It begs the question of proximate cause:
Was it caused by the placement of the peel or failure to avoid it?
Was it caused by the placement of the peel or failure to avoid it?
This Corona Virus Mania is Just Too Much, We All Need to Chill!
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That is interesting and unfortunate because it means there will not be widespread, 15 min testing soon, if ever. Does the UK plan to develop their own kits as I think we are doing here in the US, or will they simply not test those with mild symptoms or those who are asymptomatic?
I read that the US wanted to develop their own test kits for more accuracy because some other tests did not meet their requirements. I have no idea if this is actually the case, but I can not help but notice that our Govt. have been roundly criticized for the long delays in developing these kits. Perhaps it is very challenging to do so. I don't really know what is going on, but many have reached conclusions about incompetency and are now calling for investigations. I think it is early for that.
I can't imagine the pressure our collective leaders and the medical community are facing during this challenge.
No. It was a reaction to a fake news story from a fake news site.
Day on day %age changes in deaths in UK
+5% -15% -65%
Too early to say whether we're peaking, shallowing the curve etc.
But I'll take this over the +25 to 30% that was happening until the middle of last week.
Main fly in the ointment could be potential spike in new infections...4 wks ago prior to UK semi-lockdown we had the Cheltenham Racing Festival, 250k young and old horse racing fans in close contact for 5 days.
And it takes 4 weeks for new infections to become symptomatic...
+5% -15% -65%
Too early to say whether we're peaking, shallowing the curve etc.
But I'll take this over the +25 to 30% that was happening until the middle of last week.
Main fly in the ointment could be potential spike in new infections...4 wks ago prior to UK semi-lockdown we had the Cheltenham Racing Festival, 250k young and old horse racing fans in close contact for 5 days.
And it takes 4 weeks for new infections to become symptomatic...
*** NOT ALL BIO-DESIGNED VIRUSES ARE MADE TO BE WEAPONS ***
They have also been the primary focus of gene therapy for awhile. I’m not familiar with the process but it probably starts with a wild type, such as a Coronavirus, then you need to make it target something specific, then you need it to evade the immune system as much as possible, and it must have useful DNA to inject that will have desire effects.
It takes no imagination to see how cv19 could be part of that process. But that doesn’t mean it is, just that it isn’t crazy to wonder - and maybe strongly.
Even if China did steal it (intellectual property isn’t something they do) that doesn’t specifically mean they were interested in weaponization. As @Al M has said, “there are much better choices.”
They have also been the primary focus of gene therapy for awhile. I’m not familiar with the process but it probably starts with a wild type, such as a Coronavirus, then you need to make it target something specific, then you need it to evade the immune system as much as possible, and it must have useful DNA to inject that will have desire effects.
It takes no imagination to see how cv19 could be part of that process. But that doesn’t mean it is, just that it isn’t crazy to wonder - and maybe strongly.
Even if China did steal it (intellectual property isn’t something they do) that doesn’t specifically mean they were interested in weaponization. As @Al M has said, “there are much better choices.”
While " fake news" is a "thing" it is a falsification made of whole cloth. Not just something you don't like or agree with. Designating something or its' source "fake" does not relieve one of the obligation to prove it so.
Assuming one wants to be taken seriously.
Anyone put a gun to your head to read a single post in this thread Keith? I’m not the one crapping.
david
Zerohedge has been discussed extensively on this forum. It is, by definition, a conspiracy website. Twitter has permanently banned Zerohedge for violating its rules on posting fake news. So this has nothing to do with me, or how I "feel" about Zerohedge.
https://www.businessinsider.com/who...that-spread-coronavirus-misinformation-2020-2
The theory the virus may have originated from the lab is certainly a conspiracy theory.
My posting that the US government may have sought to allow the virus to run it's course while denying it's existence is not? UK was all-in on the "herd-immunity" model at first, so why are my thoughts a "conspiracy theory political rant" while this is not? My theory is entirely plausible, at least as much as the virus coming from a lab.
In fact, both are plausible and I have no issue with the discussion of either... but IMO it's exceptionally biased for me to get a warning while allowing a discussion about the possibility the virus came from a CCP lab! This is a CLEAR double standard!
What is this bias? One thing is about the US government while the other is about the Chinese government, this is the double standard here and I object to moderation having a double standard.
Dear Keith,
You know I agree about our TOS provision which prohibits the discussion of politics on WBF. Of course this requires very subjective and difficult lines to be drawn. It is always a subjective analysis and a slippery slope.
Yes, sometimes there is snooty-snogging when a member writes an ostensibly non-political post knowing well that others will read it as having a political undertone or as having an embodied political message. This is not permissible, and, if detected, will be sanctioned.
Lines have to be drawn to enforce the ban on politics. These lines often are subjective. There is no getting around this reality. The ban attaches to political posts, but does not attach automatically to all discussions of non-audio current events. I don't think it is necessary to draw the line as narrowly as you are suggesting we draw it, especially on the topics of this particular thread at this particular time.
I truly did not consider my rhetorical question about whether it is a coincidence that the virus originated in the town with the virus lab to be political in any way. Simply discussing a particular country is not, to me, necessarily or inherently political. Of course such a discussion may devolve rapidly into an impermissible political discussion.
We have allowed discussions such as about virus preparedness by individual countries, and about actions taken to combat the virus, to proceed on this thread. Arguably, even those discussions have second order political undertones as they discuss individual countries and actions by the leaders of those countries, but as long as the discussions don't turn explicitly political and contentious we are allowing those discussions on this particular thread to proceed.
The ban on politics applies to all threads. However, I will concede that because of the intense focus presently by many members on virus topics and virus-related repercussions (medical, economic, financial, countries), and because more members seem to find solace and interest and outlet in this thread (as long as the medical information posted is accurate) than members who are annoyed by it, we have tended to allow people, on this particular thread, a wider berth than usual.
I appreciate that almost everything I have written in this post is subjective. Honorable and honest people will disagree with my thoughts here, and would draw differently the lines I have attempted to articulate here for this particular thread.
I assure you that Steve and I and the moderators try to be as fair and intellectually honest as possible about the application of the forum's ban on politics. Sometimes it might not seem that way, but the practical reality is that we are not monitoring the site every second of every hour, 24 hours per day. This is why we always welcome our attention being drawn to a particular post or to a particular discussion, either publicly on a thread or privately in a PM, if a member believes a particular post violates the ban on politics or is discourteous to himself/herself or to another member.
You know I agree about our TOS provision which prohibits the discussion of politics on WBF. Of course this requires very subjective and difficult lines to be drawn. It is always a subjective analysis and a slippery slope.
Yes, sometimes there is snooty-snogging when a member writes an ostensibly non-political post knowing well that others will read it as having a political undertone or as having an embodied political message. This is not permissible, and, if detected, will be sanctioned.
Lines have to be drawn to enforce the ban on politics. These lines often are subjective. There is no getting around this reality. The ban attaches to political posts, but does not attach automatically to all discussions of non-audio current events. I don't think it is necessary to draw the line as narrowly as you are suggesting we draw it, especially on the topics of this particular thread at this particular time.
I truly did not consider my rhetorical question about whether it is a coincidence that the virus originated in the town with the virus lab to be political in any way. Simply discussing a particular country is not, to me, necessarily or inherently political. Of course such a discussion may devolve rapidly into an impermissible political discussion.
We have allowed discussions such as about virus preparedness by individual countries, and about actions taken to combat the virus, to proceed on this thread. Arguably, even those discussions have second order political undertones as they discuss individual countries and actions by the leaders of those countries, but as long as the discussions don't turn explicitly political and contentious we are allowing those discussions on this particular thread to proceed.
The ban on politics applies to all threads. However, I will concede that because of the intense focus presently by many members on virus topics and virus-related repercussions (medical, economic, financial, countries), and because more members seem to find solace and interest and outlet in this thread (as long as the medical information posted is accurate) than members who are annoyed by it, we have tended to allow people, on this particular thread, a wider berth than usual.
I appreciate that almost everything I have written in this post is subjective. Honorable and honest people will disagree with my thoughts here, and would draw differently the lines I have attempted to articulate here for this particular thread.
I assure you that Steve and I and the moderators try to be as fair and intellectually honest as possible about the application of the forum's ban on politics. Sometimes it might not seem that way, but the practical reality is that we are not monitoring the site every second of every hour, 24 hours per day. This is why we always welcome our attention being drawn to a particular post or to a particular discussion, either publicly on a thread or privately in a PM, if a member believes a particular post violates the ban on politics or is discourteous to himself/herself or to another member.
And by the way, the second Zero Hedge article that was posted and which seems more reasonable:
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/all-trails-lead-back-wuhan-bio-lab
is sourced from National Review:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/coronavirus-china-trail-leading-back-to-wuhan-labs/
which arguably ranks as a more serious publication.
Respectfully, Dave, this relitigates our debate from yesterday. You and I unfortunately are not going to be able to reconcile our greatly divergent definitions and useage of the term "conspiracy theory."
More tentative good news from UK. New infections after crazy one day spike of 67% yesterday, has gone back to the figure of day before yesterday, which in itself was only a 5% increase on the day before.
Allied to a general decrease in deaths, incl a 65% drop today compared to yesterday's figure, and there is real cause for cautious optimism.
If any potential Cheltenham Racing Festival spike from 4 wks ago can not materialise in any overly negative way, then the next 2 weeks may bring a shallowing, then flattening, of the Covid curve here.
Leaving the govt w the decision on exit strategy.
And the Queen's message to the nation yesterday was spot on re tenor, and her underlying trust that our stoic, common sense and neighbourly nature, will get us thru this.
She's seen a lot, indeed w her sister first spoke to the country in 1940, aged 13, during WW2.
Allied to a general decrease in deaths, incl a 65% drop today compared to yesterday's figure, and there is real cause for cautious optimism.
If any potential Cheltenham Racing Festival spike from 4 wks ago can not materialise in any overly negative way, then the next 2 weeks may bring a shallowing, then flattening, of the Covid curve here.
Leaving the govt w the decision on exit strategy.
And the Queen's message to the nation yesterday was spot on re tenor, and her underlying trust that our stoic, common sense and neighbourly nature, will get us thru this.
She's seen a lot, indeed w her sister first spoke to the country in 1940, aged 13, during WW2.
New evidence Ron, which is why I quoted Peter's post. Lots of people consider the virus originating from a CCP lab to be a conspiracy theory, and this is undeniable. You can't have your own definition of conspiracy theory that is different from everyone else, then use it to apply biased moderation. Yesterday, you literally made up your own definition of conspiracy theory that is FAR different from common useage. Your logic here is badly flawed and it's painfully obvious this is caused by bias.
Here's a definition of conspiracy theory that comes up in google search using the terms "conspiracy theory definition"
a belief that some covert but influential organization is responsible for a circumstance or event.
merriam-webster dictionary:
Definition of conspiracy theory
: a theory that explains an event or set of circumstances as the result of a secret plot by usually powerful conspirators
So Ron, can you see how literally applying the definition of "conspiracy" is simply wrong and doesn't fit with common useage?
Can you see how the belief that CCP released the virus, knowingly or not, is by definition a conspiracy theory?
Look, this is FACT, and one of us is right and the other is wrong. This is not a matter of divergent opinion, it's a matter of improper definition of terms!
a belief that some covert but influential organization is responsible for a circumstance or event.
merriam-webster dictionary:
Definition of conspiracy theory
: a theory that explains an event or set of circumstances as the result of a secret plot by usually powerful conspirators
So Ron, can you see how literally applying the definition of "conspiracy" is simply wrong and doesn't fit with common useage?
Can you see how the belief that CCP released the virus, knowingly or not, is by definition a conspiracy theory?
Look, this is FACT, and one of us is right and the other is wrong. This is not a matter of divergent opinion, it's a matter of improper definition of terms!
Dave,
Words are useful only to the extent they help us distinguish certain things from other things. Please re-read my replies to you from yesterday. The definitions you just posted support my replies to you from yesterday.
I will not be responding further to this line of inquiry.
Words are useful only to the extent they help us distinguish certain things from other things. Please re-read my replies to you from yesterday. The definitions you just posted support my replies to you from yesterday.
I will not be responding further to this line of inquiry.
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Dave, I don’t know why your response quotes my post. I will say that there’s no evidence of which I am aware that shows the US government was denying the existence of the virus. I understand that some people do not think they are responding fast enough, nor early enough, but is anyone claiming they were denying the existence of the virus? I had not heard that before. On what do you base your claim?
I'm not going to reply to this as I've received an official warning not to post conspiracy theories.
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