MSB Renderer v2 in the house!

[Kingsrule]

my new Renderer for my MSB Select II will ship to me tomorrow.

my plan would be to set up my 30 terabyte NAS and the SGM 'both' as Roon Core and compare the 2. talking to my son, likely the NAS will need an extra small (but not pretty) powerful Linux box for the Roon Core to give it plenty of speed (to handle hirez especially dsd), and in a couple of months there will be the Evo spec upgrade for the SGM too.

may the best Roon core 'home' win!

Alex told me my current NAS should be sufficient with some extra ram. my Son, after looking over the Roon website, thought it better adding a separate box to hit the performance levels needed. the NAS box internal upgrade (or even a different NAS box) approach would involve compromises. I need to connect my son and Alex to get the right solution.

once it's all in place i'll experiment with network cables and interfaces. the NAS is upstairs with a 35' CAT5 (CAT6a?) cable connecting through a conduit to the SGM/MSB location in my listening room.

Why would u use the NAS as a core? Noisy environment. Bad plan.
Get a Nucleus+ and use that as the Roon core to start with. I'm sure the SGM ,when Roon ready, will ultimately be the way to go for u with the MSB v2 renderer.

 

[spiritofmusic]

I’m completely at a loss as to how this tiny renderer can make the SGM surplus to requirements.

 

[Pb Blimp]

I’m completely at a loss as to how this tiny renderer can make the SGM surplus to requirements.

The theory goes USB << ethernet direct to I2S for lots of reasons. Better clocking (close to DAC), less noise (packet mess), and grounding are a few. The proof is in the pudding. Looking forward to mine arriving.

 

[spiritofmusic]

So, small is good, yes?

 

[asiufy]

Why would u use the NAS as a core? Noisy environment. Bad plan.
Get a Nucleus+ and use that as the Roon core to start with. I'm sure the SGM ,when Roon ready, will ultimately be the way to go for u with the MSB v2 renderer.

Hmm.. Have you tried a similar setup with an MSB DAC w/ Renderer input? I did.
Nucleus can't handle my collection, and will likely balk at Mike's. It is completely underpowered. Sorry.
As I said above, a dedicated server next to the NAS, like the Innuos (or the Nucleus, if you must), would add complexity but could prove to be better. I just advised Mike to try both ways, server+NAS or NAS directly.
The SGM is already Roon Ready. Again, I did suggest Mike try both, Roon Core on NAS and Roon Core on SGM, and pick the winner the way he's always done, by listening.

 

[asiufy]

I’m completely at a loss as to how this tiny renderer can make the SGM surplus to requirements.

The DAC is not physically bound to a transport, like it traditionally is via SPDIF, Coax or even USB. Network changes everything, that's why I suggested Mike try different things, which is what I've been doing.
The SGM might as well sound better than a NAS in the end, but this certainly is not a given, like it is with USB.

 

[Kingsrule]

How big is your collection?

 

[asiufy]

21500 albums and growing.

 

[Pb Blimp]

my new Renderer for my MSB Select II will ship to me tomorrow.

my plan would be to set up my 30 terabyte NAS and the SGM 'both' as Roon Core and compare the 2. talking to my son, likely the NAS will need an extra small (but not pretty) powerful Linux box for the Roon Core to give it plenty of speed (to handle hirez especially dsd), and in a couple of months there will be the Evo spec upgrade for the SGM too.

may the best Roon core 'home' win!

Alex told me my current NAS should be sufficient with some extra ram. my Son, after looking over the Roon website, thought it better adding a separate box to hit the performance levels needed. the NAS box internal upgrade (or even a different NAS box) approach would involve compromises. I need to connect my son and Alex to get the right solution.

once it's all in place i'll experiment with network cables and interfaces. the NAS is upstairs with a 35' CAT5 (CAT6a?) cable connecting through a conduit to the SGM/MSB location in my listening room.

Mike,

I have been looking at these units to feed my new MSB Renderer that are optimized as roon cores and low noise but also have ethernet isolation. This isolation, low noise environment and roon horsepower/optimization seem like the perfect solution for the MSB Renderer.

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?24608-Suggestions-SOTA-Ethernet-Server-for-a-DAC-Renderer&highlight=sota

The newest Innuos Statement and Antipodes CX have my attention.

From Antipodes:

Direct Ethernet means the CX has two Ethernet ports. Connect one to the network for setup and remote control purposes. Connect the second Ethernet port direct to an EX or an Ethernet input on a DAC using a short high quality Ethernet cable. The direct link cuts out noise from the rest of the network and benefits from the very low-noise environment of the CX.

From Innuos:

Dual Ethernet Ports for LAN and Streamer with isolation transformers

 

[Kingsrule]

How much storage space are the 21500 taking?

 

[asiufy]

I know this is not what a "big bad dealer" would do, but I'd suggest to start with the two little devices I recommended above ($200 each), before putting a lot of money on a beefy server for network use. As long as the NAS is elsewhere in the house, not in the same circuit as your system (like at Mike's or here in the store) it should sound pretty good.


Just sayin'...

 

[asiufy]

How much storage space are the 21500 taking?

18Tb and counting.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

The DAC is not physically bound to a transport, like it traditionally is via SPDIF, Coax or even USB. Network changes everything, that's why I suggested Mike try different things, which is what I've been doing.
The SGM might as well sound better than a NAS in the end, but this certainly is not a given, like it is with USB.

at the end of the day, i'm expecting that the SGM, and especially the Evo spec upgraded SGM, will take things the furthest with the renderer. but I will give alternatives their opportunity. i want to make sure the alternatives have a fair chance. the question is will 'band aiding' the NAS take it far enough? or will a powerful booster box as my son suggests give it a better chance. and maybe the power supplies of any booster box need to be switched to LPS's. i know i'm out of my depth here, but if the NAS is marginal in it's power (as my son surmises) then what will i learn from trying it?

or maybe i should just not worry about it and just stick with the SGM and move along. hard to imagine any other device can compete with the SGM as a Roon core host. they can just approach it somewhat.

 

[Kingsrule]

Must have a lot of DSD cd's.
I have a QNAP TS871, i7, 16gb ram, 8x 6tB hd's. Tried core on it....it wasn't good. Nucleus+ with 16gb ram much better.

 

[Pb Blimp]

So, small is good, yes?

I think it depends on the application....

 

[Mike Lavigne]

18Tb and counting.

i'm somewhere between 17 and 19 Tb (12,000 albums), but i have lots of high rez including a few hundred each of dxd and Quad dsd albums which eat space big time.......and need lots of speed.

 

[paul79]

I am pretty impressed what a NAS does in my system with the Totaldac Server. I noticed great improvements using SSD's in the NAS of course, a linear supply to run it, as well as optimizing the NAS as much as possible, turning off apps, functions, and such.

 

[asiufy]

Mike (and all),

It is very much possible for the SGM to be better, even considerably so. But part of the fun of this hobby is to experiment with new things, and this is a perfect scenario, where experimentation can actually be done on the cheap, since you already have some of the requisite gear. Doesn't happen that often, does it?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike (and all),

It is very much possible for the SGM to be better, even considerably so. But part of the fun of this hobby is to experiment with new things, and this is a perfect scenario, where experimentation can actually be done on the cheap, since you already have some of the requisite gear. Doesn't happen that often, does it?

no it doesn't. just hard to know what is minimal to make sure that the NAS has the power by itself to show what it's potential is without the SGM. that's where your feel and experience and my son's techie views will have to guide me. if i have a problem it will be my son's to solve. so he tends to overkill the spec so i don't bother him (why we have a mirroring 30tb NAS in the house so he knows the back up is solid......already saved him once when the Russkie hackers corrupted my last NAS).

 

[Pb Blimp]

Ya, I have fiber optics coming into my room with a custom LPS feeding the media converter in an EMi shileded box by the DAC. Its gunna be fun doing comparos.

I know this is not what a "big bad dealer" would do, but I'd suggest to start with the two little devices I recommended above ($200 each), before putting a lot of money on a beefy server for network use. As long as the NAS is elsewhere in the house, not in the same circuit as your system (like at Mike's or here in the store) it should sound pretty good.


Just sayin'...

As indicated I have isolated the electrical noise in my home network from my room by using fiber optics to convey the network signal with light not electricity. (It is my understanding based an many comparisons on CA this is superior to inline ethernet filters.) My comparo will be to see if the media converter which converts light back to electricity for the last ethernet leg to the dac creates noise that can be cleaned up by the isolated ethernet ports of a server, but, more importantly, my comparo will be to see if a roon core optimized for low noise, processing headroom and grounding will be superior to the nas as a roon core.