Good one , I realized that , i have changed the pictureThat is a 3050, not a 3060.
Good one , I realized that , i have changed the pictureThat is a 3050, not a 3060.
Noted. I just didn’t think the 2010 was anything special for the price. For me it’s SET!Cant say anything bad about Boulder , very good constructed never any problems
I have tested SS quite a bit Boulder was the best i ve tested .
I can imagine they would be go to amps with difficult speakers
Carlos, I certainly never said or hinted that his question was not valid, only his misstatements.Not sure why the original posters question was not valid. For those of us who used to design space electronics for a living, there is not much there.
Really? The 2010 was only a pre, no DAC.Had a 2010 pre/Dac back in the day. In truth. Great build quality very pretty but average sound. Don’t judge a book by the cover … or the internals. Listen and evaluate. That 2010 was enough Boulder for my lifetime.
Looking inside an amp is fun, but not very instructive. Given how few high-end components get sold and how much time is invested in designing them, the cost of parts isn't the only determinant of the cost of the product. Circuit design is ultimately responsible for the sound quality. You're better off with a super-quality engineer who takes their time to perfect the circuit than super-quality parts in a hasty, ill-considered design. And that super-engineer must be adequately compensated from the few products that are sold. Comparisons with heavily subsidized (i.e. money losing) industries like aerospace or defense are meaningless. Instead, we have audiophiles with incredibly deep pockets who are willing to subsidize (at their expense, not the engineer's) ridiculously high investments in the design of niche products. I've had great fun watching the development of the high end since I first picked up a Stereophile magazine in the 70s—it's just as much fun today. Just don't take it personally if you can't afford the best components.
I'm so glad you don't take it personally.If you have experience in product development, then you understand how costs are derived. How many of these high-end amplifiers go though HALT (Highly Accelerated Life Cycle Testing) during their development? Do they even under go any shock or vibration testing. I have led engineering design teams developing tools that work reliably at 200 degrees Celsius under extreme shock and vibration. In comparison to the design and development of space and downhole electronics, the design of these high-end electronics is child’s play and I’m qualified to state that the prices are ridiculous. Is not about if anyone is able to afford these components or not, it is about calling a spade a spade. If you don’t mind being a sucker, then bring in the clowns.
Take a look at my equipment. Several million dollars invested. Of course I don’t take it personal. List your equipment so that we can compare and contrast. Talk is cheap and hiding behind the keyboard is even more spineless.I'm so glad you don't take it personally.
@Carlos269 I am inclined to respect your stated experience and also your stated investment in both system electronics and space to house them. Why not put a $ number on what a ( just for an example ) statement audio amplifier *should* cost and how it should be built, while of course including support, sales volume, and overall business longevity factors?If you have experience in product development, then you understand how costs are derived. How many of these high-end amplifiers go though HALT (Highly Accelerated Life Cycle Testing) during their development? Do they even under go any shock or vibration testing. I have led engineering design teams developing tools that work reliably at 200 degrees Celsius under extreme shock and vibration. In comparison to the design and development of space and downhole electronics, the design of these high-end electronics is child’s play and I’m qualified to state that the prices are ridiculous. Is not about if anyone is able to afford these components or not, it is about calling a spade a spade. If you don’t mind being a sucker, then bring in the clowns.
@Carlos269 I am inclined to respect your stated experience and also your stated investment in both system electronics and space to house them. Why not put a $ number on what a ( just for an example ) statement audio amplifier *should* cost and how it should be built, while of course including support, sales volume, and overall business longevity factors?
This is not a challenge, although it could read that way, it is an interest to learn what you are suggesting is possible. I have dabbled only a little in diy and remain in awe of what I feel are the real innovators outside or on the fringe of the commercial audio realm, yet I also see the struggle for the business.
Thank you for your reply. Yes the ethics resonate with me deeply.I purchased a great number of my latest audio acquisitions from DIY’ers and custom builders and have come to the conclusion that this is where the real value is. I have some of these masterpieces that will put most manufacturers’ offerings to shame. I have both so I’m qualified to make that statement. No price or cost “should“ be placed or “set” on anything, but part of being an ethical engineer and business person is to price items fairly. I don’t know if you have an engineering degree, but when I got one of my degrees, in electrical engineering, I took a mandatory course in engineering ethics. Not sure if any of this resonates with you.
You're absolutely correct in that his title was quite innocuous and seemingly was teeing up a really interesting question worthy of exchanging ideas. But when the narrative devolves into:You obviously didn’t comprehend his post. Can I refer you back to the title of his post:
What can you learn from looking inside an amp ?
He is not looking to get criticized or chastised. He is simply asking a question. Which I think is a valid one.
“World class circuit implementation is worth paying for with value far beyond the material cost of the widgets.” This is the mentality that has resulted in the current prices in high-end audio. With a smile, they can see you coming.
But looking at this particular picture ( as a novice ) I would come to the conclusion that it’s mostly and empty box.. the power supply is not shielded. And besides some caps there seems not much to be seen ? Price for the components a few 100 dollars ?
... that would mean hifi is more akin to the world of watches than I would like it to be.
But looking at this particular picture ( as a novice ) I would come to the conclusion that it’s mostly and empty boxWell.. basically I was wondering what you can learn from looking inside an amp ?
picture included is just an example..
But looking at this particular picture ( as a novice ) I would come to the conclusion that it’s mostly and empty box.. the power supply is not shielded. And besides some caps there seems not much to be seen ? Price for the components a few 100 dollars ? Price for the box itself probably a 1000 dollars or more.. MSRP a bit more.. ofcourse R&D profits etc needed as well..
But really.. can you learn something from looking inside ? ???
View attachment 86082
Steve Williams Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator | Ron Resnick Site Co-Owner | Administrator | Julian (The Fixer) Website Build | Marketing Managersing |