High End Passion and Craftsmanship For Sure . . . But Also Occasionally High Cost and Unreliable?

[bonzo75]

Other audio manufacturers are still buying caps from Wilson so they must be doing something right. There may be some performance stats on the caps but I don't have that.

No one that I rate is

 

[Elliot G.]

No one that I rate is

LOL could it be dCS? hahaha

 

[gleeds]

Why is proprietary great and not a cost strategy only? What control does the end user have to understand the sonics of “proprietary “

Bonzo,

I represent several companies with "proprietary" tech, and I believe the proof is in the performance! Yes, it's hard to hear everything, especially products from more niche firms.

Dealers and manufacturers should also educate end-users on their technology and disclose as much information as possible without giving away their trade secrets. That said, we often overlook the critical importance of system synergy and focus solely on individual components and their proprietary assets. The professionals who can help audiophiles assemble a great system are the ones who matter most. Skills can only be learned through deep experience, hours of work, and a significant investment.

 

[treitz3]

Please read my posts on the thread it is quite clear

I did. Once again, what is your point?

All you had were questions and then one statement. Your point was.....?

Tom

 

[Lee]

No one that I rate is

Have you compared their caps to that of other manufacturers?

 

[PeterA]

Ron, what prompted this meditation?

I asked him the same question up the thread.

 

[PeterA]

Ron tries to atract more visitors to WBF .
More traffic .
This thread is coming somewhat out of left fiield but it seems to be working


I do miss the cable / filter threads with DDK .

Ron denied that in one of his posts. I guess you don’t believe his response.

 

[treitz3]

Geez. If this doesn't get on point soon?......

Tom

 

[microstrip]

Other audio manufacturers are still buying caps from Wilson so they must be doing something right. There may be some performance stats on the caps but I don't have that.

Lee,

As far as I know there are no interesting "performance stats" on capacitors.
Each type pf capacitor has sound signature. Some people will like it, others not so much.

Releasing limited information to consumers is a form of marketing used by all high-end manufacturers - it gives them antenna time. And we appreciate knowing what we are getting, even if we can't directly associate it with sound quality.

 

[bonzo75]

LOL could it be dCS? hahaha

On cue, because it reminded me of thread he had started for dCS to use CH precision transport to be the best.
Thread 'Why doesn’t dCS partner with CH Precision for transports?'
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...rtner-with-ch-precision-for-transports.37258/

Now the 2 million dollar speaker her wanted can use Wilson’s capacitors

 

[bonzo75]

Bonzo,

I represent several companies with "proprietary" tech, and I believe the proof is in the performance! Yes, it's hard to hear everything, especially products from more niche firms.

Dealers and manufacturers should also educate end-users on their technology and disclose as much information as possible without giving away their trade secrets. That said, we often overlook the critical importance of system synergy and focus solely on individual components and their proprietary assets. The professionals who can help audiophiles assemble a great system are the ones who matter most. Skills can only be learned through deep experience, hours of work, and a significant investment.

No one is overlooking system synergy. The OP said that big manufacturers with higher prices probably use higher quality components. I pointed out that they either don’t, many are “proprietary”, and/or the user does not know what components go into the big name he is paying for. While Magico is being transparent they are using Mundorf caps, Lee jumped in that Wilson is using “proprietary “ (I guess we have to assume that is high quality). Plus they are potted as Tima pointed out. Can only assume the pot contains excellent quality given the high retail of the big box, rather than what I think a pot usually contains

In terms of sonic performance, my thoughts on Wilson are quite clear

 

[tima]

Lee jumped in that Wilson is using “proprietary “ (I guess we have to assume that is high quality).

Wilson makes their own caps. They bought a Swiss company named Reliable Capacitors that had been making caps for Wilson. Now production is in Provo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dk2WwV-znl4

Reliable Capacitors

Often you can open the crossover or component and see whose caps are in use. Wilson crossovers are potted so no view.

Edit:

I like these

V-Cap CuTF Copper Foil Capacitors | Fluoropolymer Film Audio Capacitors

V-Cap Copper Foil capacitors with fluoropolymer film, for use in speaker crossovers, interstage coupling, output coupling, bypassing, and guitars

www.v-cap.com

Attached pdf of 21 Capacitors Shoot-Out (2006). xlated from Chinese

 

[bonzo75]

Often you can open the crossover or component and see whose caps are in use. Wilson crossovers are potted so no view.

Many companies you can’t open the crossover so you can’t see what it is in. you will have full transparency with a small manufacturer

 

[hopkins]

Many companies you can’t open the crossover so you can’t see what it is in. you will have full transparency with a small manufacturer

Big or small, any company that comes up with proprietary technology will want to protect it. Unfortunately, the cost of patenting is quite high, not to mention litigation, which introduces a disadvantage for small companies.

 

[Geardaddy]

I asked him the same question up the thread.

You I saw that.....but I was mildly curious. things are still open ended which is fine.

I asked him the same question up the thread.

I asked him the same question up the thread.

I saw that and maybe I breezed over his answer, but I didn’t see one.

 

[Geardaddy]

The OP said that big manufacturers with higher prices probably use higher quality components. I pointed out that they either don’t, many are “proprietary”, and/or the user does not know what components go into the big name he is paying for…..

Very true. The emperor often has no clothes.

 

[Lee]

On cue, because it reminded me of thread he had started for dCS to use CH precision transport to be the best.
Thread 'Why doesn’t dCS partner with CH Precision for transports?'
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/why-doesn’t-dcs-partner-with-ch-precision-for-transports.37258/

Now the 2 million dollar speaker her wanted can use Wilson’s capacitors

Don’t blame me for you being too stupid to understand a coopetition idea.

 

[Lee]

Wilson makes their own caps. They bought a Swiss company named Reliable Capacitors that had been making caps for Wilson. Now production is in Provo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dk2WwV-znl4

Reliable Capacitors

Often you can open the crossover or component and see whose caps are in use. Wilson crossovers are potted so no view.

Edit:

I like these

V-Cap CuTF Copper Foil Capacitors | Fluoropolymer Film Audio Capacitors

V-Cap Copper Foil capacitors with fluoropolymer film, for use in speaker crossovers, interstage coupling, output coupling, bypassing, and guitars

www.v-cap.com

Attached pdf of 21 Capacitors Shoot-Out (2006). xlated from Chinese

Lee,

As far as I know there are no interesting "performance stats" on capacitors.
Each type pf capacitor has sound signature. Some people will like it, others not so much.

Releasing limited information to consumers is a form of marketing used by all high-end manufacturers - it gives them antenna time. And we appreciate knowing what we are getting, even if we can't directly associate it with sound quality.

Microstrip, looks like Tim provided your answer as the AudioCapX says they are better on an ESR basis, or Equivalent Series resistance.

*******
Our newly named AudioCapX line capacitors (formerly known as MultiCap™ developed by Richard Marsh) are uniquely and produced on proprietary machines which are exclusively owned and operated by Reliable Capacitors. This multiple section design significantly reduces typical capacitors losses and overall inductance, setting an industry standard. Measured Equivalent Series Resistance (ESR) values are 5 to 10 times lower than conventional capacitors. This exclusive design also solves the problems of multiple resonances encountered when a circuit’s high-frequency impedance is lowered by externally paralleling a large, conventionally wound capacitor with smaller ones, as in typical bypass designs. AudioCapX capacitors are ideal for high-current, high-speed, pulsed applications. New and exciting innovations are continuing to be developed that will meet the most exacting audio and video specifications. Capacitors in this line are available in:

• metalized polypropylene (PPMFX)
• polystyrene (RTX)
• polypropylene and tin (PPFXS)
• polypropylene and aluminum (PPFX)

 

[Rob181]

Our newly named AudioCapX line capacitors (formerly known as MultiCap™ developed by Richard Marsh) are uniquely and produced on proprietary machines which are exclusively owned and operated by Reliable Capacitors. This multiple section design significantly reduces typical capacitors losses and overall inductance, setting an industry standard. Measured Equivalent Series Resistance (ESR) values are 5 to 10 times lower than conventional capacitors. This exclusive design also solves the problems of multiple resonances encountered when a circuit’s high-frequency impedance is lowered by externally paralleling a large, conventionally wound capacitor with smaller ones, as in typical bypass designs. AudioCapX capacitors are ideal for high-current, high-speed, pulsed applications. New and exciting innovations are continuing to be developed that will meet the most exacting audio and video specifications.

Nothing more than "wordy words".

The complete lack of any comparative data testing to validate the claims translates to nothing more than marketing spin...

 

[andromedaaudio]

Have you compared their caps to that of other manufacturers?

I thought you were ( at least should be ) a completely objective reviewer .
Instead now im more and more inclined to think you re a sales rep for a couple of companies