TechDas Air Force One

[JackD201]

Rotfl!

At least Miyabi appears to have retired. That's one less on the wishlist. I'll just have to wait for a hand me down. I LOVE being the youngest in the family!

 

[Bill Hart]

Jack- what linestage are you running these days? Same question for Rockitman.
Pretty rarefied field you are playing in guys. That EMT is the bomb, never heard it. Looks very laboratory, circa 1963.

 

[JackD201]

I'm using a Lamm LP2D with the optional SUTs with the AFO and a customized Valvet Soulphono with 3 sets of silver toroid SUTs and 803s and 801s Telefunkens with the TW and its arms. Clearly I have a strong bias for both tubes and SUTs.

Jules is a genius. The EMT* is awesome. Iet is xtremely transparent and almost infinitely adjustable. Given the go ahead to mess around with it (with a promise that I could zero the settings afterwards) I managed to make an A90 sound like a Blue Lace. It comes with one line level input as a bonus. My brother found the look on my face hilarious. LOL. AFO and its arms and carts zapped my audio budget though so the Lamm sig or EMT will have to wait.

*Doesn't use SUTs

 

[JackD201]

Oh LINEstage!

I alternate between a L2 Reference and a hopped up Soulshine. I'm waiting for Lamm to come out with an all tube 2 box to bridge the gap between the LL2.1 and the LL1. Problem with the L2 is that it only has 3 inputs and a Tape Loop. With two phonostages, a server/DAC, a CDP and an SACD player, I'd need to use my 47 Labs switcher. Good as it is, the degradation of adding the switcher and more ICs is audible. ANother thing is the low .75 voltage output. Great for a single pair of amps but not for 2 of them run simultaneously which admittedly is not a common thing to do.

Having had the chance to use both the L2 and the LL2 with ML2.1s, the L2 was very sweet and clear but lacked dynamics. The LL2 was ballsy as heck but lacked the refinement of the big brother. Steve's LL1 has both. If only it didn't take up 4 rack spaces and had more inputs, I would have bought one a long time ago. I think the L2 Reference was really built specifically for the M1.2 Reference which has very low input sensitivity numbers compared to their tube amp brethren.

I am eyeing the line stage you are using now as well. In a sense our systems are slightly similar. My mid drivers are 100dB 8 ohms and all my electronics are Class A single ended ZNFB even my CDP albeit it is purely solid state. Not very forgiving of electronic hash or haze.

 

[rockitman]

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Does anyone know the exact dimensions width x depth of this special HRS platform for the techDas. I am trying to figure out if my active table platter 600 x 500 mm will support the TechDas with motor width wise ? I want to make sure the feet on both units are fully supported. I don't see an issue with the TT's feet, only with the motor.

 

[Bill Hart]

Does anyone know the exact dimensions width x depth of this special HRS platform for the techDas. I am trying to figure out if my active table platter 600 x 500 mm will support the TechDas with motor width wise ? I want to make sure the feet on both units are fully supported. I don't see an issue with the TT's feet, only with the motor.

Just call HRS. They are pretty informative - i have a bunch of their products, including the platform they build for the big Kuzma.
PS my impression, I may be wrong, is that they can custom build pretty much any size you need.

 

[stargate]

Does anyone know the exact dimensions width x depth of this special HRS platform for the techDas. I am trying to figure out if my active table platter 600 x 500 mm will support the TechDas with motor width wise ? I want to make sure the feet on both units are fully supported. I don't see an issue with the TT's feet, only with the motor.

On the HRS platform the dimensions--19 D-27-L....there are 4 feet on bottom the dimensions--20L--16D.....hope that helps..
the top platform of the HRS has swirly round carved out hole's, so that all feet of the turntable lays inside the swirly hole's including motor..
when one gets the AF the one- a beauty of a cover comes with it, and it fits snug on the HRS table..in smoke brown plexi....with two handles on it's side..and it's cut out for two tonearms also..

 

[rockitman]

On the HRS platform the dimensions--19 D-27-L....there are 4 feet on bottom the dimensions--20L--16D.....hope that helps..
the top platform of the HRS has swirly round carved out hole's, so that all feet of the turntable lays inside the swirly hole's including motor..
when one gets the AF the one- a beauty of a cover comes with it, and it fits snug on the HRS table..in smoke brown plexi....with two handles on it's side..and it's cut out for two tonearms also..

Looks like it might be a tight fit....if I don't use the HRS platform...my top plate dimensions are: 19.6" deep and 23.6" wide. I suppose if I use the HRS on top of my active isolation table it would work since the supporting feet of the HRS are within my platforms dimensions. I would prefer not having to use the HRS though.

 

[rockitman]

My other thought is to see if HRS will sell the top plate from the stand only. That way I could set it on top of my active platform and not have the hrs passive isolation messing with my active isolation.

 

[audioarcher]

My other thought is to see if HRS will sell the top plate from the stand only. That way I could set it on top of my active platform and not have the hrs passive isolation messing with my active isolation.

I would skip the HRS platform for the AF1. Having heard it on the HRS an then on a custom acrylic shelf I much preferred it on the acrylic shelf. On the HRS shelf the sound was duller and had less life. YMMV but I thought I'd put my 2 cents in.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I would skip the HRS platform for the AF1. Having heard it on the HRS an then on a custom acrylic shelf I much preferred it on the acrylic shelf. On the HRS shelf the sound was duller and had less life. YMMV but I thought I'd put my 2 cents in.

no surprise that the HRS platform would not be a 'plus' with a Tech Das with the air legs powered. combining a decoupling platform and air suspension would only compromise both. either prefer a solid rack surface to be optimal unless part of a complete engineered system (and now i see Christian inferred the same idea above).

 

[rockitman]

no surprise that the HRS platform would not be a 'plus' with a Tech Das with the air legs powered. combining a decoupling platform and air suspension would only compromise both. either prefer a solid rack surface to be optimal unless part of a complete engineered system (and now i see Christian inferred the same idea above).

Mike the legs are no longer air suspended. There are some type of silicone donuts now being used for vertical and horizontal isolation. They can be removed from the vertical for rigid coupling to a shelf. The first units had a manual air pump affair that no longer applies to the newer units. This is how I understand it any way.

 

[audioarcher]

I believe the version I heard was using the silicone donuts and not air suspension.

If you need a larger shelf you could have a piece of slate cut the right size for pretty cheap. If you don't like it your not out much. The HRS shelf for the AF1 is $9k to $10k I believe.

 

[rockitman]

I believe the version I heard was using the silicone donuts and not air suspension.

If you need a larger shelf you could have a piece of slate cut the right size for pretty cheap. If you don't like it your not out much. The HRS shelf for the AF1 is $9k to $10k I believe.

Yikes...i'm thinking it just might fit on my table stable. If not, I will get a larger plate made from aluminum billet.

 

[The Phantom]

My other thought is to see if HRS will sell the top plate from the stand only. That way I could set it on top of my active platform and not have the hrs passive isolation messing with my active isolation.

Hi everyone,
Just to clarify a few things I've read here..... The suspension on the AF-1 is a hybrid; i.e., it's a combination of a polymer gel AND air. The idea is to have the best damped isolation, with the adjustablity to fine-tune, if desired. Also, the HRS shelf in question is made specifically for the AF-1. I don't mean just the cutouts (which make it easy to postion the turntable and motor in proper alignment for belt tension), but in the shelf's dissipation characteristics tuned to complement that of the AF-1's suspension.

As to whether or not to use the HRS shelf, or any other, that's of course a personal choice. As in all things audio, there are options, and LOTS of opinions..! Personally, I'm not a fan of acrylic in any turntable application; even the optional acrylic top platter for the AF-1 would be my third recommendation out of three possible choices. (Aluminum being the first, and the default platter supplied. The other choice is a stainless steel beauty, but again - personal choices. Of course, with the ease of switching out the top platters while always retaining the main (stainless) sub-platter that comprises the vacuum chamber, the drive surface for the belt, and the main interial component) you can have more than one top platter on hand for mood changes....

Also, for those who are in the rumor link about the Phantom Elite, I will say that we expect to have these ready in about two or three months. And, if I do say so myself, the combination of the AF-1 and Elite is, well - the best I've ever heard, and I wasn't even expecting quite such a jump. The Elite shares a common heritage with the other Phantoms; however, the new designs involved have given the Elite , in my opinion, and at the risk of possible hyperbole, a huge leap forward in overall performance. Although it will be more pricey than the other arms, which remain in the lineup and which remain as benchmarks in (and even above) their price points, I think those who have heard the prototypes (two of them) will agree that this is the best one yet. (And if I do say so myself.....)

Regards to all... - Bob

 

[JackD201]

Hi Bob,

Just texted with your Graham dealer here George M. looks like my wait for the Elite will be longer than both of us thought.

 

[audioarcher]

Hi Bob, I'm not necessarily advocating acrylic as a shelf material. I just happened to prefer it in that comparison in that system. The HRS shelf may have won the day in another system with different conditions who knows.

 

[The Phantom]

Hi Bob,

Just texted with your Graham dealer here George M. looks like my wait for the Elite will be longer than both of us thought.

Sorry about the wait, but you know the saying, "excellence can't be rushed"... Or something like that. Besides the design improvements we manage to uncover, the next most important thing to me is quality and, as much as humanly possible, consistency in production. It does take time, after all.
And to "audioarcher", I agree - a lot of what we like is system-dependent, not to mention personal tastes and, occasionally, how well we slept the night before and/or what we had for breakfast that day... (We've all had THOSE days - you know, when things either sounded incredibly and surprisingly fantastic or strangely and frustratingly lifeless)... The weather, maybe?

 

[garylkoh]

Nishikawa-san, designer of the Air Force ONE, explains some of the intricacies of the design to an enthusiast. I will be with him for the next few hours..... so if anyone in WBF have questions, fire away.

 

[rockitman]

Nishikawa-san, designer of the Air Force ONE, explains some of the intricacies of the design to an enthusiast. I will be with him for the next few hours..... so if anyone in WBF have questions, fire away.

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Hi Gary,

What is his opinion of using the AF1 on an active isolation table like a Herz TS-140 as long as you go rigid on the vertical foot support ?