting to be discovered.

color me skeptical

 

[wil]

Edgerouter is a wired router. This the brain of network

IT GOES LIKE THIS.

Optical Fibre from network provider (direct from their sever) 200 mbps.
None of the active switches on the way to my home. Zero. Just direct fibre.
- modem with pink faun ultra clock (2 rails from VINNIE ROSSI supply 5v and 12v) -
- Sablon ethernet copper
- router edgerouter ( no wifi is present) with pink faun ultra clock ( 2 rails DC4 5v and 12v)
- Sablon ethernet copper
- 1st Buffalo 2016 with pink faun clock ultra ( 2 rails DC4 5v and 12v)
- optical fibre Satrtech SFPs
-2nd Buffalo 2016 with pink faun ultra clock ( 2 rails DC4 5v and 12v)
- Extreme

there is side umbilical cord from edgerouter with pinkfaun network isolator that goes
with 8 cat cable to The Buffalo 2016 switch ( vinnie rossi supply)
and from there to external network card that is connected to my ipad.

on ipad everything is deinstalled that is possible , wifi off, sim off, BT off,
flight mode ON.

ALL DC are Mundorf silver gold wires.

I must say the Taiko Extreme really shines with this setup.

So, if I understand, your iPad is isolated from everything audio? If that's the case, how can any noise generated by the iPad effect the audio signal? (I defer to anyone here who actually understands networking better than I!)

 

[MarkusBarkus]

And I thought I was cool with a dedicated/audio only fiber line for the Extreme.

But to clarify, we are speculating about WiFi traffic on the cables in the audio chain?

As opposed to over-air radiation from WiFi. Because those waves would still be all over my house. I have a separate copper ISP for all non-audio stuff, so I can see that "radio" as well as nearby neighbors.

 

[matthias]

But to clarify, we are speculating about WiFi traffic on the cables in the audio chain?

IIUC, in Kris' case there is zero wifi involved, so it is only about the network traffic from the iPad via wired ethernet which has some impact on SQ of the Extreme.

Matt

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...that the hygiene aspect is derived from zero wifi traffic/pollution on the lines *or* lack of over-air radiation. He still has traffic, but wired...

 

[wil]

If the network traffic to the iPad is isolated on a separate switch from the Extreme and other audio components, how is it effecting the audio?

 

[matthias]

If the network traffic to the iPad is isolated on a separate switch from the Extreme and other audio components, how is it effecting the audio?

At least there must be some impact as Kris reported that disconnecting the Extreme from the network sounded better and one iPad sounded differently to the other.

Matt

 

[dminches]

At least there must be some impact as Kris reported that disconnecting the Extreme from the network sounded better and one iPad sounded differently to the other.

Matt

I get why disconnecting the Extreme from the network would improve the sound. I am not so sure about the wifi.

However, from a practical standpoint, I am not going to shut down my wifi to listen to music. Being able to look at stuff on the web, at times, related to the recordings is part of the fun. I could connect my ipad via a wired connection but that would require running a long cable.

 

[cat6man]

I think there is a simple wifi independent answer here, at least to some of the variation.

The app is constantly communicating with the extreme to, for example, update the time elapsed bar. Having the app on different platforms, operating systems and/or communication paths can impact the traffic to/from the extreme to the app.

Can wifi vs. Wired differ, yes.
Can ios vs. Android differ, yes.
Will Emile & wilson work to reduce the impact of this, yes


Once you create the playlist, just turn the app off!!!!
(Or disconnect the network completely)

 

[wil]

I'm probably not aware of something very obvious to those who have a better understanding of Networking. So please indulge me:

If I have a wired copper lan from my router > "Switch A" > my iPad and
I have a wired fiber lan from same router > "Switch B" > Extreme

........how is network traffic coming through Switch A infecting the line on Switch B?

And how is the iPad remote communicating to the TAS software on the Extreme if they aren't connected?

Thanks

 

[cat6man]

I'm probably not aware of something very obvious to those who have a better understanding of Networking. So please indulge me:

If I have a wired copper lan from my router > "Switch A" > my iPad and
I have a wired fiber lan from same router > "Switch B" > Extreme

And how is the iPad remote communicating to the TAS software on the Extreme if they aren't connected?

Ipad to A to router to B to extreme is how the tas app communicates with the extreme

 

[wil]

Once you create the playlist, just turn the app off!!!!
(Or disconnect the network completely)

By buffering an entire album through TAS Batch play and then disconnecting the network cable, are we eliminating all network nasties or do they get saved in the buffer as well?

 

[cat6man]

By buffering an entire album through TAS Batch play and then disconnecting the network cable, are we eliminating all network nasties or do they get saved in the buffer as well?

I would hope so, and I don't think nasties are stored in the buffer.

However, I can imagine ways where disconnecting the cable is not sufficient. For example, what if the protocol tries to re-establish the lost network connection to the app? This would put processing load on the extreme. I don't know if this is a real scenario, since I'm not an expert at this stuff, but who knows what goes on in software when we're not looking?
Fortunately wilson *is*, I'm sure, looking at all this stuff, both in lms and the new taiko version that will replace it!

 

[darkfrank]

By using the Belkin lightning ethernet adapter, just press the slide button on your iphone to put it in sleep mode will also disconnect the belkin's power, which has the same effect of disconnecting the remote devices.

 

[wil]

I would hope so, and I don't think nasties are stored in the buffer.

However, I can imagine ways where disconnecting the cable is not sufficient. For example, what if the protocol tries to re-establish the lost network connection to the app? This would put processing load on the extreme. I don't know if this is a real scenario, since I'm not an expert at this stuff, but who knows what goes on in software when we're not looking?
Fortunately wilson *is*, I'm sure, looking at all this stuff, both in lms and the new taiko version that will replace it!

Is it possible in TAS to actually buffer an entire album (from Qobuz) and play back with the network disconnected? I tried this yesterday with no success.

 

[steve williams]

Guys, I have to tell you that for me, this thread is the best and most interesting thread here at WBF. I have learned a lot from all of you computer whizzes. However I have to say that the comment that the iPad one uses can and does affect the sound has me wondering where all of this is headed. Color me confused. I just don't get it and in my ignorance I just cannot buy into that suggestion. Have I done the experiments to corroborate your findings? No. Nor do I have any desire to do such. I just feel that this has taken this Taiko Audio thread beyond my comprehension or understanding and I have to say that for me there are bigger dragons to slay than trying to submit that there are sound changes with different iPad connections. My suggestion would be to sit down and listen to the music because you might find it to be spectacular regardless of the iPad you use. Just my $0.02 and YMMV and all the rest