Trinity DAC

[Elberoth]

It appears that a few people, imho, have a vested interest in pushing Trinity and will defend at all costs.

This thread was started by audio enthusiasts and audio enthusiasts are those who mainly contribute here. Neither me, nor Audiocrack have ever been dealers or distributors. Audiocrack was the first who ordered the DAC, and I have bought one much later, after I've learned about this DAC in this very thread.

There would have been be no need to mention you or your company (Audio Arts in New York), if you had not started posting here. First, when you were still the Trinity dealer, you seemed to love the Trinity much more than the CH you also carry:

The Trinity was all about natural reproduction - I've never heard a system so bloody honest before. Quite frankly, it took me a while to get it as it was a completely new sound for me. Swapping with the less expensive CH was instructive as it illuminated just how good the Trinity is. As excellent as the CH is, the Trinity was just more natural and dynamic sounding - more alive. The CH portrayed music differently, less dimensioned than the Trinity but still very very musical. One major point is that the Trinity sounds consistently amazing on all digital formats. 16/44 on it sounds better than all DSD dacs I've ever heard. In any event, it looks like it's only available in Hong Kong, Germany and New York City.

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=242832

However, as soon as you lost your distributon of Trinity gear, you love for Trinity was gone too. Overnight, CH became your preference !

I disagree. CH Precision sounded faster and more like real music when I demo'd it against Trinity

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=298011#post298011

I compared the Trinity to CH and CH is better to my ears. The Trinity is somewhat softer and more laid back while CH is much more dynamic and lifelike, especially with an X1, but still beautiful sounding. The Trinity put me to sleep after a while.

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12343-CH-Precision-D1&p=285316#post285316

So in your first post, the 'Trinity was just more natural and dynamic sounding - more alive', but in the next it was CH that 'sounded faster and more like real music'. How came 'The Trinity was able to put you to sleep after a while' if earlier you have claimed that the Trinity was 'more dynamic sounding - more alive' ?

One post contradicts the other. First you claim it was the Trinity that was more dynamic, only to claim sth opposite in your secend and third post, a few months later !

A mirracle ? No, it makes perfect sense if you realise, redsquare is a distributor that have just lost the Trinity brand !

But that was not enough for you. You started spreading false accusations about allaged 'reliability issues':

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=305558&viewfull=1#post305558

Then you had to added that 'Apparently Trinity had lost its UK distributor as well.... ' (probably not knowing, that they got Absolute Sounds instead in the UK - the biggest and best distributor over there - so a great move on Trinity's part; every manufacturer would want to have AS as their representative).

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=305559&viewfull=1#post305559

So, let's just see what other brands does redsquare mention on WBF (here you can find list of all redsquare's posts on WBF):

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/search.php?searchid=2559574&pp=

Zellaton, CH, Nagra, Stenhaim, Schnerzinger, Thoress. No other brands.

And who is the US distributor for those brands ... yes, you guessed, it is Audio Arts New York !

What is more, I'm almost 100% certain, that Gideon, aka redsquare here on WBF and the user elegy on AS and mover on Audiogon are one and the same persons. All tout only what Audio Arts sells and denigrate all other brands.

Gideon, and you are the one who dares to write about 'maliciousness (that) pervades in this industry but especially in this thread' ???? Really ???

Shame, shame on you Gideon !

 

[BruceD]

Great Post E!--yes I've spoken to the aforementioned gentleman at the shows--good demos--but struck me as bit of a "tricky dicky"

Your expose above tends to confirm such

Good sleuthing!

BruceD

 

[Audiocrack]

This thread was started by audio enthusiasts and audio enthusiasts are those who mainly contribute here. Neither me, nor Audiocrack have ever been dealers or distributors. Audiocrack was the first who ordered the DAC, and I have bought one much later, after I've learned about this DAC in this very thread.

There would have been be no need to mention you or your company (Audio Arts in New York), if you had not started posting here. First, when you were still the Trinity dealer, you seemed to love the Trinity much more than the CH you also carry:

The Trinity was all about natural reproduction - I've never heard a system so bloody honest before. Quite frankly, it took me a while to get it as it was a completely new sound for me. Swapping with the less expensive CH was instructive as it illuminated just how good the Trinity is. As excellent as the CH is, the Trinity was just more natural and dynamic sounding - more alive. The CH portrayed music differently, less dimensioned than the Trinity but still very very musical. One major point is that the Trinity sounds consistently amazing on all digital formats. 16/44 on it sounds better than all DSD dacs I've ever heard. In any event, it looks like it's only available in Hong Kong, Germany and New York City.

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=242832

However, as soon as you lost your distributon of Trinity gear, you love for Trinity was gone too. Overnight, CH became your preference !

I disagree. CH Precision sounded faster and more like real music when I demo'd it against Trinity

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=298011#post298011

I compared the Trinity to CH and CH is better to my ears. The Trinity is somewhat softer and more laid back while CH is much more dynamic and lifelike, especially with an X1, but still beautiful sounding. The Trinity put me to sleep after a while.

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12343-CH-Precision-D1&p=285316#post285316

So in your first post, the 'Trinity was just more natural and dynamic sounding - more alive', but in the next it was CH that 'sounded faster and more like real music'. How came 'The Trinity was able to put you to sleep after a while' if earlier you have claimed that the Trinity was 'more dynamic sounding - more alive' ?

One post contradicts the other. First you claim it was the Trinity that was more dynamic, only to claim sth opposite in your secend and third post, a few months later !

A mirracle ? No, it makes perfect sense if you realise, redsquare is a distributor that have just lost the Trinity brand !

But that was not enough for you. You started spreading false accusations about allaged 'reliability issues':

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=305558&viewfull=1#post305558

Then you had to added that 'Apparently Trinity had lost its UK distributor as well.... ' (probably not knowing, that they got Absolute Sounds instead in the UK - the biggest and best distributor over there - so a great move on Trinity's part; every manufacturer would want to have AS as their representative).

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?12023-Trinity-DAC&p=305559&viewfull=1#post305559

So, let's just see what other brands does redsquare mention on WBF (here you can find list of all redsquare's posts on WBF):

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/search.php?searchid=2559574&pp=

Zellaton, CH, Nagra, Stenhaim, Schnerzinger, Thoress. No other brands.

And who is the US distributor for those brands ... yes, you guessed, it is Audio Arts New York !

What is more, I'm almost 100% certain, that Gideon, aka redsquare here on WBF and the user elegy on AS and mover on Audiogon are one and the same persons. All tout only what Audio Arts sells and denigrate all other brands.

Gideon, and you are the one who dares to write about 'maliciousness (that) pervades in this industry but especially in this thread' ???? Really ???

Shame, shame on you Gideon !

This post speaks for itsself. Please keep in mind that I am holding back certain facts related to Gideon/redsquare that are pretty ugly indeed. I am sure if Gary would know about them, he would never have posted on this thread the way he did. All I want to add for the moment: claiming/suggesting that Adam and or I have some kind of - financial - interest in the Trinity brand is a trick so typical of a former lawyer. Gideon/redsquare is the only one who tries to double cross the readers of this thread.

 

[redsquare]

This is getting scary in here and now I understand why many people are leaving the forums. Like many here, imho, I am a client of Audioarts - and through the years, I've fallen in love with their brands and feel passionate about them, despite being outside the mainstream high end. They are definitely bringing something new to the table; What's wrong with that? Yes, at first I liked Trinity -and still do!! But I ended up leaning towards a different sound that I liked. Remember, we are audiophiles here! I'm in Chicago but we should all meet up at Audioarts for some listening and then grab a drink - as long as you're all stable...Time to bring it back to the equipment and away from all the smearing. I don't think it's fair to either Trinity or Audioarts.

 

[Elberoth]

People are leving forums because distributors like you pretend to be regular forum members, only to tout what they sell and denigrate all other brands.

Here are some more of your posts:

I currently own the CH D1 and C1 together. Before CH I owned DCS,MSB, Jadis, Goldmund and Audio Note dacs. The Swiss Made build quality is also better than anything out there. Really Swiss jewels and I love the display features. I think the DCS and MSB look cheap compared to CH

Man, I thought Stenheim was the best kept secret in audio (not anymore looks like... I have the Alumine full 3rd way set with a Nagra Jazz, CH Precision A1 amp and C1 dac streaming. Nothing can touch this - got rid of a complete FM Acoustics/Wilson system for this.

The TAS reviewer really nailed it though in terms of his description of the Goldmund sound and why it's dated.

He also did a factory visit of CH and said that Soulution gets its technology from CH - very interesting....

I compared MSB and DCS to Totaldac and also preferred the Totaldac but then compared to the CH Precision C1 and ultimately chose the CH.

Regarding the Allnic, it's that detail you describe that I did not like. However, I can understand why many would like the Allnic. But I found it's detail and lit up sound distracting whereas the Nagra had the better flow and musical message intact. The Nagra just sounds more refined to me with less information overload.

I've heard the Kronos and Air Force 1 but neither appealed to, with both coming across as just another table and nothing to write home about. In fact, I found the performance of each quite underwhelming. Just more hifi to my ears. My preference is for older tables like the Verdier, Lurne and Goldmund Reference. But the Sperling L1 is the first TT in years that lowered the noise floor to unprecedented levels. The way it retrieves micro details while preserving the musical message is beyond belief. And it does it in a very unspectacular/natural way.

The AF1 sounded very dynamic and quiet no doubt. But I found it The AF1 sounded very dynamic and quiet no doubt. I can see why some find it appealing. But I found it failing to convey musicality in the way that the Sperling does. And quite frankly, I don't think the Kronos can come close to either. The Sperling has depth and incisiveness that I've never heard before. . The Sperling has depth and incisiveness that I've never heard before.

(Sperling is another brand in Audio Arts distributon)

Do yourself a favor and don't get anything until you listen to CH Precision. It made the DCS sound incredibly sterile and lifeless....

Skip all the usual contenders and go for Zellaton - it's the only speaker you'll actually end up keeping. Nothing comes close.....

I am in total agreement with the Soulution criticism above. I auditioned it thinking they'd be amazing but it was so dry and lacking in musicality that I just walked out after 15 minutes. I gave them a few more chances but it was always the same story. I much preferred CH Precision from Switzerland as well, especially the new M1 mono amps, which are impossible to beat. Anybody thinking about Soulution MUST give CH a listen. It sounds far faster, more life-like and engaging. I did prefer Dartzeel over Soulution but found the Dartzeel too polite and lifeless - somewhat distant.

And from the times you were still the Trinity distributor:

I have never heard a phono stage more profound than Trinity.

In any event, yes, I am buying the Trinity but also keeping the CH for another home. I can't get the Trinity sound out of my head. Never heard anything this solid sounding before, especially on 16/44. You were all right; the Trinity is spectacular...

Do you want me to post more of your quotes from Audio Shark forum ? They are exactly the same.

 

[garylkoh]

It is scary in here. I shouldn't have opened my big mouth (or written) but we should transcend this and listen to the music. I'm not a friend of Gideon's and I don't know the background. But I am a friend of Michael Schwab (Zellaton loudspeakers) and Florian Cossy (CH Precision) - both brands represented by Gideon/Audio Arts and I met Gideon when I visited them at their CES room run by Gideon several years ago. Is it so bad to like a piece of gear, and then move on to the next like what redsquare has done?

I've had people like some of the stuff I design, and then move away, and we can still be friends. This should be a place of camaderie. Friendly banter about mine is bigger than yours is OK. Just don't have to hit me on the head with yours.

I think that the audio-groups on Facebook are so much better because no one can hide behind an avatar and a nom de guerre.

 

[Audiocrack]

It is scary in here. I shouldn't have opened my big mouth (or written) but we should transcend this and listen to the music. I'm not a friend of Gideon's and I don't know the background. But I am a friend of Michael Schwab (Zellaton loudspeakers) and Florian Cossy (CH Precision) - both brands represented by Gideon/Audio Arts and I met Gideon when I visited them at their CES room run by Gideon several years ago. Is it so bad to like a piece of gear, and then move on to the next like what redsquare has done?

I've had people like some of the stuff I design, and then move away, and we can still be friends. This should be a place of camaderie. Friendly banter about mine is bigger than yours is OK. Just don't have to hit me on the head with yours.

I think that the audio-groups on Facebook are so much better because no one can hide behind an avatar and a nom de guerre.

Off course it is not bad at all if a person favours one brand to the other and as a consequence trades in one audio component for another. Off course it is totally fine with me if people do not like Trinity or whatever audio brand I like. Off course we can still be friends after moving away, but that is not the point Adam and I are trying to make here Gary: Gideon/redsquare accuses people of being malicious while he is the one who is acting is in a malicious way by trying to hurt the Trinity (brand)name and busines as much as he can because he was sacked (for very valid reasons, I can assure you) as a distributor. That might be - to use your own words - scary but it is also something that we should expose so that everybody understands what is actually happening.

 

[Audiocrack]

Off course it is not bad at all if a person favours one brand to the other and as a consequence trades in one audio component for another. Off course it is totally fine with me if people do not like Trinity or whatever audio brand I like. Off course we can still be friends after moving away, but that is not the point Adam and I are trying to make here Gary: Gideon/redsquare accuses people of being malicious while he is the one who is acting is in a malicious way by trying to hurt the Trinity (brand)name and busines as much as he can because he was sacked (for very valid reasons, I can assure you) as a distributor. That might be - to use your own words - scary but it is also something that we should expose so that everybody understands what is actually happening.

And I forgot to mention: I am enjoying myself listening to my (upgraded) Genesis 1.1 loudspeakers while listening to the very fine ECM recording by Arianna Savall playing with her ensemble Hirundo Maris. Even 20 malicious Gideons can not take away my musical pleasure.??

 

[garylkoh]

And I forgot to mention: I am enjoying myself listening to my (upgraded) Genesis 1.1 loudspeakers while listening to the very fine ECM recording by Arianna Savall called Hirundo Maris. Even 20 malicious Gideons can not take away my musical pleasure.??

Fabulous! I have Arianna Savall in my library, but not Hirundo Maris. I'm putting Bella Terra on to play and buying Hirundo Maris. Thank you.

 

[Audiocrack]

Fabulous! I have Arianna Savall in my library, but not Hirundo Maris. I'm putting Bella Terra on to play and buying Hirundo Maris. Thank you.

My pleasure Gary. As you probably know Arianna is the daughter of Jordi Savall and Montserrat Figueras. Montserrat sadly passed away some time ago but has left us a beautiful musical legacy on the Alia Vox label. Most of the time beautiful music beautifully recorded. Arianne's voice resembles the (to my ears beautiful and haunting) voice of her mother.

 

[garylkoh]

My pleasure Gary. As you probably know Arianna is the daughter of Jordi Savall and Montserrat Figueras. Montserrat sadly passed away some time ago but has left us a beautiful musical legacy on the Alia Vox label. Most of the time beautiful music beautifully recorded. Arianne's voice resembles the (to my ears beautiful and haunting) voice of her mother.

I just downloaded Chants du Sud et du Nord (ECM) on 24/44.1. I assume that's what you mean. Playing now - it is gorgeous. Hirundo Maris is a quintet founded by Arianna Savall dedicated in memory of her mother. Thank you for the introduction. Do you also have Vox Cosmica (2014), and if you do, is it also good?

I was introduced to Jordi Savall and Montserrat Figueras and much early music by another Genesis owner and explored to their daughter Arianna. Fabulous voice indeed and a great harpist.

 

[Audiocrack]

I just downloaded Chants du Sud et du Nord (ECM) on 24/44.1. I assume that's what you mean. Playing now - it is gorgeous. Hirundo Maris is a quintet founded by Arianna Savall dedicated in memory of her mother. Thank you for the introduction. Do you also have Vox Cosmica (2014), and if you do, is it also good?

I was introduced to Jordi Savall and Montserrat Figueras and much early music by another Genesis owner and explored to their daughter Arianna. Fabulous voice indeed and a great harpist.

Sorry Gary but I indeed mixed up the title of the recording. I am not familiar with the other Arianne Savall recording you mentioned but I will surely look into it.

 

[spiritofmusic]

For the record, I have no opinion of Trinity, but I find this revelation of dealer interest really objectionable. The forums seem to be littered w/people who are designers/dealers etc.
Some like Atmasphere are v. transparent and he is fastidious in not criticising other brands/talking up his own stuff. No issue w/him.
Others like Miguel of Troy on A'gon makes his interest clear, and talks up his products no end not putting others down by name but by inference. Ok I guess, but pretty tedious.
Then there is Purite who is a dealer who is just plain snipey of anything he doesn't believe in/doesn't sell. Testing my patience.
And then worst of all, there are those who are tot non transparent, pretending to be regular customers that have changed allegiance purely based on listening experience. But are nothing of the sort.
Redsquare, are you going to defend y'self?

Btw, have you guys seen the initial details for the "Trinity Audio Delta Loudspeaker Project"? Looks fascinating.

 

[Audiocrack]

For the record, I have no opinion of Trinity, but I find this revelation of dealer interest really objectionable. The forums seem to be littered w/people who are designers/dealers etc.
Some like Atmasphere are v. transparent and he is fastidious in not criticising other brands/talking up his own stuff. No issue w/him.
Others like Miguel of Troy on A'gon makes his interest clear, and talks up his products no end not putting others down by name but by inference. Ok I guess, but pretty tedious.
Then there is Purite who is a dealer who is just plain snipey of anything he doesn't believe in/doesn't sell. Testing my patience.
And then worst of all, there are those who are tot non transparent, pretending to be regular customers that have changed allegiance purely based on listening experience. But are nothing of the sort.
Redsquare, are you going to defend y'self?

Btw, have you guys seen the initial details for the "Trinity Audio Delta Loudspeaker Project"? Looks fascinating.

Trinity speaker looks indeed very promising. Dietmar hopes it will be ready for the next Munich high end show. If that is indeed the case, Dietmar will rent a room - albeit not at the center at which the Munich high end show is organized - and will be demoing with a complete Trinity line, including the Trinity power amps.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Maybe I'll finally make the visit to Munich. I'm really intrigued by this speaker.

 

[Audiocrack]

Maybe I'll finally make the visit to Munich. I'm really intrigued by this speaker.

If you consider seriously I would advice you to contact Dietmar first. When I talked to him last week he had high hopes but was not 100% sure they would make it in time. I will visit the Munich show this year (as well) and will surely meet Dietmar. So as soon as I know more I will let it know through this forum.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Elberoth, now we're hopefully getting past the "reveal" of Redsquare/Gideon, maybe we can get back to Trinity SQ?
How is your Trinity DAC and Lampi 7 comparison making out?
Are there any issues comparing them since Trinity is pcm only and Lampi is dsd?

 

[Elberoth]

Elberoth, now we're hopefully getting past the "reveal" of Redsquare/Gideon, maybe we can get back to Trinity SQ?
How is your Trinity DAC and Lampi 7 comparison making out?
Are there any issues comparing them since Trinity is pcm only and Lampi is dsd?

I still didn't have the time to make a fair comparo. I also got some Vitus SM-011 monos to try, and speding my limited time to compare those with my MSB monos. I know that Audiocrack compred the two and liked his Trinity better, if that helps.

 

[Elberoth]

I just got a following email from a friend, who bought the TotalDAC cable on my advice to use with his Trinity DAC.

I put in a new totaldac USB cable yesterday and decided today to skip the Berkeley Alpha and go straight from the MacBook Pro to the Trinity.

At the same time, I have a loaner set of MIT cables including the top end speaker cables (MA-X-SHD) that I hooked up on Monday night.

I was told the speaker cables (with the huge network boxes) would require a minimum of 48 hours to break in.

Today the cumulative effect of the MIT speaker cables (96 hours), totaldac usb cable (24 hours), and going straight to the Trinity DAC USB input came together to bring a significant impact to the system sound quality.

The entire soundstage has expanded and is saturated with dense musical sound, with natural detail and transparency with no grunge.

I knew the totaldac USB cable was special when I first put it in last night, but the cumulative effect is extraordinary. It is the best sound I've ever had in my room.

I've been listening to music all night long. It is addictive.

I'm forcing myself to go to sleep only because I have meetings in the morning.

We shall see how things sound tomorrow night.

This does not tell us much, as he changed two cables at once, but next day, he sent me another email, where he was clear the improvement came from the TotalDAC USB cable not the MIT SCs:

I have now convinced myself that the addictive sound that's keeping me up late nights is from going direct to the USB Trinity connection and the totaldac USB cable. Not so much the MIT cables. I swapped out the MIT cables with a set of Argentos and the sound was just as if not more magical.

To me, the TotalDAC USB cable is a must to any Trinity owner.

For those who haven't heard about the filtered TotalDAC D1 USB cable, it looks like this (this is my system):

 

[wisnon]

I still didn't have the time to make a fair comparo. I also got some Vitus SM-011 monos to try, and speding my limited time to compare those with my MSB monos. I know that Audiocrack compred the two and liked his Trinity better, if that helps.

Yes, but even that is not comprehensive as the Lampi was not properly broken in, he used a stock MB Pro with USB generic printer cable and non-ideal grounding cables. Thus, he would have to say that its not yet a fair comparison. When he gets a proper Transport and has the right connections with real burn it, then he could give a definitive answer. He likes both anyway.