Martin Logan Renaissance 15a
- Thread starter Gregadd
- Start date
G'day maties,
Trust all are keeping well and you're all enjoying those fine tunes!
I just had an outstanding audition on the Ren15a's and must report, as I've titled these elsewhere as "the formidable Ren15a." I'll explain the formidable in my closing comments.
Why I'm so excited about this particular setup is that the room is nearly exactly as ours! An open plan living room design, which includes a full space of approx. 35ft L × 45ft wide & 10ft high ceilings. This particular room has a dedicated space just for the audio system (exactly as ours), then approx 10ft after the dinning area along with the kitchen towards the back, and extra office space towards the far right. Whereas, with our room it's nearly similar, system in dedicated space alongside long wall facing width, then about 15ft after the dinning area, with office space on far left, and our kitchen located on the far right.
The beauty of these two very similar room layouts, is the open plan that allows the system to breathe freely and not get congested in any way whatsoever. No overhang, no boom, nothing echoes, just crystal clear tunes in full spec.
His system comprises:
Preamp- VAC pre
Power amps- VAC 200w monoblocks
Digital gear- Esoteric K05XS
Analog rig, TT- Rega RP10 (with Sound Smith cart).
Phono-preamp: Allnic (tube phonostage).
Speakers: ML Ren15a
Cables & interconnects- full loom of Nordost Frey2 and Tyr2 cables.
So it was very exciting to audition this, since nearly every aspect of the system was pretty much similar to mine! The only difference being the ML hybrid stats. To cut a long long story short... the main reason was the owner was wanting this particular CD (attached pic) and it wasn't available any longer. Merely because it's on a FIM label, and since FIM closed up, these ones are very rare. So he got in touch and the rest is history in the making.
I took along this CD and the opening track on Bolera was superb! Then came the second track and even better with superb bass lines. Those first notes on the percussion marching tune then later picks up in full swing, followed by some serious bass lines on track 2, is just outstanding!
Obviously the LF is deeper than the stat panel on the CLX's but both provide plenty of LF detail.
The controls on the back panel of the Ren15a's do help by a significant margin, to fine/tune balance out the LF response. Otherwise the LF thump can be overbearing, and that is something you don't want especially in an open plan layout.
Later during the evening, he made a trip back to our place and as you can tell from the time, left only around 4am. We were quite mesmerised by the overall presentation of the CLX's without subs or any other added LF devices... although the bass wasn't as deep as the dual 15inch drivers in the Ren15a's (Obviously not) the overall speed and agility in the bass was what kept us fully engaged. When a particular LF note is called upon, it hammers down well deep enough with precision and bullet speed. This is something I miss from large cones, the physics is obviously different. OTOH, smaller drivers like those with 8inch towers would be able to deliver better speed. When tuned in correctly with the perfect blend of crossover units and DSP, it actually sounds marvellous! Why I term them as "formidable" is simply due to the fact that the Ren15a's are capable of some serious wallop! In just about the right room size, they are truly awesome. You really don't require the Neoliths unless you had a very large room. So I would be looking at something much larger than 40ft L & 50ft going across, probably 10ft ceilings would be fine but definitely much larger space. The Neoliths need serious space to breathe, I seriously don't think dedicated listening rooms would do it, rather larger halls and open plans suit these huge stats. The ones I audition in Spore driven with CJ's ART150 are setup in this way, and they're awe-inspiring.
So we really enjoyed both listening sessions, I was in awe of those fine VAC monoblocks. They have a cool feature with their output tubes. If one's going weak or bad, that particular tube LED lights up, stating it's ready for a change. That's extra circuitry I guess that CJ simply doesn't want to divulge in. They always keep their circuits as simple as possible using the highest quality parts available. I guess they have their reasons.
Anyway, it was a real pleasure to experience another ML stat system placed in an open plan living room with perfect acoustic balance, where the musical presence is fully engaging and you are totally immersed in the performance. I guess that's why I was over there till about 9pm, and he spent upto 4am over here.
Since the rest of the household was asleep, we really didn't even open up the levels that much, goes to show you can still enjoy the music with a perfect sense of balance, just like focusing a camera lense.
Cheers maties, a big woofty woof!!!
Enjoy those fine tunes!
RJ
Trust all are keeping well and you're all enjoying those fine tunes!
I just had an outstanding audition on the Ren15a's and must report, as I've titled these elsewhere as "the formidable Ren15a." I'll explain the formidable in my closing comments.
Why I'm so excited about this particular setup is that the room is nearly exactly as ours! An open plan living room design, which includes a full space of approx. 35ft L × 45ft wide & 10ft high ceilings. This particular room has a dedicated space just for the audio system (exactly as ours), then approx 10ft after the dinning area along with the kitchen towards the back, and extra office space towards the far right. Whereas, with our room it's nearly similar, system in dedicated space alongside long wall facing width, then about 15ft after the dinning area, with office space on far left, and our kitchen located on the far right.
The beauty of these two very similar room layouts, is the open plan that allows the system to breathe freely and not get congested in any way whatsoever. No overhang, no boom, nothing echoes, just crystal clear tunes in full spec.
His system comprises:
Preamp- VAC pre
Power amps- VAC 200w monoblocks
Digital gear- Esoteric K05XS
Analog rig, TT- Rega RP10 (with Sound Smith cart).
Phono-preamp: Allnic (tube phonostage).
Speakers: ML Ren15a
Cables & interconnects- full loom of Nordost Frey2 and Tyr2 cables.
So it was very exciting to audition this, since nearly every aspect of the system was pretty much similar to mine! The only difference being the ML hybrid stats. To cut a long long story short... the main reason was the owner was wanting this particular CD (attached pic) and it wasn't available any longer. Merely because it's on a FIM label, and since FIM closed up, these ones are very rare. So he got in touch and the rest is history in the making.
I took along this CD and the opening track on Bolera was superb! Then came the second track and even better with superb bass lines. Those first notes on the percussion marching tune then later picks up in full swing, followed by some serious bass lines on track 2, is just outstanding!
Obviously the LF is deeper than the stat panel on the CLX's but both provide plenty of LF detail.
The controls on the back panel of the Ren15a's do help by a significant margin, to fine/tune balance out the LF response. Otherwise the LF thump can be overbearing, and that is something you don't want especially in an open plan layout.
Later during the evening, he made a trip back to our place and as you can tell from the time, left only around 4am. We were quite mesmerised by the overall presentation of the CLX's without subs or any other added LF devices... although the bass wasn't as deep as the dual 15inch drivers in the Ren15a's (Obviously not) the overall speed and agility in the bass was what kept us fully engaged. When a particular LF note is called upon, it hammers down well deep enough with precision and bullet speed. This is something I miss from large cones, the physics is obviously different. OTOH, smaller drivers like those with 8inch towers would be able to deliver better speed. When tuned in correctly with the perfect blend of crossover units and DSP, it actually sounds marvellous! Why I term them as "formidable" is simply due to the fact that the Ren15a's are capable of some serious wallop! In just about the right room size, they are truly awesome. You really don't require the Neoliths unless you had a very large room. So I would be looking at something much larger than 40ft L & 50ft going across, probably 10ft ceilings would be fine but definitely much larger space. The Neoliths need serious space to breathe, I seriously don't think dedicated listening rooms would do it, rather larger halls and open plans suit these huge stats. The ones I audition in Spore driven with CJ's ART150 are setup in this way, and they're awe-inspiring.
So we really enjoyed both listening sessions, I was in awe of those fine VAC monoblocks. They have a cool feature with their output tubes. If one's going weak or bad, that particular tube LED lights up, stating it's ready for a change. That's extra circuitry I guess that CJ simply doesn't want to divulge in. They always keep their circuits as simple as possible using the highest quality parts available. I guess they have their reasons.
Anyway, it was a real pleasure to experience another ML stat system placed in an open plan living room with perfect acoustic balance, where the musical presence is fully engaging and you are totally immersed in the performance. I guess that's why I was over there till about 9pm, and he spent upto 4am over here.
Since the rest of the household was asleep, we really didn't even open up the levels that much, goes to show you can still enjoy the music with a perfect sense of balance, just like focusing a camera lense.
Cheers maties, a big woofty woof!!!
Enjoy those fine tunes!
RJ
Attachments
I'm really pleased you enjoyed your time with the 15As. One question - were the speakers located quite close to the rear wall - the one behind the speakers? I believe that 3-6 ft forward of this wall is probably optimum. More than that can be disastrous, as it is in my own large open-plan room. I bought 13As intending them to replace 17 year old Avantgarde Uno speakers, but by everyone's experience, the old Unos sounded appreciably better. I've since put this down to their location - and sold the 13As at a big loss!
G'day HH,
Yes I'm fully aware of your ML episode... but that's simply because your room is quite large, open and an unusual layout. Almost oval shaped in nature.
The Ren15a's were exactly 6ft away from the rear wall, pretty much the same I've got the CLX's placed as well. However, main differences are distance apart and listening position- Ren15a's are 9ft apart, slightly toed in & listening position is around 12ft. It's a well laid out setting and was done by the very same team that attended to my place. So they knew exactly what they were doing.
He's just about to finalise on a full Tyr2 Nordost loom, wants every cable to match. I guess that's a good thing. Perhaps I could get those Frey2 interconnects off him.
Cheers mate, I'm off to get some rest.
Best, RJ
Yes I'm fully aware of your ML episode... but that's simply because your room is quite large, open and an unusual layout. Almost oval shaped in nature.
The Ren15a's were exactly 6ft away from the rear wall, pretty much the same I've got the CLX's placed as well. However, main differences are distance apart and listening position- Ren15a's are 9ft apart, slightly toed in & listening position is around 12ft. It's a well laid out setting and was done by the very same team that attended to my place. So they knew exactly what they were doing.
He's just about to finalise on a full Tyr2 Nordost loom, wants every cable to match. I guess that's a good thing. Perhaps I could get those Frey2 interconnects off him.
Cheers mate, I'm off to get some rest.
Best, RJ
Anyone have experience with The Chord Company Epic X shielded speaker cables, and especially paired with ML latest Electrostats? I borrowed home a pair over the weekend and I believe I can hear some improvement in the sound. The sound is somewhat more smooth letting the Peachtree Nova 500 signature sound come more to its right. Current I am running Supra Ply 3.4 cables, 12 gauge, budget copper cables. In Comparison Epic X carries 12 gauge Oxygen free copper, silver coated, and is priced ca USD 100 per meter, so in technical ambition they are a clear step up. Thankful for any advice/input on these specific cables or The Chord Company in general.
G'day Knife,
That's quite interesting, always good to get a positive result when changing over cables.
What I've found with cables over the years, is apart from system synergy, which is an important aspect of cable matching, they must remain as neutral as possible. Allowing more of the music to flow, you will hear more of the recording at a certain level of transparency.
Of course it's not possible to achieve perfect neutrality and absolute naturalness off the recording, simply because there are far too many variables that are not perfected in the recording to begin with. However, there's a point of near naturalness that we can achieve through careful component matching and proper cabling solutions. Once that near naturalness is achieved it's a marvellous thing. Going further to achieve the ultimate can sometimes actually ruin it. It's better to enjoy it whiles it's as close as possible. That's about the point I'm at with my system, going any further would seem pointless to me at least.
Hope those Chord cables work out well.
Cheers, RJ
That's quite interesting, always good to get a positive result when changing over cables.
What I've found with cables over the years, is apart from system synergy, which is an important aspect of cable matching, they must remain as neutral as possible. Allowing more of the music to flow, you will hear more of the recording at a certain level of transparency.
Of course it's not possible to achieve perfect neutrality and absolute naturalness off the recording, simply because there are far too many variables that are not perfected in the recording to begin with. However, there's a point of near naturalness that we can achieve through careful component matching and proper cabling solutions. Once that near naturalness is achieved it's a marvellous thing. Going further to achieve the ultimate can sometimes actually ruin it. It's better to enjoy it whiles it's as close as possible. That's about the point I'm at with my system, going any further would seem pointless to me at least.
Hope those Chord cables work out well.
Cheers, RJ
Good evening Big Dog.
True that! There is a sayin - cables / wires / cords can never add only extract (if they are of poor quality, or not matched correctly). Therefor one should find a cable that is neutral, and "disappears into the shadows", letting other components in your system shine: i.e. your amplifier and/or speakers. I think the Chords Epic X is a decent answer to above equation. Moreover, I needed 7m x 2 as my amplifier and all other tech-gear stands in my office next to the living room / listening room. So I had to find something that wasn't to pricy, hence, something of a work horse, budget, but still with reasonable good spec. and performing.
Cheers
True that! There is a sayin - cables / wires / cords can never add only extract (if they are of poor quality, or not matched correctly). Therefor one should find a cable that is neutral, and "disappears into the shadows", letting other components in your system shine: i.e. your amplifier and/or speakers. I think the Chords Epic X is a decent answer to above equation. Moreover, I needed 7m x 2 as my amplifier and all other tech-gear stands in my office next to the living room / listening room. So I had to find something that wasn't to pricy, hence, something of a work horse, budget, but still with reasonable good spec. and performing.
Cheers
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