Magico M7 2023

[sbnx]

do you know whether he exclusively used analog, or also used CD/digital references? did he bring his own vinyl pressings?

Stirling uses digital to setup speakers and then uses records to setup the TT.

This part is for Ked.

Obviously, back in the day, before digital the two were combined and could not be separated. Today, we can separate the two. One has to listen to the TT through the speakers. combining the two is frought with error. Let me illustrate. We all know that the speakers should be setup to provide a solid central image on recordings such as vocals. This can be easily modulated by speaker position. The analog guys also know that the cartridge setup can alter the central image as well as it is reading the left and right channel out of the same groove. If one has a TT and uses that to setup speakers and they have the image pulled left then how do they know whether the speakers or the cartrige needs to be adjusted. These would be two very different things.

 

[sbnx]

So someone who use both analog and digital should change the speaker placement and/or listening position when they listen to one or the other? This is ridiculous.

You don't have to do this. The digital is likely the noisier source. Once you ajust for the quieter source (likely analog) then the noisier source fits in.

 

[hopkins]

You don't have to do this. The digital is likely the noisier source. Once you ajust for the quieter source (likely analog) then the noisier source fits in.

There are separate threads for spewing misconceptions about analog versus digital.

 

[sbnx]

Which misconception are you referring?

 

[hopkins]

Which misconception are you referring?

Perhaps I misunderstood, but how would noise level be of any relevance in speaker placement?

Vis à vis channel imbalance of cartridges, correct me if I'm wrong, but most "advanced" vinyl enthusiasts here use several cartridges, tonearms, or even turntables. So do they move the speakers around according to which one they use?

 

[sbnx]

Perhaps I misunderstood, but how would noise level be of any relevance in speaker placement?

Vis à vis channel imbalance of cartridges, correct me if I'm wrong, but most "advanced" vinyl enthusiasts here use several cartridges, tonearms, or even turntables. So do they move the speakers around according to which one they use?

First, I would like to be clear. Nobody is going to advocate for changing speaker or seating placement based on which source a person listens to on any given day.

I am also not a TT person. Ultimately, that is because I don't have the desire to get up and change records that frequently. I have heard TT's and digital in the same system and my experience is that on well recorded material the background is darker and there is more tonal saturation. I firmly believe the absence of this on digital is due to noise. Why do I believe this? Because every time I do something to the digital components -- streamer, dac, cables -- that eliminates noise the background gets darker and there is more tonal saturation. The music gains body. These observations aren't only my components but components in other people's systems that I have removed noise from.

In my experience noise effects speaker positioning in a big way. This is basically for the reason (and more) that I expressed above. If I have a digital source that is extremely noisy then that is going to cause the pitch to be higher which in turn means I will have to adjust the placement of the midrange and tweeter relative to my ear to get a proper balance. If I remove all of this noise then the pitch drops and things will become clearer. I would need to adjust for this change. For clarity, I am not talking about moving the speaker inches but rather milimeter(s) and less.

If someone doesn't buy into the fact the micro adjustments to speakers matter then the discussion above is moot.

This discussion should be moved to one of the other threads if it is to be continued. It only has to do with the M7 in that the M7 will have to be positioned in a room just like any other. I guess we ended up down the rabbit hole since someone took issue the Peter using digital files to adjust the owner's speakers.

 

[hopkins]

First, I would like to be clear. Nobody is going to advocate for changing speaker or seating placement based on which source a person listens to on any given day.

I am also not a TT person. Ultimately, that is because I don't have the desire to get up and change records that frequently. I have heard TT's and digital in the same system and my experience is that on well recorded material the background is darker and there is more tonal saturation. I firmly believe the absence of this on digital is due to noise. Why do I believe this? Because every time I do something to the digital components -- streamer, dac, cables -- that eliminates noise the background gets darker and there is more tonal saturation. The music gains body. These observations aren't only my components but components in other people's systems that I have removed noise from.

In my experience noise effects speaker positioning in a big way. This is basically for the reason (and more) that I expressed above. If I have a digital source that is extremely noisy then that is going to cause the pitch to be higher which in turn means I will have to adjust the placement of the midrange and tweeter relative to my ear to get a proper balance. If I remove all of this noise then the pitch drops and things will become clearer. I would need to adjust for this change. For clarity, I am not talking about moving the speaker inches but rather milimeter(s) and less.

If someone doesn't buy into the fact the micro adjustments to speakers matter then the discussion above is moot.

This discussion should be moved to one of the other threads if it is to be continued. It only has to do with the M7 in that the M7 will have to be positioned in a room just like any other. I guess we ended up down the rabbit hole since someone took issue the Peter using digital files to adjust the owner's speakers.

I could see how changes in some components (ex: amplification) could have an effect on tonal balance (ex: bass) and lead to reconsider placement - In my mind this is something different than "noise", but no need to discuss it further, I understand your point of view and I agree, all this is unrelated to the thread's topic.