High End Passion and Craftsmanship For Sure . . . But Also Occasionally High Cost and Unreliable?

[exupgh12]

Smaller manufacturers with bad reps are much less. Mostly because they just don't have the numbers. Their can be general distrust by those used to big manufacturers, that's all.

You might be mistaken. For example, during COVID, car manufacturers purchased a significant amount of DSPs, electric cables, and other components commonly used in audio production. Additionally, many suppliers faced production challenges of their own.

Consider the difficulty of sourcing titanium during a conflict involving the world’s largest titanium-producing countries. Or think about the challenges a manufacturer faces when one of their suppliers shuts down entirely.

Events like these have contributed to the delays in audio manufacturing that we experienced during the pandemic and, in some cases, continue to experience today.

This is total theory on your part, in reality it might not be this way. I can easily counter this with a small manufacturer can service a handful of customers he has sold directly to much more easily than they big manufacturer relying on a supply chain (which in hifi is never stable, dealers and distributors change quite a bit).

Maybe, do you want to tell this to dartzeel customers ?

Also, a small manufacturer making SETs type amps has point to point wiring so his products can easily be serviced as compared to big manufacturers who use PCBs or something proprietary. Small manufacturers who use established drivers (whether vintage like Altec or current like Scanspeak) can replace drivers much more easily than coffin box companies who ise so-called "proprietary innovations".

But does this small manufacturer only produce SET amplifiers? Perhaps they also manufacture DACs pre amplifiers or speakers, as many audio manufacturers do.

As you may know, most electrical braids were produced in Ukraine. When war broke out between Russia and Ukraine, the global supply of electrical braids was severely disrupted. This seemingly simple component caused significant setbacks, not just for the audio industry but also for many larger companies across various sectors.

 

[PeterA]

Its not worth it for them peter.
Imagine Panasonic can sell 300 million products a year priced at 500 dollars with a 10 % profit margin .
Thats 15 Billion USD.
These companies are run by shareholders who are in it for profit

Top SQ audioproducts are made by connoisseurs

That is a different topic.

 

[bonzo75]

You might be mistaken. For example, during COVID, car manufacturers purchased a significant amount of DSPs, electric cables, and other components commonly used in audio production. Additionally, many suppliers faced production challenges of their own.

Sorry - throughout i was referring to audio manufacturers only. Car scales are quite different in small and large

Maybe, do you want to tell this to dartzeel customers ?

I consider Dartzeel a well established brand with a global distribution chain. In UK they have Ricardo, possibly the most powerful global audio distributor. Small manufacturers are not just number of people but they are more bespoke, much lower units than Dartzeel, and usually no chain, so you buy direct

But does this small manufacturer only produce SET amplifiers? Perhaps they also manufacture DACs pre amplifiers or speakers, as many audio manufacturers do.

A small manufacturer will usually not have the financial strength to manufacture everything. The point to point wiring principle I mentioned applies to amps, preamps, dacs.

 

[Tandem]

Considering the AMS retip issue post as an example, yes the industry is following WBF as well as many others must do in order to monitor the need of the clients and to be sure to have a good image, so they should actually monitor more than just WBF.

As for the expense, that's also because of the knowledge and development time spent, with trials and errors and I feel that over the decades, companies needs to have more funds of themselves since market is getting tighter for everything but that would be considering all companies reacting the same way. Some put the price tag considering their own cost, some considering at which level of quality others people put their price tag. Expense can come from the parts but a big part of the expense also comes from the personal involved : good workers in this industry are quite expensive in order to develop good products and assemble them well. A company is down mostly to its management and personal.

Regarding the mad scientist, that's because we hope for somebody who knows his craft, comes with groundbreaking ideas or uncommon at least to offer a bit of his knowledge, in advance to what the mass consumer will offer at a decent price, ie without all the investors increasing the price tag. That's also because it existed for a long time in this domain and in some others and hope it'll still exist. Though, I feel like they usually tend to be very quiet unless they can actually follow the rythm asked, therefore, they work on orders only with a waiting list as despite being loving what they do, they're still quite rationnable.

Those who can't do that would be more of a startup going from a hype in my humble opinion. It takes a lot of thinking to design those apparels and make it neat. I think it's more likely the local shops that might end up with a lot of prototype to test than the reviewers. As for the gearing, with a lot of stuff nowadays able in second hand, it's easier than before to start with better testing units. Also, people wants reliability nowadays and care more for safe future investment than they did before.

The main issue with those startup is to identify who's really doing what and bringing which level of refinement, that's usually when this or those workers are leaving that problems tend to happen since the company started from them. Some try to hide it and find replacement calling it a bit like more of their own but that doesn't always work.

 

[Lee]

There was a prominent amplifier company that sold a few years ago six figure amplifiers and they kept failing bad. Often, even the fix failed. It was explained to me that the parts quality had variations that they had not accounted for. They redesigned the circuit and now it is stable.

 

[exupgh12]

Sorry - throughout i was referring to audio manufacturers only. Car scales are quite different in small and large

Large audio manufacturers include companies like Sony, Denon Marantz, and Pioneer.

In the high-end audio market, prominent brands include Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Clearaudio, Focal, Wilson Audio, KEF, MBL, Avantgarde, and possibly Magico. These companies operate on a much smaller scale compared to mainstream manufacturers.

Now, consider boutique audio brands such as Pilium, DeVore Fidelity, Ypsilon, Jadis, darTZeel, and CH Precision. How many employees do you think they have? Most of these manufacturers operate with no more than 10 to 20 employees, making them small-scale operations. This limited size is precisely what makes this industry so vulnerable to global supply chain disruptions.

I consider Dartzeel a well established brand with a global distribution chain. In UK they have Ricardo, possibly the most powerful global audio distributor. Small manufacturers are not just number of people but they are more bespoke, much lower units than Dartzeel, and usually no chain, so you buy direct

Certainly, but now that they are reportedly facing financial difficulties—an amount that wouldn’t trouble even a modest restaurant—let’s see what kind of support and value they can offer their customers.

Consider how difficult it is to obtain support for exotic products from brands like Thiel, Apogee, Fulton, VMPS, Mark Levinson, and many others that are no longer available on the market. Single-ended triode (SET) amplifiers are far from the only products in this category, highlighting the broader challenges of supporting niche audio equipment.

A small manufacturer will usually not have the financial strength to manufacture everything. The point to point wiring principle I mentioned applies to amps, preamps, dacs.

Would you consider companies like Aries Cerat, PS Audio, Burson Audio, Aqua Acoustic, Mola Mola, Cary Audio, Thrax, Block, or Audio Hungary to be “big” businesses? Most of these companies operate with fewer than 20 employees. They are small businesses with virtually no leverage over the supply chain manufacturers they rely on for parts.